Switchcraft

Leejo is currently behind enemy lines, able to slip only the occasional post through the firewall via a series of cutouts working for la resistance.

From his cell (charmingly called "a hotel room" by the regime that makes him stay there) he is able to see only a desolate patch of New Jersey, and a prison where they probably have better internet access than he currently does:



So there he is, already with no ability to read TG forums, but they go and make it worse by giving him access to the Village Voice. And so it is, gentle readers, that I bring you Leejo's latest message of wisdom:

"Hey, can you post this in the Sandbox? Thanks."

MagnaCentipede

Lots of off-topic establishment in that piece, but the half that's actually saying something is pretty good.

__________________

El_Gringo_Grande

Good writing. Doesn't really say anything.

So the guy was a "Brain Dead Liberal" he could just as easily been a "Brain Dead Conservative".

The key point he was brain dead. If brain dead you can be anything without much work.

__________________
Sen. John McCain (AZ) For President '08
---
I’m not racists, I have republican friends. Radio show host.
- "The essence of tyranny is the denial of complexity". -Jacob Burkhardt
- "A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds" - Emerson
- "People should not be afraid of it's government, government should be afraid of it's People." - Line from V for Vendetta
- If software were as unreliable as economic theory, there wouldn't be a plane made of anything other than paper that could get off the ground. Jim Fawcette

Lusitano Louco

Bad writing. Bad logic and reasoning, if any. Just bad. If you want to read something constructive read BP's comment. I didn't need to go any further. In an 8th of the words it had more depth and insight than that drawn out windbag of an article.

War.mongeR1

Sounds like someone struck a nerve. Hehe. I thought it was great. Whether one is liberal or conservative, it shouldn't have offended. Just shows their reasoning and logic for switching viewpoints. Would've been just as interesting to read about a conservative becoming liberal. In fact, one of Ronald Reagan's sons, being Ron, has a story like that. Although I have opposite viewpoints as him, his story is actually very interesting to hear. Heard him on the radio a few times.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ron_Reagan

__________________
"Common sense is not so common." -Voltaire

El_Gringo_Grande

No it doesn't. He claimed to be a liberal but:

What? Any good "thinking" liberal knows that free market economies are wonderful, especially in the abstract if you ignore the pain they cause to individuals or just count that pain as a necessary evil.

And it sounded like he worshiped JFK. What? Die hard democrats do that, not thinking liberals. Same for hating GW Bush.

The guy is a typical artsy fartsy type and is finally educating himself. Nothing more.

I guess it is somewhat interesting to read about somebody actually thinking for a change instead of just spouting crap. But not that interesting.

__________________
Sen. John McCain (AZ) For President '08
---
I’m not racists, I have republican friends. Radio show host.
- "The essence of tyranny is the denial of complexity". -Jacob Burkhardt
- "A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds" - Emerson
- "People should not be afraid of it's government, government should be afraid of it's People." - Line from V for Vendetta
- If software were as unreliable as economic theory, there wouldn't be a plane made of anything other than paper that could get off the ground. Jim Fawcette

Lusitano Louco

It didn't strike a nerve. I wasn't offended at all. The author just doesn't seem very bright and his writing is...how can I put this kindly?...nothing to write home about. I don't even live in the U.S., so Liberal to me has a whole other meaning than what he is describing.

This is a Liberal where I come from:

Adjective
1 - that enjoys giving; generous
2 - Tolerant; broad-minded
3 - espouses political, religious, economic freedom, etc.
4 - that is convenient for a free man
5 - referring to intelectual and independent profession

Substantive
1 - Politics: one that professes liberal ideals

That is by no means a bad word and any bad connotations are only attributed to it by conservatives in the U.S. and elsewhere because they are anti-change, anti-openness and so on by the very nature of their ideals. Would you be offended if someone called you tolerant? What about generous?

You don't seem to have read the comment I referred to so I'll just quote it for you:

I subscribe to this commenter's line of reasoning that all this convoluted writing and "thinking" of the author boils down to an overly simplistic ideology and imagery. The above comment sliced through the article like it wasn't even there. Guess what? It shouldn't be any surprise. There isn't much there to start with. That was my point. Pointless, vacant writing is bad writing, regardless of the principles or supposed ideas it attempts to put forth.

Switchcraft

Actually, I think the term for him now is not "brain-dead conservative" but "classical liberal."
And BP's comment is ridiculous. Note how he put "utopian" in quotes like that to create a straw-man of his own? You're right, his response pretended like the article wasn't even there, because it's written like he only skimmed it. And then BP continues in the same vein, acting as if Mamet were suddenly calling for anarchy, something demonstrably untrue.

Weak.

War.mongeR1

Woops! You're right! I didn't realize you were refering to a comment made on the given link. I thought you may have been referring to a comment made here that could have been deleted. So sorry. Now I see where you were coming from.

__________________
"Common sense is not so common." -Voltaire

Lusitano Louco

Demonstrably? If you're going to make that strong an assertion you better support it. In some passages especially that is exactly what Mamet sounds like he's doing. We have to go by what he said, not what we think he meant to say.

By the way, using quotes around utopia simply refers to the fact that this seems to be Mamet's ideal, clearly not shared by BP. Nothing more and nothing less. No straw there.

Hambergler

Village Voice is ultra liberal. That article was written by a liberal for liberals, conservatives should not be trying to intemperate it. I'm surprised their eyes aren't melting just looking at it. In fact I don't think many Dems outside of NYC are far enough in left field to get anything out of it.

__________________

Switchcraft

I "better support it"? Okay. I see nothing in that article indicating that Mamet is arguing for a world in which there are no laws. I've read the entire thing several times, I believe that JUST BY READING IT one can plainly see that Mamet makes no such argument.

As far as "utopia" goes, I don't think your sentence means what you intended. BP claims that Mamet created a straw-man liberal who wanted a totalitarian "utopia." That BP used quotes where he shouldn't have is forgivable, sure. But then you come along and say BP meant that such a utopia was Mamet's ideal? How could this be when BP plainly says that Mamet wants a world with no laws?

How about instead of using someone else's post, you come up with a criticism that actually addresses actual words and sentences in the article instead of using someone else's straw-man?

Switchcraft

Which is, I'm sure, why Leejo wanted to link it. Note what happens as soon as one gets out of lock-step with the self-proclaimed judges of tolerance? The guy lauded for Wag the Dog is accused of wanting "poisoned food."

BigGaayAl

Just because it amuses me I'll comment one one quote, in this well written piece.

"Do I speak as a member of the "privileged class"? If you will—but classes in the United States are mobile, not static, which is the Marxist view."

Oh please. Tell that to the 1 in 10 blacks behind bars. They are really a mobile class, well at least once a day, if they are not in isolation.

I'd evaluate: not less braindead, only older. This man needs to read some non-english authors. All the quoted authors except are Anglo-saxon. There is a whole world out there.

__________________
I wsih to agzoiollppie for tinpyg so mnay tpoys

This is my "depressed stance." When you're depressed, it makes a lot of difference how you stand. The worst thing you can do is straighten up and hold your head high because then you'll start to feel better. If you're going to get any joy out of being depressed, you've got to stand like this. ~Charlie Brown

Ferris Bueller

"People seldom have the ability to see beyond their own noses, infinitely less the perception to take notice of the world outside their own culture."-Nelson Mandela

The point: yeah, it'd be great if people as self indulgent as ultra-liberals or ultra-conservatives are (note the fact that all extreme left/right wing views are based on the wants of the individual rather than the society at large) could be troubled to expand their viewpoints beyond contemporary english-speaking (primarily american) authors, but its a pipe dream.

As far as the article, I perused it, simply for a good belly laugh (it is the village voice, after all), but I didnt take any stock in it. Gentlemen, wrest the tempers from your steel grips lest we make mountains out of molehills. It's an article written by a man claiming to no longer be "brain dead" in his politcal views. How seriously can you take something that was written from this perspective?

__________________
|TG-6th|Ferris Bueller