Romney's Religion Speech - Page 3

**MoreGooder** · 12-08-2007, 12:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Switchcraft

Also, what do right and wrong have to do with rational thought? Rational thought is about correct and incorrect, hopefully with a dash of efficiency. I can make a rational argument supporting the execution of the homeless and the infirm, or the forced sterilization of the indigent, or even government-arranged marriage and reproduction, but that wouldn't make any of those things "right."

Here's an example of an appropriate application of rational thought to judgements of "right" and "wrong".

Many religious people think that homosexuality is immoral because it is against biblical teachings. However, they fail to consider the fact that it is completely irrational to choose homosexuality over heterosexuality. Regardless of this, christian extremists conclude that homosexuality is a choice and will result in eternal damnation. At the same time, most can't explain why a person would willingly choose certain eternal damnation, nor can they describe the day when they chose heterosexuality.

I can think of no better example of irrational "morality".

Kerostasis · 12-08-2007, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mentholated

Rather than reply to your question directly, I'm going to evade. I'm going to copy and paste something I'm too lazy to type out myself, so you can read it:

[Long article]

see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sixteen...s_Constitution

As interesting as the history of the Amendment may be, and as much as you may disagree with the reasoning under which it was passed, its still completely constitutional. So the government has every lawful right to tax your income, even if doing so is bad policy.

**MoreGooder** · 12-08-2007, 01:46 PM

Here's another example of irrational morality: Capital punishment.

Many christions believe that abortion should be constitutionally outlawed because they believe in the sanctity of life. But, amazingly, many are OK with capital punishment. At what specific age will God be less offended when a life is terminated? Why is it OK to terminate the life of a condemned man that could be one of the best christian evangilists the prision has ever had, but not OK to terminate the life of an unwanted fetus that could turn out to be a modern day Jack the Ripper or a Mother Teresa? How can anyone know another persons true convictions to the point that they can judge them as well as God can?

Frankly, I'm not OK with abortion, especially if it's merely a choice of convenience as a result of poor birth control. I am offended by capital punishment simply because mind reading isn't possible, and because there are known and documented cases where innocent people have been executed.

**CingularDuality** · 12-08-2007, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mitt

...no movement of conscience can succeed in America that cannot speak to the convictions of religious people.

He just guaranteed that I will not vote for him. That is downright scary.

Kerostasis · 12-08-2007, 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MoreGooder

Here's another example of irrational morality: Capital punishment.

Many christions believe that abortion should be constitutionally outlawed because they believe in the sanctity of life. But, amazingly, many are OK with capital punishment. At what specific age will God be less offended when a life is terminated? Why is it OK to terminate the life of a condemned man that could be one of the best christian evangilists the prision has ever had, but not OK to terminate the life of an unwanted fetus that could turn out to be a modern day Jack the Ripper or a Mother Teresa? How can anyone know another persons true convictions to the point that they can judge them as well as God can?

As strange as the "pro-capital punishment + anti-abortion" stance may be, the "pro-abortion + anti-capital punishment" stance is even more irrational. Consider that a baby is innocent, having done nothing wrong, when it is killed in an abortion, while the subjects of capital punishment have been convicted by a jury of their peers of heinous crimes against mankind.

Steeler · 12-08-2007, 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CingularDuality

He just guaranteed that I will not vote for him. That is downright scary.

Yeah, in the old days we called that a theocracy.

ScratchMonkey · 12-09-2007, 07:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MoreGooder

Many religious people think that homosexuality is immoral because it is against biblical teachings. However, they fail to consider the fact that it is completely irrational to choose homosexuality over heterosexuality.

What makes it "irrational"? This is what I meant earlier. You're leaving out presumptions that are critical to the argument. With appropriate presumptions, it's perfectly rational to "choose" to be homosexual. (Not that people actually choose their sexual preference, any more than they choose their favorite color.)

**CingularDuality** · 12-09-2007, 08:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ScratchMonkey

What makes it "irrational"? This is what I meant earlier. You're leaving out presumptions that are critical to the argument. With appropriate presumptions, it's perfectly rational to "choose" to be homosexual. (Not that people actually choose their sexual preference, any more than they choose their favorite color.)

Heh, if we're going off on this hijack, I just want to publicly state that I wish I was bisexual. How cool would it be if the number of people that sexually attracted you were doubled?

**MoreGooder** · 12-09-2007, 11:28 PM

****Edit****

Nevermind. I realize I've hyjacked the thread. I apologize. Back on topic.......

**MoreGooder** · 12-09-2007, 11:35 PM

deleted by someone who's thinking more clearly.

**CingularDuality** · 12-10-2007, 12:41 AM

Awww, man, hijacks are cool. Nobody really cares about Mitt anymore, so hijack away!

AMosely · 12-10-2007, 01:54 PM

As this thread's creator, you have my permission to hijack the thread.

For the record though, homosexuality is not a logical or moral issue. Some think it is, but it is not. It is a natural human condition, just like so many others. Only our warped minds (also apparently natural) have made it the issue that it is today.

Switchcraft · 12-13-2007, 01:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CingularDuality

Heh, if we're going off on this hijack, I just want to publicly state that I wish I was bisexual. How cool would it be if the number of people that sexually attracted you were doubled?

Well, if you're ugly, that might make life twice as frustrating...

**CingularDuality** · 12-13-2007, 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Switchcraft

Well, if you're ugly, that might make life twice as frustrating...

In that case, the amount of hawt pr0n has still increased!

mentholated · 12-16-2007, 08:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ScratchMonkey

What makes it "irrational"? This is what I meant earlier. You're leaving out presumptions that are critical to the argument. With appropriate presumptions, it's perfectly rational to "choose" to be homosexual. (Not that people actually choose their sexual preference, any more than they choose their favorite color.)

The biology of two species with the same gender (in this case we'll consider male and female humans) is incompatible, so they cannot reproduce. Therefore, it is irrational to the survival of the species, and mechanically impossible.

Yes I called them separate species. I dare any of you to contradict me. I dare you.

12-08-2007, 01:46 PM	#33 (permalink)
MoreGooder Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Saint Louis, MO Age: 42 Posts: 518	Re: Romney's Religion Speech Here's another example of irrational morality: Capital punishment. Many christions believe that abortion should be constitutionally outlawed because they believe in the sanctity of life. But, amazingly, many are OK with capital punishment. At what specific age will God be less offended when a life is terminated? Why is it OK to terminate the life of a condemned man that could be one of the best christian evangilists the prision has ever had, but not OK to terminate the life of an unwanted fetus that could turn out to be a modern day Jack the Ripper or a Mother Teresa? How can anyone know another persons true convictions to the point that they can judge them as well as God can? Frankly, I'm not OK with abortion, especially if it's merely a choice of convenience as a result of poor birth control. I am offended by capital punishment simply because mind reading isn't possible, and because there are known and documented cases where innocent people have been executed. __________________ Sometimes I feel like 2/3'rds Rice Krispies. Past "Snap" and "Crackle" but just shy of "Pop"!

12-09-2007, 11:28 PM	#39 (permalink)
MoreGooder Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Saint Louis, MO Age: 42 Posts: 518	Re: Romney's Religion Speech **Edit** Nevermind. I realize I've hyjacked the thread. I apologize. Back on topic....... __________________ Sometimes I feel like 2/3'rds Rice Krispies. Past "Snap" and "Crackle" but just shy of "Pop"!

12-09-2007, 11:35 PM	#40 (permalink)
MoreGooder Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Saint Louis, MO Age: 42 Posts: 518	Re: Romney's Religion Speech deleted by someone who's thinking more clearly. __________________ Sometimes I feel like 2/3'rds Rice Krispies. Past "Snap" and "Crackle" but just shy of "Pop"!

12-10-2007, 12:41 AM	#41 (permalink)
CingularDuality Join Date: May 2003 Location: Dallas/Ft. Worth area of Texas, USA Age: 33 Posts: 17,140	Re: Romney's Religion Speech Awww, man, hijacks are cool. Nobody really cares about Mitt anymore, so hijack away! __________________ Become a supporting member! Buy a Tactical Duck! Take the world's smallest political quiz! "I was touched by His Noodly Appendage." TacticalGamer TX LAN/BBQ Veteran:

12-10-2007, 01:54 PM	#42 (permalink)
AMosely Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Maine Age: 34 Posts: 2,793	Re: Romney's Religion Speech As this thread's creator, you have my permission to hijack the thread. For the record though, homosexuality is not a logical or moral issue. Some think it is, but it is not. It is a natural human condition, just like so many others. Only our warped minds (also apparently natural) have made it the issue that it is today.

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