Fenian420

Man, Religon just messes up the world..

Gillespie

Once again, it was a 2,000 year old religion he chose to insult, not a 40-year old comic book series. I understand the comparison you're attemping to make, but it's not the same level of comparison, and holds as much weight as the comparison given in the "article" of the kid tearing up a Charles Darwin text.

Atheists are hypocrites. How can they assert that a God doesn't exist? Where is the incontrovertible proof of this claim?

__________________
<ArmA Information/SOPs> <ArmA Admin Team> <TG Req. Reading>

INSUNABULA

And what would your definition of "incontrovertible proof" be my religiously minded friend?

__________________

Razcsak

Read back a page and you'll see my rationale for atheism. I won't speak for others.

I would ask, though, where your incontrovertible proof that Odin isn't the true god comes from.

__________________

Birdman1011395

Its very simple how there is no incontrovertible proof for atheist beliefs, "The absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence". (Sorry I just had to )

But the whole atheist/agnostic argument is beginning to break down into one of semantics.

I will also have to second Gillespie's criticism of the article in general. Why is it that there is only one side presented and a heavily biased side at that (the student that was punished)? I just reread the article, a majority of its facts come from Campbell from an email interview conducted by The Humanist. Could they not have gotten a response from the other parties involved, or were they not interested in a balanced article?

__________________
BF 2142:|TG| Birdman10113
CoD4: |TG|Birdman

Let's put the badges here...

ScratchMonkey

Before you can prove the nonexistence of something, you have to define what's being disproved. I've yet to see a definition of god that's either not self-contradictory (and therefore false by its own inconsistent logic) or an alias for an accepted natural phenomena (eg. the universe, nature), in which case the alias is useful only as a way to distance oneself from the pariah label of atheist.

__________________

INSUNABULA

I am an agnostic myself and to me, being an agnostic, has little to do by arguement with religious individuals or institutions Razcsak.

I believe in God - I do not believe in religion.

It is a statement, not an arguement. Religion to me is a man-made phenomena and has little or nothing to do with worshiping God, religion is an instructional course on HOW to worship God and there are quite a few 'courses' out there and all of them are based on how people "percieve" the right way of worship should be conducted.

A broad statement would be to say that those are the differences that have caused the religious wars in the past and present and even issues that are/were not religiously motivated can easily be twisted into people believing that issue is detrimental to their way of life and therefore worth 'confronting' from a religeous standpoint. But then that IS a broad statement and not by any means encompassing.

God does not 'require' us to worship Him/Her/It quite simply I'm sure it's not required for God to function properly at all. The worship of God to me means taking what God stands for - peace, kindness and compassion and taking those qualities to incorporate them into our lives.

Simply put the only way I can see how you can worship God is by infact worshiping others by being peaceful, kind and compassionate to them and by doing so you are infact worshiping God.

Perhaps that's why people say you can see God all around you because the opportunity to worship God surrounds us by the people we meet and see. That's why I say that being Agnostic isn't about arguement - it's about agreeing with religion - God exists, I agree completely but do you think God wants us to argue about semantics?

It need not be any more complicated than that.

__________________

sordavie

"Atheists are hypocrites. How can they assert that a God doesn't exist? Where is the incontrovertible proof of this claim?"

rofl. Do you even know what the word 'hypocrite' means?

__________________

Gillespie

I'm agnostic.

__________________
<ArmA Information/SOPs> <ArmA Admin Team> <TG Req. Reading>

Gillespie

Of course. Technically, its acting like you're religious when you're really not, or acting like you're not religious when you really are (more generally, it is acting in contrary to your beliefs - whatever they may be).

I used the word to describe the irony in that they blast a faith-based religion when atheist beliefs require a faith-based adherence to the absence of faith. They don't have proof. They just have... "faith".

__________________
<ArmA Information/SOPs> <ArmA Admin Team> <TG Req. Reading>

MagnaCentipede

A hippocrit is when a large river mammal pwns you with triple damage.

__________________

INSUNABULA

Calling them "hypocrites" is quite a sweeping statement to make about atheists Gillespie. They assert that God doesn't exist because we have no "incontrovertable proof" that he does in their eyes. That is a personal choice on their behalf and one that I can respect because they are exercising their gift of free-will and because it's also one that doesn't lead to any harm to me physically, mentally or to my individual faith.

If a child chose to believe the the Tooth Fairy and another child didn't, would the one who believes have the right to label the other a hypocrite because he found a dollar under his pillow?

As adults we have the luxury of looking at this and KNOWING what the truth is - but just because we have a dollar in the shape of a bible doesn't mean we have the right to call others "hypocrite" because they choose NOT to believe.

As atheists they don't need 'faith' to adhere to the absence of faith, they just need the condition of free-will.

__________________

Gillespie

Which brings us back to why the kid was suspended.

__________________
<ArmA Information/SOPs> <ArmA Admin Team> <TG Req. Reading>

ScratchMonkey

I'd be happy to believe in any god you want. But I'm an empiricist. You need to present at least as much evidence as the global warming enthusiasts are shoveling. Check out that thread to see how much controversy you can have even when you're able to measure the phenomena. (I lean very slightly in favor of believing GW, but remain highly skeptical.)

http://www.tacticalgamer.com/sandbox...ng-thread.html

__________________

Razcsak

*sigh* Assuming that something doesn't exist because you see no evidence for it is not the same as stating that there never can or will be that object. Unfortunately, atheism has taken on a pariah connotation and is frequently misunderstood by both religious and agnostic individuals. One typically misclassifies them as nihilists and the other assumed that they are firmly areligious and would refuse to believe incontrovertible proof. I wouldn't, if it were staring me in the face. I am also an atheist.

Tell me, Gillespie. Do you assert that Cthulhu doesn't exist?

__________________