War.mongeR1

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23656496

Please read the article, as it is a glimpse as to the violence that's been ruining the border for years now. It's truly sad.

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"Common sense is not so common." -Voltaire

El_Gringo_Grande

Or we could just legalize and regulate those evil drugs.

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Sen. John McCain (AZ) For President '08
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I’m not racists, I have republican friends.
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"The essence of tyranny is the denial of complexity". -Jacob Burkhardt
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"A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds" - emerson
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"People should not be afraid of it's government, government should be afraid of it's People." - Line from V for Vendetta

Atomic Dog

But then what would we do with all those well armed and overly paid DEA agents? And oh certain politicians in D.C. would certainly be out of a job.

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Elwenil

We just need a 50 yard "no man's land" between 12' high fences filled with tanks traps and land mines and covered by machine gun nests on the US side. That would stop all this border foolishness. Let it be known that if you are entering illegally, you are considered to be up to no good and will be shot and killed on sight the moment you touch the outer fence. Tear down all "border towns" or extend the borders at least one open mile past them to prevent them from tunneling. Once the passage is closed, there will be no market for the drug traffickers and it will dry up. I have no sympathy for anyone entering the country illegally or anyone dealing in poisons that hurt the American way of life.

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|TG|Elwenil

Switchcraft

I would just love to hear the theory on how legalizing drugs in the US is somehow going to make Mexico's problems with drug cartels able to field brigades of heavily armed mercenaries.

"Gosh, if we widen the market for drugs in the US, I'm sure the cartels will disarm!"

Atomic Dog

I don't agree with shooting to kill...many of the "illegals" are just looking for a better life. As neighbors to a country, it is in our best interest to stimulate their economy and help them build jobs in their own country than to meet them with complete hostility when they try to flee a desperate situation.

At the same time, I find it ridiculous that 2 of our border agents sit in a federal prison for doing their job to protect our borders from drug trafficking. The Bush administration has done nothing for these 2 guys and instead, imprisons them while letting the actual drug dealer go! Since then, the same guy has been seen crossing our borders numerous times and nothing is done. This is the outrage. Not the innocent people seeking a better life, but the blatant criminals crossing our borders as they see fit while the American government sits idley by and does nothing.

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El_Gringo_Grande

LOL. You are funny! (You are kidding, right? Can never tell on these damn internets.)

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Sen. John McCain (AZ) For President '08
---
I’m not racists, I have republican friends.
---
"The essence of tyranny is the denial of complexity". -Jacob Burkhardt
---
"A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds" - emerson
----
"People should not be afraid of it's government, government should be afraid of it's People." - Line from V for Vendetta

Hambergler

Am I missing something or would the drug cartels just become farmers and truckers.

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El_Gringo_Grande

They won't go away completely. Booze is legal and there are still moonshiners and bootleggers.

But the problem will be much reduced.

They are able to field those men because they have money. If the money goes away they cannot field them.

The biggest market for drugs coming from central and south america? The good ole USA. take away that market and much of their money goes away. Much of the money goes away and the ability to field large forces goes away.

But you already know this. So why do you ask?

__________________
Sen. John McCain (AZ) For President '08
---
I’m not racists, I have republican friends.
---
"The essence of tyranny is the denial of complexity". -Jacob Burkhardt
---
"A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds" - emerson
----
"People should not be afraid of it's government, government should be afraid of it's People." - Line from V for Vendetta

GlobalWarmin

1. The gangs dealing in illegal products to make money.

2. Illegal drugs create an unimaginably large underground market worth billions of dollars.

3. Other than stolen goods, gangs don't profit from the sales of legal products.

4. The enormous amount of profit to be gained in the drug trade forces gangs into violent competition with rivals and law enforcement; hence, they have the need to be heavily armed to protect their profits.

Conclusion: If street drugs were legal, gangs would have no economic incentive to traffic and sell these products, nor the ability to use violence to control the drug market.

Ever had a gang member with a machine gun try to sell you a $20 apple, or a $5000 computer?

ScratchMonkey

We could also annex Mexico.

But first I'd start by annexing every country currently hosting a US garrison. If they're worth protecting with our military, they should be paying us taxes to support it. Remember that the US started as a defense pact to protect little independent states from big imperial superpowers. We can just add more such states to the pact.

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Sig

Elwenil

I admit the minefield was added for comic relief, but as for the no man's land and the shoot to kill, I'm deadly serious. I do honestly sympathize with people who are trying to get into the US to have a better life, but there is a protocol to follow and they could still follow the rules and petition for a Visa and possible citizenship the legal way. If they are entering the country illegally, they are either sneaking in to break laws or they are just unwilling to take the time, and I do mean time, to follow due process. Every one that comes across the border takes jobs from Americans that need them, they don't pay taxes and yet are able to get medical assistance. We have no way of tracking them, so we have no way of knowing if one man is an honest Mexican citizen who is looking for work or if he is a criminal that hasn't been caught due to the fact that he has no ID, and continually gives false names.

I wish we could welcome everyone who wants to be in the US, but quite honestly, that is no longer feasible, nor safe. We cannot guarantee that one in a batch of 10 who wants to get in the US for the right reasons isn't a drug trafficker, a criminal fleeing justice in his own country or a terrorist looking for an easy way past the border. Our economy can also no longer support the influx of illegal workers who send our money back home across the border and do not pay any taxes to support the very country that they came looking for opportunity. Every one who does this is a vampiric parasite on our economy. It would be a different situation if they would come into the US legally and leave when their Visa is up if they are not granted citizenship. There are many who follow the rules and still make it in, just because they feel they need to be in, doesn't mean we are able to help them all.

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|TG|Elwenil

El_Gringo_Grande

@Elwenil

So do we shoot those trying to leave the US?

And you also want to put this along the coast and on the US-Canadian border as well?

__________________
Sen. John McCain (AZ) For President '08
---
I’m not racists, I have republican friends.
---
"The essence of tyranny is the denial of complexity". -Jacob Burkhardt
---
"A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds" - emerson
----
"People should not be afraid of it's government, government should be afraid of it's People." - Line from V for Vendetta

Atomic Dog

The obstacle of applying for legal citizenship within the United States is that it costs over a thousand US dollars to get the proccess started. This is kind of paradoxical for those who are sticken by poverty who seek a better life in the United States. Most of them feel they have no other choice but to sneak in.

Honestly, I think special circuimstance should be granted to our neighbors who wish to come to our country. We should make exceptions on things like cost and priority when it comes to Mexicans. By all means, charge the crap out of people coming from countries across the ocean. But these people are our neighbors and their situation is desperate.

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Elwenil

No, we are a country, not a prison. I do think that we do need to either decide that we will give up some civil liberties to have more security or have the liberties and take the punches that come as a result of them. In my opinion, I would gladly deal with some Customs hassle at the border to know that our country is more secure against illegal entry of unknowns and drugs. The Canadian border with the US should be just as secure. If it takes something similar to the Iron Curtain, so be it but American citizens and those with the proper legal ID and permissions should be able to come and go as they please. Oddly enough, the coasts are probably the mos secure borders we have. We are able to see a lot far and wide with electronic eyes at sea and we don't have similar devices for use on land.

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|TG|Elwenil