Ok, why do YOU hate the cops... - Page 14

**sordavie** · 11-07-2007, 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekyE

I remembered the worst run-in I've ever had with a cop so I figured Id post it.

I've never really had much contact with the police and when I do it's generally positive, but I have a similar story. We average about 130 inches of snow up here in central NY during the winters, and I'm sometimes pretty terrible about leaving my headlights on. So, one night I walk back to my car which is parked a few blocks from campus and I happened to have left the headlights on, draining the battery. It's freezing outside--like negative 5 with wind chill--with about a foot of snow on the ground and still falling. The area where I'm parked at isn't the safest area. We're always getting emails from the university about students getting mugged on and near campus. It seems to happen very often--like four or five times a month. I call triple A since it was my first year here and I didn't really know anyone who could come help me. A university police cruiser shows up and the officer asks me what I'm up to, since I'm just sitting in my car on the side of the road at midnight-ish. He had circled around two or three times prior and I guess he got suspicious. I tell him my battery is dead and ask if he can give me a jump start. He replies, "I can't help you. If you were on university property two blocks up I could" and leaves. He left so quickly that I didn't even get a chance to ask him whether he'd give me a jump if I got out and pushed my car on to school property. It took an hour and a half for triple A to show up.

A similar thing happened to me in a parking lot in Queens, NY, but with a better conclusion. It was also late at night, around 2am, and during the winter--but without the snow--and my battery died because I had left the headlights on. Triple A tells me that it'll take 2 hours for a guy to show up. A NYC police cruiser shows up soon after I made the call to triple A and the two officers inside park a bit aways from me and open up a bag of food--I guess a midnight snack or maybe dinner. They spot me and drive over, asking me if I need any help. I explain the situation to them and they volunteer to give me a jump start. Within ten minutes I'm merrily on my way home.

**CingularDuality** · 11-07-2007, 06:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheFeniX

Are you serious? Was it a county cop?

Nope, a city cop. And I've had exactly the opposite experience as you in that regard. City cops and state patrol are the ones that have always issued me speeding tickets, while the county cops are the ones that have just given me warnings. All of them have been decently professional.

**MONKERZ** · 11-07-2007, 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CingularDuality

Nope, a city cop. And I've had exactly the opposite experience as you in that regard. City cops and state patrol are the ones that have always issued me speeding tickets, while the county cops are the ones that have just given me warnings. All of them have been decently professional.

That must be because you're just a nice, polite, professional lad, when you're not around us TG members.

**CingularDuality** · 11-07-2007, 08:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MONKERZ

That must be because you're just a nice, polite, professional lad, when you're not around us TG members.

Yeah, pretty much.

**Gambit7** · 11-08-2007, 03:45 PM

Magnum my friend... boy you opened up a can o' worms on this one! LoL
I feel intimately connected with this thread in a way because I'm friends with a former chief of police as well as a District Attorney in New York... I get told cop stories all the time.

My personal biggest problem with police is that they think they're above having common sense. And when they forget to USE this common sense, they end up either getting themselves or other people killed. Just recently a cop around here (Magnum, this is a story similar to yours) decides he would BY HIMSELF try to jump some characters behind a convenience store in a bad neighborhood. The people in this neighborhood are very poor, usually drugged-out and are better off left alone IMO. Anyways, the cop assaults this man after sneaking up on him and when the man proceeds to beat the cop's ass for being such a dumbarse (you cant just sneak up on people and proceed to assault them - badge or no badge), the cop promptly whips out his 9mm and assassinates him. The man had no weapon on him, no priors... just a dead-beat in a back-alley basically.

The most this cop will see is a suspension, when most folk would either get 15+ years for manslaughter or murder. This cop instigated a bad and violent situation which he concluded by killing a man - very very bad police-work. And this kind of thing happens ALL THE TIME around here. It never seems like such a big deal though because the PDs all claim self-defense or resisting arrest, etc. In the end, it simply equates to bad policing which helps create loss of life.

My brother unfortunately has run-ins with the law from time to time. He's not a bad person at all and has really never done anything wrong. He just is in the wrong places at the wrong time, kind of blissfully unaware.

Anyways, one time he got stuff planted in his car by a cop and the cop tried to extort money from him in the form of a "fine." My brother is an idiot, he paid it and still went to jail. Granted, he had a roach in the ashtray.... but that's ridiculous.

Another time, my brother was in his car at a convenience store with his friends when a cop decided he'd give them trouble for no reason. The cop persistently tried to escalate the situation and my brother just used witty comebacks to stave him off (cops hate wittyness). Eventually, the cop tried to sick a K-9 shepherd on my brother (trying to scare him). Welp, (laugh) my brother is basically "The Dog Whisperer" and has an uncanny knack with dogs. I have no idea how he does this stuff, he's just that good (and it's not his profession or even his hobby). So, the cop gets the dog out and tries to harass my brother with it and my brother turns on his Beastmaster skills. The dog ends up ignoring the cop and befriending my brother, licking him all over, tail-waggin etc. The cop was so mystified and pissed-off at the same time, that he just let them all go.

I could go on and on with stories. Fact of the matter is, everyone knows the justice system is broken in this country. So it's not surprising we see officers that just reflect that. I have nothing against cops, actually I admire them. I've hung out with them even on the job. BUT, the percentage of "bad cops" is just way too high IMO. It reflects a broken admissions system and borked training. In that regard, I dont blame the cop... I blame the system.

**TheFeniX** · 11-08-2007, 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CingularDuality

Nope, a city cop. And I've had exactly the opposite experience as you in that regard. City cops and state patrol are the ones that have always issued me speeding tickets, while the county cops are the ones that have just given me warnings. All of them have been decently professional.

We seem to be on a different level here. My only moving violation was given to me by a Highway Patrolman. That didn't matter: I messed up and broke the law. His job was to give me a citation based upon his discretion. That doesn't affect my perception of an officer at all, provided the ticket was written for something I actually did.

The officer who wrote me the ticket was polite and professional during the whole process. In fact, we had a fairly long conversation (after he wrote the ticket because I refuse to kiss ass to get out of a ticket) about the Columbus Library (he was based out of Columbus, TX and was in town for a court date further South of Rosenberg). We happen to both know the Head Librarian up there. After our conversation, he said he felt bad about issuing the citation. I told him not to worry about it as I'd just take Defensive Driving.

Anyways, I'll never fault an officer for doing his job, even if I happen to be the target at that point in time. I WILL fault him for not doing his job as a professional. In my experience, County Cops immediately put me on edge, and I wouldn't say I'll go out of my way to make their job harder, but I damn sure won't be as forthcoming as I would with a State Trooper or city cop. Yes, that's a bad generalization to make, I'll admit that, but people's perceptions are colored by their interactions with a group. I'm sure there's more than enough good County Cops out there. I just happen to have only run into one of them in my short life.

**CingularDuality** · 11-08-2007, 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gambit7

Just recently a cop around here (Magnum, this is a story similar to yours) decides he would BY HIMSELF try to jump some characters behind a convenience store in a bad neighborhood. The people in this neighborhood are very poor, usually drugged-out and are better off left alone IMO. Anyways, the cop assaults this man after sneaking up on him and when the man proceeds to beat the cop's ass for being such a dumbarse (you cant just sneak up on people and proceed to assault them - badge or no badge), the cop promptly whips out his 9mm and assassinates him. The man had no weapon on him, no priors... just a dead-beat in a back-alley basically.

See, the ignorance and bias in what you wrote right here is why there's such a perception of cop hating. Most people are simply ignorant of what a cop has to do and when a cop must use deadly force. Accusing police of "assassinating" criminals is just the icing on the cake.

freekyE · 11-08-2007, 05:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CingularDuality

See, the ignorance and bias in what you wrote right here is why there's such a perception of cop hating. Most people are simply ignorant of what a cop has to do and when a cop must use deadly force. Accusing police of "assassinating" criminals is just the icing on the cake.

Here you go again blindly defending someone about something you know nothing about simply because hes a cop.

You want to talk ignorance and bias? Try working fast food for 3 days. People treat you like trash no matter what you do.

The bottom line is: No one deserves automatic respect. Everyone has to earn it. If you cant accept that, youre probly not the type of person who deserves it. If you want a shoulder to cry on about it, go home to momma.

Switch · 11-08-2007, 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CingularDuality

See, the ignorance and bias in what you wrote right here is why there's such a perception of cop hating. Most people are simply ignorant of what a cop has to do and when a cop must use deadly force. Accusing police of "assassinating" criminals is just the icing on the cake.

A police officer has a responsibility to approach each and every situation with the intent of deescalating it. If the story is true, and an officer runs head long into a fight that he started, any subsequent use of deadly force is suspect. There's nothing ignorant or baised in such an observation. The real question is did that scenario happen as described.

**CingularDuality** · 11-08-2007, 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekyE

Here you go again blindly defending someone about something you know nothing about simply because hes a cop.

You want to talk ignorance and bias? Try working fast food for 3 days. People treat you like trash no matter what you do.

I'd love to know which part of my post defended the officer. And what makes you think I haven't worked fast food? And what does ignorance and bias have to do with being treated like crap while working at a fast food joint?

You seem to just want to chime in to accuse me of blindly defending cops, which I don't do. I'm trying to make people realize that there's ALWAYS more to the story than what you get in the media, or in forums like this.

I'm not saying you're dumb or bad, just that you're ignorant. I'd like to lessen your ignorance on this subject. It's clear that Magnum and Pickle don't have the patience to try to break things down and say them over and over, but, for now, I'm willing to do that here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Switch

There's nothing ignorant or baised in such an observation. The real question is did that scenario happen as described.

There's nothing biased in saying that a cop assassinated somebody when he was on a call and in a fight? There's nothing ignorant about saying that criminals in a bad neighborhood are just better left alone?

The real question is what else happened that wasn't said in that story. Why was the officer called to that location? Why did he initiate contact? Why would an officer ask for backup to simply get a loiterer to move along? How big was the suspect? How big was the cop? What did the suspect say before starting the fight? At any time during the fight, did the suspect try to take control of the cop's gun, spray, baton, or taser? Heck, was the officer in uniform? How, exactly, did the officer initiate contact (assault) with the suspect? Was it light or dark? Who else was there before, during, and after the fight?

I could go on and on about all the variables that we would need to know before we, as armchair QBs, could even begin to have a rational discussion about whether the decision that cop made to shoot that person was a good one or not. The story that Gambit posted has little information of any real value, other than to incite an emotional response.

**Gambit7** · 11-08-2007, 07:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CingularDuality

See, the ignorance and bias in what you wrote right here is why there's such a perception of cop hating. Most people are simply ignorant of what a cop has to do and when a cop must use deadly force. Accusing police of "assassinating" criminals is just the icing on the cake.

You're right with a few things here in that I did state the facts a bit wrongly (I just went and re-checked the story). Turns out the cop was investigating a robbery (but still alone in a bad neighborhood) and had this guy and his friends lined up against a wall in a back alleyway (wrong place at the wrong time scenario), indeed they had nothing to do with the robbery supposedly. Things get fuzzy with this story now. Somehow, things got out of hand (verbal dispute) and they started beating-up the cop. Another report says the cop had the deceased in a headlock (either before or after the cop was assaulted) and then shot him in the arm. Another says the deceased was simply shot while he was on the ground (assassination style). Yet another report claims that the police tried to dispose of the body before an autopsy was performed.

The cop's only injuries were a few cuts and scrapes and supposedly a human bite mark.

My point still remains though. Nothing is worth shooting someone over unless your life is truly in danger, and if proper procedure (and courtesy) is used most of the time things like this wouldnt happen. I'd bet the farm this whole incident is simply to do with the typical macho cop getting into a verbal altercation with "suspects" he's got pinned up against the wall... he somehow pisses the suspects off enough for he or them to escalate it physically, then the officer feels "threatened." bang bang... man is dead.

I am agreed there needs to be more details about this case. But, honestly... it doesnt smell very clean.

**CingularDuality** · 11-08-2007, 08:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gambit7

My point still remains though. Nothing is worth shooting someone over unless your life is truly in danger, and if proper procedure (and courtesy) is used most of the time things like this wouldnt happen.

Bad things would certainly happen less often (I don't know about "most of the time"...), but that's not what I understood the point of your story to be, though.

Quote:

I am agreed there needs to be more details about this case. But, honestly... it doesnt smell very clean.

Police interactions that are reported by the media are hardly ever written to smell clean. Hinting at poor police decisions sells papers, praising good cops does not.

freekyE · 11-09-2007, 01:24 AM

Cing, I know you're mostly playing devil's advocate, but understand....this thread is about how cops hate civvies and they think they're under appreciated or disrespected. Has been from the start. Its misrepresented and I think that this type of thread implemented any other way would've been locked and forgotten a long time ago here at TG.

This was a troll thread from the start and now I'm sad Ive participated in it.

Atomic Dog · 11-09-2007, 02:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CingularDuality

Police interactions that are reported by the media are hardly ever written to smell clean. Hinting at poor police decisions sells papers, praising good cops does not.

Praise is often something that is never reported, whether it be the media or otherwise. But honestly, the media isn't entirely to blame. The boys in blue do a great job of publicizing themselves as well.

**CingularDuality** · 11-09-2007, 03:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atomic Dog

But honestly, the media isn't entirely to blame. The boys in blue do a great job of publicizing themselves as well.

I disagree. Honest to goodness corruption is not often front page news for very long. "White cop shoots unarmed black man" will be on the front page for months, even if the police officer was completely justified.

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekyE

Cing, I know you're mostly playing devil's advocate, but understand....this thread is about how cops hate civvies and they think they're under appreciated or disrespected. Has been from the start. Its misrepresented and I think that this type of thread implemented any other way would've been locked and forgotten a long time ago here at TG.

I think you have it exactly backwards, my friend.

Quote:

This was a troll thread from the start and now I'm sad Ive participated in it.

Just because there are trolls in this thread, doesn't mean it's a troll thread. Magnum had a serious question. I think he just wasn't expecting the type of negative responses that were posted here. And that's fine.

11-08-2007, 03:45 PM	#200 (permalink)
Gambit7 Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Hollywood, FL Age: 31 Posts: 1,890	Re: Ok, why do YOU hate the cops... Magnum my friend... boy you opened up a can o' worms on this one! LoL I feel intimately connected with this thread in a way because I'm friends with a former chief of police as well as a District Attorney in New York... I get told cop stories all the time. My personal biggest problem with police is that they think they're above having common sense. And when they forget to USE this common sense, they end up either getting themselves or other people killed. Just recently a cop around here (Magnum, this is a story similar to yours) decides he would BY HIMSELF try to jump some characters behind a convenience store in a bad neighborhood. The people in this neighborhood are very poor, usually drugged-out and are better off left alone IMO. Anyways, the cop assaults this man after sneaking up on him and when the man proceeds to beat the cop's ass for being such a dumbarse (you cant just sneak up on people and proceed to assault them - badge or no badge), the cop promptly whips out his 9mm and assassinates him. The man had no weapon on him, no priors... just a dead-beat in a back-alley basically. The most this cop will see is a suspension, when most folk would either get 15+ years for manslaughter or murder. This cop instigated a bad and violent situation which he concluded by killing a man - very very bad police-work. And this kind of thing happens ALL THE TIME around here. It never seems like such a big deal though because the PDs all claim self-defense or resisting arrest, etc. In the end, it simply equates to bad policing which helps create loss of life. My brother unfortunately has run-ins with the law from time to time. He's not a bad person at all and has really never done anything wrong. He just is in the wrong places at the wrong time, kind of blissfully unaware. Anyways, one time he got stuff planted in his car by a cop and the cop tried to extort money from him in the form of a "fine." My brother is an idiot, he paid it and still went to jail. Granted, he had a roach in the ashtray.... but that's ridiculous. Another time, my brother was in his car at a convenience store with his friends when a cop decided he'd give them trouble for no reason. The cop persistently tried to escalate the situation and my brother just used witty comebacks to stave him off (cops hate wittyness). Eventually, the cop tried to sick a K-9 shepherd on my brother (trying to scare him). Welp, (laugh) my brother is basically "The Dog Whisperer" and has an uncanny knack with dogs. I have no idea how he does this stuff, he's just that good (and it's not his profession or even his hobby). So, the cop gets the dog out and tries to harass my brother with it and my brother turns on his Beastmaster skills. The dog ends up ignoring the cop and befriending my brother, licking him all over, tail-waggin etc. The cop was so mystified and pissed-off at the same time, that he just let them all go. I could go on and on with stories. Fact of the matter is, everyone knows the justice system is broken in this country. So it's not surprising we see officers that just reflect that. I have nothing against cops, actually I admire them. I've hung out with them even on the job. BUT, the percentage of "bad cops" is just way too high IMO. It reflects a broken admissions system and borked training. In that regard, I dont blame the cop... I blame the system. __________________

11-09-2007, 01:24 AM	#208 (permalink)
freekyE Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: indiana Posts: 1,000	Re: Ok, why do YOU hate the cops... Cing, I know you're mostly playing devil's advocate, but understand....this thread is about how cops hate civvies and they think they're under appreciated or disrespected. Has been from the start. Its misrepresented and I think that this type of thread implemented any other way would've been locked and forgotten a long time ago here at TG. This was a troll thread from the start and now I'm sad Ive participated in it.

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