birdie_in_Texas

i am so wholly ignorant of politics, i mean i am absolutely stupid about it and i am an "educated" type of "white-collar" person...it seems to me at least, that there has been no "good choice" for decades...

so what do you do when there is no "good choice"..? write in Mickey Mouse?

All i know is that it seems like we in the US are headed for a REALLY bad time of it in the upcoming future...all the politicians are thieves, there is no way to get rid of them, so what to do..?

i guess it is good that i have in-laws in Canada..when the "big one" hits, maybe i can get there alive...

you guys will laugh at this...in high school here in the smallish redneck town i lived in, we used to get stuff from the freaking KKK in our mail boxes..none of it was post marked...did not have stamps, nothing...now think about that...you know what it must "take" for something like that to happen? and that is just small town hillbilly crap...think about how unimaginable the corruption must be in a place like D.C. ? can you freakin believe what must be going on behind closed doors?

do any of you think that any of these "people" running would make things any better?

WHAT ARE WE GOING TO DO PEOPLE...?

HOW DO WE FIX THIS..?


i really do weep when i think about my 6-yr old being an older person and how things will likely be when her kids have kids....maybe someone dropping the big daddy would actually be a better thing somehow, although i cannot imagine that future...

i am making myself sick thinking about this..i need to go home and jump on the CoD4 server and take out some aggression...

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[tR]Greasy_mullet

[quote=ParkBench;884918]Fascism is extreme rightism, further than Conservatism. McCain is a Reagan Moderate, and W a fascist.
QUOTE]

Actually you just hit on my pet peev as Fascism is a leftist political idiology. Its to the right of communism but extreme left in every other regard. If you look at the policy that Hitlary, Obama, Edwards, and their like are pushing, they are almost identical to that which Fascist Italy and Germany were pushing. Even many quotes of those leaders then and the DNC leaders today are very very similar.

How the right got the label baffels me because it is the anti Fascist in every possible way. Though far too many have taken up Fascist policy like Bush, McCain, and others just like them. I believe the leftist of the 1940's wanted to cover up for their fellow leftist so since its to the right of communism they simply said its a rightist political idea which is semi true because its to the right of what they believe. What better way to slander your enimies than to attempt to link them to the greastest mass murderer of the time... the only problem way they did not know Stalin was even worse and therfor could not pass the buck on him as well once the truth of their Meca came to light.

Now I am a Republican but a Conservative. I agree with a majority of the Libertarian positions because I believe in personal freedom as long as that Freedom does not hurt other people. Thats why I believe in allowing Drugs and people to do what they want in their bedrooms with consenting adults but am against Abortion, and their opposition to the war.

ParkBench

Actually, no... Fascism is extreme Rightism, Communism is extreme Leftism. Fascism and Communism ARE in some ways alike, thus creating a full circle of ideology.

communism -- socialism -- liberalism (a million isms) conservatism -- and way to the right -- fascism.

What some democrats are pushing is a form of socialism.

W has made himself a cult of personality. The Dept of Home Land Security is growing the size of the federal government. the Patriot act is growing the federal government. The Founding of the Republican party is based on smalled Federal government.

I think some wikipedia, and some Ron Paul should be in your future, man...

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mentholated

Facism, Communism, Democrat, Republican.

They're just words for enslavement.

[tR]Greasy_mullet

Sorry man but simply look it up. I know the line of Fascism has been said to be extreme right but it is simply not true. The right and Fascism have NOTHING in common while the left and communism are almost identical. Please point to me one single policy the right (Not Bush or McCain) advocates that is Fascist. You would have a REALLY hard doing so because there is not a single one. On the other hand almost every single policy that Clinton, Obama, etc hold is Fascist. Their Heath program is almost idential to that of Nazi Germany. Their heavy handed regulations of business through environmental policy and other similar medeling is through massive regualtion is FASCISM!

Even so called Minority programs are just a different spin to fascist policy. Instead of openly hurting a minority, they simply do it in a different way with programs like Affirmative Action which actually belittle, insult, and hold back so called Minorities.

So please take the time to actually look up Fascism.

Doktor Goku

I heard Nazis!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reductio_ad_Hitlerum

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_Law

(No, I didn't actually read the context in which Hitler/Nazis were mentioned... but this is still funny. :P )

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Doc-in-training

Kerostasis

In order to get Fascism, Socialism, Liberalism, and Conservatism all on the same scale, you really have to add another dimension. Its not particularly accurate to say that Fascism and Communism are simply to the "right" or "left" of what we see as Liberal and Conservative here. They're kind of off in another direction entirely. You have to go at least 2-D if not 3-D to properly illustrate the whole political continuum.

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CingularDuality

Indeed, the political spectrum is an argument all by itself. But on a simple single axis spectrum, fascism is indeed just further to the right from conservatism.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_spectrum

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ScratchMonkey

Kero has it right. For those wondering how to position various ideologies on a 1-D scale, it's impossible. Instead, try the "diamond chart":

http://www.theadvocates.org/quiz.html

Fascism and communism will be at the bottom point of the diamond, with their focus (but not their objective) slightly to either side of the nadir.

While the Republicans may claim to be the "Grand Old Party", the Democrats predate them, going back to the beginning of the Republic. At that time, they were essentially the same as today's Libertarian Party, but were usurpsed in the beginning of the 20th century by politically-savvy Socialists. It would seem those same Socialists have now usurped the Republican Party in the same way, leaving those advocating liberty no large party to align with. Ron Paul alludes to this in the video linked above. He points out that the Republican platform has turned its back on its "traditional" values of liberty and fiscal responsibility, leaving him the only original Republican in a now-Socialist party.

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Steeler

That's some impressive spin on the part of Paul.

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Gambit7

If Democracy and Communism actually existed I'd say a lot of the arguments in this thread are valid. Fact is, they're governmental theories, not Reality.

Our current form of govt. is Federalism (which sux btw and is designed for an illiterate Mob). The only true Communisms that exist are small communal "hippy" tribes, and they themselves only exist under other forms of govt. i.e. they're not immune to their laws.

In closing, the only real way to reform our govt. is to destroy it and start again with a TRUE Democracy, not a Federalist govt. The govt. only job should be to enact and enforce legislation, and that's it... i.e. lawyers + judicial + security. Everything else gets handled and voted on by the Public. The only way this will happen is a 2nd Revolution, which would probably come by way of technology rather than brute force.

I'm of a Revolutionary mind, therefore the candidate I vote for will be the one that I think will shake things up the most in Washington (regardless of anything else, including experience or even their stance on many issues... they must be "viable" though).

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ScratchMonkey

True democracy is where 51% of the mob gets to plunder the other 49%. You can see it in action in the classic Twilight Zone episode, "The Monsters are Due on Maple Street".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Mon...n_Maple_Street

The purpose of the US Constitution was to temper strict democracy with limitations that protect individual rights. It's supposed to limit the FedGov to protecting individuals from Federal, State and foreign governments, not from each other or from themselves. That's the job of the States. But through creative interpretation of things like the Commerce Clause, and by taxing and then denying funding unless the States impose the laws desired by the Fed that it can't impose itself, the Fed has largely usurped most State authority.

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Gambit7

State's rights are obsolete and just create another layer of beuracracy to go along with the Federal one. The only reason they exist was because of the original makeup of this country (which was a bunch of land given to an elite few as "rewards"), and also because of the Civil War (anyone still have any slaves?). Dont kid yourself, Constitution = multiple layers of "safe mode" beuracracy. Why do I give the analogy "Safe Mode?" Put your computer into safe mode, try to get anything done, and you'll see what I mean.

Our Constitution was written for EXACTLY the reasons I said, to protect the public from their own stupidity (assuming a stupid public). The problem with it is it assumed politicians werent dumb. 200 years ago Politicians were smart and the Public was dumb. Nowadays it's the other way around... so I say ditch the aging artifact of a document and come up with something better.

Why people still defend the Constitution is beyond me. It's an artifact, and nothing more.

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mentholated

I agree, we need to work past the models of an old world and look towards the future with a new model, within a whole new context. What that context will be, I think, is entirely up to us.

ParkBench

the right and fascism have nothing in common? extreme nationalism often accompanied by racism, and bigotry. An highly funded Military.

you want only 1? The Patriot Act! the government can pretty much do what ever they want, search, detain, deport... you name it for no reason at all.

the President is carrying out a War WITHOUT ever declaring war.

Bush and McCain are not political mirrors my friend. One is a laughing stock, and one is a military conflict (can't use the term War, it was never declared.) Hero.

man seriously, you need to look into what socialism is... and Marxist Communism.

ah CD, thank you... indeed it is no linear. but Fascism is as far right as you can go on the political spectrum.

and I offer you this... one google search away.

http://www.publiceye.org/eyes/whatfasc.html

If you want to create another ism for what the democrats are proposing, fine by me... but.. I used the term Fascism to describe the state of the current administration. And I stand by that label. Defining Fascism as the history would define.

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Official Valet Parking Attendant for the 71st. - K signed off on

impatiently waiting for another BF Pirates night.

IKARIAM
Proprietor of the TGA P Bench Pub Hosios [77:81]
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