Which are you?

**CingularDuality** · 09-25-2004, 11:55 AM

Got this from some other forums that I've started following lately:

Quote:

Sheep, Wolves, and Sheepdogs
by LTC(Ret) Dave Grossman, RANGER, Ph.D.,author of "On Killing."

"Honor never grows old, and honor rejoices the heart of age. It does so because honor is, finally, about defending those noble and worthy things that deserve defending, even if it comes at a high cost. In our time, that may mean social disapproval, public scorn, hardship, persecution, or as always, even death itself. The question remainsWhat is worth defending? What is worth dying for? What is worth living for? " -William J. Bennett - in a lecture to the United StatesNaval Academy November 24, 1997

One Vietnam veteran, an old retired colonel, once said this to me "Most of the people in our society are sheep. They are kind, gentle, productive creatures who can only hurt one another by accident." This is true.

Remember, the murder rate is six per 100,000 per year, and the aggravated assault rate is four per 1,000 per year. What this means is that the vast majority of Americans are not inclined to hurt one another.

Some estimates say that two million Americans are victims of violent crimes every year, a tragic, staggering number, perhaps an all-time record rate of violent crime. But there are almost 300 million Americans, which means that the odds of being a victim of violent crime is considerably less than one in a hundred on any given year. Furthermore, since many violent crimes are committed by repeat offenders, the actual number of violent citizens is considerably less than two million.

Thus there is a paradox, and we must grasp both ends of the situation. We may well be in the most violent times in history, but violence is still remarkably rare. This is because most citizens are kind, decent people who are not capable of hurting each other, except by accident or under extreme provocation. They are sheep.

I mean nothing negative by calling them sheep. To me it is like the pretty, blue robin's egg. Inside it is soft and gooey but someday it will grow into something wonderful. But the egg cannot survive without its hard blue shell. Police officers, soldiers, and other warriors are like that shell, and someday the civilization they protect will grow into something wonderful. For now, though, they need warriors to protect them from the predators.

"Then there are the wolves," the old war veteran said, "and the wolves feed on the sheep without mercy." Do you believe there are wolves out there who will feed on the flock without mercy? You better believe it. There are evil men in this world and they are capable of evil deeds. The moment you forget that or pretend it is not so, you become a sheep. There is no safety in denial.

"Then there are sheepdogs," he went on, "and I'm a sheepdog. I live to protect the flock and confront the wolf."

If you have no capacity for violence then you are a healthy productive citizen, a sheep. If you have a capacity for violence and no empathy for your fellow citizens, then you have defined an aggressive sociopath, a wolf. But what if you have a capacity for violence, and a deep love for your fellow citizens? What do you have then? A sheepdog, a warrior, someone who is walking the hero's path. Someone who can walk into the heart of darkness, into the universal human phobia, and walk out unscathed.

Let me expand on this old soldier's excellent model of the sheep, wolves, and sheepdogs. We know that the sheep live in denial, that is what makes them sheep. They do not want to believe that there is evil in the world. They can accept the fact that fires can happen, which is why they want fire extinguishers, fire sprinklers, fire alarms and fire exits throughout their kids' schools.

But many of them are outraged at the idea of putting an armed police officer in their kid's school. Our children are thousands of times more likely to be killed or seriously injured by school violence than fire, but the sheep's only response to the possibility of violence is denial. The idea of someone coming to kill or harm their child is just too hard, and so they chose the path of denial.

The sheep generally do not like the sheepdog. He looks a lot like the wolf. He has fangs and the capacity for violence. The difference, though, is that the sheepdog must not, can not and will not ever harm the sheep. Any sheep dog who intentionally harms the lowliest little lamb will be punished and removed. The world cannot work any other way, at least not in a representative democracy or a republic such as ours.

Still, the sheepdog disturbs the sheep. He is a constant reminder that there are wolves in the land. They would prefer that he didn't tell them where to go, or give them traffic tickets, or stand at the ready in our airports in camouflage fatigues holding an M-16. The sheep would much rather have the sheepdog cash in his fangs, spray paint himself white, and go, "Baa."

Until the wolf shows up. Then the entire flock tries desperately to hide behind one lonely sheepdog.

The students, the victims, at ColumbineHigh School were big, tough high school students, and under ordinary circumstances they would not have had the time of day for a police officer. They were not bad kids; they just had nothing to say to a cop. When the school was under attack, however, and SWAT teams were clearing the rooms and hallways, the officers had to physically peel those clinging, sobbing kids off of them. This is how the little lambs feel about their sheepdog when the wolf is at the door.

Look at what happened after September 11, 2001 when the wolf pounded hard on the door. Remember how America, more than ever before, felt differently about their law enforcement officers and military personnel? Remember how many times you heard the word hero?

Understand that there is nothing morally superior about being a sheepdog; it is just what you choose to be. Also understand that a sheepdog is a funny critter. He is always sniffing around out on the perimeter, checking the breeze, barking at things that go bump in the night, and yearning for a righteous battle. That is, the young sheepdogs yearn for a righteous battle. The old sheepdogs are a little older and wiser, but they move to the sound of the guns when needed right along with the young ones.

Here is how the sheep and the sheepdog think differently. The sheep pretend the wolf will never come, but the sheepdog lives for that day. After the attacks on September 11, 2001, most of the sheep, that is, most citizens in America said, "Thank God I wasn't on one of those planes." The sheepdogs, the warriors, said, "Dear God, I wish I could have been on one of those planes. Maybe I could have made a difference." When you are truly transformed into a warrior and have truly invested yourself into warriorhood, you want to be there. You want to be able to make a difference.

There is nothing morally superior about the sheepdog, the warrior, but he does have one real advantage. Only one. And that is that he is able to survive and thrive in an environment that destroys 98 percent of the population.

There was research conducted a few years ago with individuals convicted of violent crimes. These cons were in prison for serious, predatory crimes of violent assaults, murders and killing law enforcement officers. The vast majority said that they specifically targeted victims by body language slumped walk, passive behavior and lack of awareness. They chose their victims like big cats do in Africa, when they select one out of the herd that is least able to protect itself.

Some people may be destined to be sheep and others might be genetically primed to be wolves or sheepdogs. But I believe that most people can choose which one they want to be, and I'm proud to say that more and more Americans are choosing to become sheepdogs.

Seven months after the attack on September 11, 2001, Todd Beamer was honored in his hometown of Cranbury , New Jersey. Todd, as you recall, was the man on Flight 93 over Pennsylvania who called on his cell phone to alert an operator from United Airlines about the hijacking. When he learned of the other three passenger planes that had been used as weapons, Todd dropped his phone and uttered the words, "Let's roll," which authorities believe was a signal to the other passengers to confront the terrorist hijackers. In one hour, a transformation occurred among the passengers - athletes, business people and parents - from sheep to sheepdogs and together they fought the wolves, ultimately saving an unknown number of lives on the ground.

"Do you have any idea how hard it would be to live with yourself after that?"

There is no safety for honest men except by believing all possible evil of evil men. - Edmund Burke

Here is the point I like to emphasize, especially to the thousands of police officers and soldiers I speak to each year. In nature the sheep, real sheep, are born as sheep. Sheepdogs are born that way, and so are wolves. They didn't have a choice. But you are not a critter. As a human being, you can be whatever you want to be. It is a conscious, moral decision.

If you want to be a sheep, then you can be a sheep and that is okay, but you must understand the price you pay. When the wolf comes, you and your loved ones are going to die if there is not a sheepdog there to protect you. If you want to be a wolf, you can be one, but the sheepdogs are going to hunt you down and you will never have rest, safety, trust or love. But if you want to be a sheepdog and walk the warrior's path, then you must make a conscious and moral decision every day to dedicate, equip and prepare yourself to thrive in that toxic, corrosive moment when the wolf comes knocking at the door.

For example, many officers carry their weapons in church. They are well concealed in ankle holsters, shoulder holsters or inside-the-belt holsters tucked into the small of their backs. Anytime you go to some form of religious service, there is a very good chance that a police officer in your congregation is carrying. You will never know if there is such an individual in your place of worship, until the wolf appears to massacre you and your loved ones.

I was training a group of police officers in Texas, and during the break, one officer asked his friend if he carried his weapon in church. The other cop replied, "I will never be caught without my gun in church." I asked why he felt so strongly about this, and he told me about a cop he knew who was at a church massacre in Ft. Worth, Texas in 1999. In that incident, a mentally deranged individual came into the church and opened fire, gunning down fourteen people. He said that officer believed he could have saved every life that day if he had been carrying his gun. His own son was shot, and all he could do was throw himself on the boy's body and wait to die. That cop looked me in the eye and said, "Do you have any idea how hard it would be to live with yourself after that?"
Some individuals would be horrified if they knew this police officer was carrying a weapon in church. They might call him paranoid and would probably scorn him. Yet these same individuals would be enraged and would call for "heads to roll" if they found out that the air bags in their cars were defective, or that the fire extinguisher and fire sprinklers in their kids' school did not work. They can accept the fact that fires and traffic accidents can happen and that there must be safeguards against them.

Their only response to the wolf, though, is denial, and all too often their response to the sheepdog is scorn and disdain. But the sheepdog quietly asks himself, "Do you have any idea how hard it would be to live with yourself if your loved ones were attacked and killed, and you had to stand there helplessly because you were unprepared for that day?"

It is denial that turns people into sheep. Sheep are psychologically destroyed by combat because their only defense is denial, which is counterproductive and destructive, resulting in fear, helplessness and horror when the wolf shows up.

Denial kills you twice. It kills you once, at your moment of truth when you are not physically prepared, you didn't bring your gun, you didn't train. Your only defense was wishful thinking. Hope is not a strategy. Denial kills you a second time because even if you do physically survive, you are psychologically shattered by your fear helplessness and horror at your moment of truth.

Gavin de Becker puts it like this in Fear Less, his superb post-9/11 book, which should be required reading for anyone trying to come to terms with our current world situation...denial can be seductive, but it has an insidious side effect. For all the peace of mind deniers think they get by saying it isn't so, the fall they take when faced with new violence is all the more unsettling. Denial is a save-now-pay-later scheme, a contract written entirely in small print, for in the long run, the denying person knows the truth on some level.

And so the warrior must strive to confront denial in all aspects of his life, and prepare himself for the day when evil comes.
If you are warrior who is legally authorized to carry a weapon and you step outside without that weapon, then you become a sheep, pretending that the bad man will not come today. No one can be "on" 24/7, for a lifetime. Everyone needs down time. But if you are authorized to carry a weapon, and you walk outside without it, just take a deep breath, and say this to yourself... "Baa."

This business of being a sheep or a sheep dog is not a yes-no dichotomy. It is not an all-or-nothing, either-or choice. It is a matter of degrees, a continuum. On one end is an abject, head-in-the-sand-sheep and on the other end is the ultimate warrior. Few people exist completely on one end or the other. Most of us live somewhere in between. Since 9-11 almost everyone in America took a step up that continuum, away from denial. The sheep took a few steps toward accepting and appreciating their warriors, and the warriors started taking their job more seriously. The degree to which you move up that continuum, away from sheephood and denial, is the degree to which you and your loved ones will survive, physically and psychologically at your moment of truth.

**phyllis** · 09-25-2004, 09:11 PM

Very Nice find Dave...very nice !!

**CingularDuality** · 09-25-2004, 11:08 PM

I know it's kinda long, and I know that some people will find it difficult to accept as the truth, but it is. Like he said, it's not 3 distinct categories, it's a sliding scale. I like to think of myself as a sheepdog, and my jobs have forced me to be that way, but I often find myself acting like a sheep. Today, my son and I went to WalMart to spend some money that he had saved up. I didn't feel like strapping on the equipment that I usually carry with me everywhere that I go. I remembered this article and I realized that I was being a sheep. Obviously nothing happened. I trusted my safety (and my son's) to society and society protected us. But just because there were no wolves where we happened to go, doesn't mean there won't be tomorrow. Whenever you hear about someone "going postal", just think about what would've happened if there had been a sheepdog there... I know we have some sheepdog here: we have quite a few military members, some law enforcement, Dudeman has related at least one story that proves that he's a sheepdog. Somebody else (I don't remember who) related a story about witnessing a woman being beaten. He acted like a sheep at first, but then went back after his inner sheepdog got the best of him. There's nothing wrong with being a sheep in this context. But this article really puts things in context. If you're a sheep, realize it, and realize that you need sheepdogs.

**Wolfie** · 09-26-2004, 08:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CingularDuality

Somebody else (I don't remember who) related a story about witnessing a woman being beaten. He acted like a sheep at first, but then went back after his inner sheepdog got the best of him.

At first I thought you were talking about me, but I don't recall acting like a sheep at first when the lady in the apartment above me called for help.

Oh, unless you meant that I was mostly a sheep at first because all I was doing at that point was calling the cops but then was more of a sheepdog when I stayed outside the apartment making sure the guy didn't come back after running away.

**CingularDuality** · 09-26-2004, 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wolfie

At first I thought you were talking about me, but I don't recall acting like a sheep at first when the lady in the apartment above me called for help.

Oh, unless you meant that I was mostly a sheep at first because all I was doing at that point was calling the cops but then was more of a sheepdog when I stayed outside the apartment making sure the guy didn't come back after running away.

No, I don't remember that story at all... Somebody drove by (I seem to remember he was on a bike?) a house where this happened...

**Wolfie** · 09-26-2004, 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CingularDuality

No, I don't remember that story at all... Somebody drove by (I seem to remember he was on a bike?) a house where this happened...

Okay, it didn't sound like my story.

**CingularDuality** · 01-05-2005, 01:39 AM

Bump, due to recent discussion...

**DudeMan** · 01-05-2005, 04:04 PM

I remember that story... the person who wrote it who i cant remember said he saw a woman being hit, punched in the face by the side of the road in a parked car, he drove on by. later he felt quilty and went back to the location and the car was gone. and wandered if he had done the right thing.

when i was working for dominos pizza i was driving down a poorl lit area at about 11.30 pm i was behind a black vauxhall vectra, a woman further on down the road with a very nice body and a short skirt caught my eye, the vauxhall slowed when it cam parrallel with the girl and a pair of hands came out of the back door as it stopped next to her... the passenger tried to pull the girl into the car.

now this is the bit which puzzles me on which i am, without really thinking i pulled straight up on the bike and slammed the door on the guys hands then stopped and pulled the girl behind me. the car raced off. but i didnt deliberate at all it was more instinct. i probably would not have worried about the actions i took if i wasnt stalked by the car as i made my way back from the delivery and then almost rammed off the road by the occupants. i only escaped because i went the wrong way down a one way street at 75 mph into oncomming cars, (ofcourse he could not follow) and while i know i did the right thing, if my bike handling was a touch off that day or i was broadsided by a car, i would not be here. and it makes me wander.

**CingularDuality** · 01-06-2005, 12:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DudeMan

now this is the bit which puzzles me on which i am

Well, based on this one incident, I think it's obvious by your unhesitating response to do the right thing, regardless of your personal safety, that you're a sheepdog.

Some of your opinions in other threads make me wonder, though...

**DudeMan** · 01-06-2005, 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CingularDuality

Well, based on this one incident, I think it's obvious by your unhesitating response to do the right thing, regardless of your personal safety, that you're a sheepdog.

Some of your opinions in other threads make me wonder, though...

listen, agreeing with legislation does not make you a sheep cing, if you agree with the outcome of something and agree that its best for the society and social circumstances that you live in it does not make you a sheep. the society we live in is much more different that you know. and therefore you will not understand what is happengin on my doorstep and why we do the things we do. same cn be said visa versa i suppose.

**CingularDuality** · 01-07-2005, 03:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DudeMan

listen, agreeing with legislation does not make you a sheep cing, if you agree with the outcome of something and agree that its best for the society and social circumstances that you live in it does not make you a sheep. the society we live in is much more different that you know. and therefore you will not understand what is happengin on my doorstep and why we do the things we do. same cn be said visa versa i suppose.

Good point, but it just doesn't jive with wanting to take tools out of law abiding citizens' hands. Legislation doesn't have an impact on criminals already operating outside the law...

**DudeMan** · 01-07-2005, 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CingularDuality

Good point, but it just doesn't jive with wanting to take tools out of law abiding citizens' hands. Legislation doesn't have an impact on criminals already operating outside the law...

there are less gun related deaths in the uk than in the US, thats enough evidence from me.

**CingularDuality** · 01-08-2005, 12:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DudeMan

there are less gun related deaths in the uk than in the US, thats enough evidence from me.

Violent crime is rising in the UK, while it's falling in the US. That's enough evidence for me...

**DudeMan** · 01-08-2005, 01:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CingularDuality

Violent crime is rising in the UK, while it's falling in the US. That's enough evidence for me...

hmmm vague and decieving.

violent crime relates to domestic violence, assault, bag snatching whereas it wasnt referred to as that in the last census.

not to mention its still americans kill more americans than Brits kill Brits.

enough evidence for me.

**GhostintheShell** · 01-08-2005, 09:40 AM

I don't know where the NRA gets its numbers about other countries increasing in crime but here's a few quotes from Statistics Canada.

Year in Summary:

"The violent crime rate remained virtually unchanged. But most categories of property crimes rose last year, including break-ins, motor vehicle thefts, possession of stolen goods and minor thefts. This was the first substantial increase in property crime in over a decade.

Notable gains also occurred in other large-volume, minor offences such as mischief and disturbing the peace. Some forces have attributed the increase in minor offences to new reporting procedures introduced in 2003, which make it easier for the public to report these types of crimes to the police."

"the national homicide rate fell 7% last year to its lowest level since 1967. In addition, the rate of drug crimes in Canada dropped 8%, the first decline since 1993. This was largely driven by a decrease in reported cannabis possession incidents.

After peaking in 1991, the overall crime rate fell steadily throughout the 1990s and remained relatively stable from 2000 to 2002. The 2003 crime rate was 15% lower than a decade ago, but 14% higher than 25 years ago."

"Violent crime: Homicide rate continues downward trend
The violent crime rate has generally declined since the early 1990s after increasing throughout most of the three previous decades. Since 1993, it has fallen 11%, and in 2003, it remained virtually unchanged.

Most violent crime categories recorded declines in 2003, except for robbery, which increased 5%, and attempted murder, which rose 4%.

The national homicide rate fell 7% last year to its lowest level in over 35 years. A total of 548 homicides were reported to police, 34 fewer than in 2002. A major factor was a large decrease in both British Columbia and Quebec. However, there were 32 more attempted murders in Canada last year."

Don't forget as well, that with Toronto having 62 murders in 2004, if they have 65 next year, it would represent a 5% increase...

30 million people, with estimated between 7-11 million firearms, and only 548 murders in 2003. (I don't have the 2004 numbers.)

http://www.garrybreitkreuz.com/publi...nsinCanada.htm

09-25-2004, 09:11 PM	#2 (permalink)
phyllis Join Date: May 2003 Location: Dayton Ohio Age: 40 Posts: 1,502	Re: Which are you? Very Nice find Dave...very nice !! __________________

09-25-2004, 11:08 PM	#3 (permalink)
CingularDuality Join Date: May 2003 Location: Dallas/Ft. Worth area of Texas, USA Age: 33 Posts: 16,644	Re: Which are you? I know it's kinda long, and I know that some people will find it difficult to accept as the truth, but it is. Like he said, it's not 3 distinct categories, it's a sliding scale. I like to think of myself as a sheepdog, and my jobs have forced me to be that way, but I often find myself acting like a sheep. Today, my son and I went to WalMart to spend some money that he had saved up. I didn't feel like strapping on the equipment that I usually carry with me everywhere that I go. I remembered this article and I realized that I was being a sheep. Obviously nothing happened. I trusted my safety (and my son's) to society and society protected us. But just because there were no wolves where we happened to go, doesn't mean there won't be tomorrow. Whenever you hear about someone "going postal", just think about what would've happened if there had been a sheepdog there... I know we have some sheepdog here: we have quite a few military members, some law enforcement, Dudeman has related at least one story that proves that he's a sheepdog. Somebody else (I don't remember who) related a story about witnessing a woman being beaten. He acted like a sheep at first, but then went back after his inner sheepdog got the best of him. There's nothing wrong with being a sheep in this context. But this article really puts things in context. If you're a sheep, realize it, and realize that you need sheepdogs. __________________ Become a supporting member! -- Shop at the Tactical Market! Take the world's smallest political quiz! "I was touched by His Noodly Appendage." TacticalGamer TX LAN/BBQ Veteran:

01-05-2005, 01:39 AM	#7 (permalink)
CingularDuality Join Date: May 2003 Location: Dallas/Ft. Worth area of Texas, USA Age: 33 Posts: 16,644	Re: Which are you? Bump, due to recent discussion... __________________ Become a supporting member! -- Shop at the Tactical Market! Take the world's smallest political quiz! "I was touched by His Noodly Appendage." TacticalGamer TX LAN/BBQ Veteran:

01-05-2005, 04:04 PM	#8 (permalink)
DudeMan Join Date: May 2003 Location: london England Age: 22 Posts: 3,258	Re: Which are you? I remember that story... the person who wrote it who i cant remember said he saw a woman being hit, punched in the face by the side of the road in a parked car, he drove on by. later he felt quilty and went back to the location and the car was gone. and wandered if he had done the right thing. when i was working for dominos pizza i was driving down a poorl lit area at about 11.30 pm i was behind a black vauxhall vectra, a woman further on down the road with a very nice body and a short skirt caught my eye, the vauxhall slowed when it cam parrallel with the girl and a pair of hands came out of the back door as it stopped next to her... the passenger tried to pull the girl into the car. now this is the bit which puzzles me on which i am, without really thinking i pulled straight up on the bike and slammed the door on the guys hands then stopped and pulled the girl behind me. the car raced off. but i didnt deliberate at all it was more instinct. i probably would not have worried about the actions i took if i wasnt stalked by the car as i made my way back from the delivery and then almost rammed off the road by the occupants. i only escaped because i went the wrong way down a one way street at 75 mph into oncomming cars, (ofcourse he could not follow) and while i know i did the right thing, if my bike handling was a touch off that day or i was broadsided by a car, i would not be here. and it makes me wander. __________________ The Queen "Those who perpetrate these brutal acts against innocent people should know that they will not change our way of life," *Atrocities such as these simply reinforce our sense of community* TheFeniX "Guns don't kill people: effeminate men in green tunics do"

01-08-2005, 09:40 AM	#15 (permalink)
GhostintheShell Join Date: May 2003 Location: Guelph, Ontario Age: 37 Posts: 963	Re: Which are you? I don't know where the NRA gets its numbers about other countries increasing in crime but here's a few quotes from Statistics Canada. Year in Summary: "The violent crime rate remained virtually unchanged. But most categories of property crimes rose last year, including break-ins, motor vehicle thefts, possession of stolen goods and minor thefts. This was the first substantial increase in property crime in over a decade. Notable gains also occurred in other large-volume, minor offences such as mischief and disturbing the peace. Some forces have attributed the increase in minor offences to new reporting procedures introduced in 2003, which make it easier for the public to report these types of crimes to the police." "the national homicide rate fell 7% last year to its lowest level since 1967. In addition, the rate of drug crimes in Canada dropped 8%, the first decline since 1993. This was largely driven by a decrease in reported cannabis possession incidents. After peaking in 1991, the overall crime rate fell steadily throughout the 1990s and remained relatively stable from 2000 to 2002. The 2003 crime rate was 15% lower than a decade ago, but 14% higher than 25 years ago." "Violent crime: Homicide rate continues downward trend The violent crime rate has generally declined since the early 1990s after increasing throughout most of the three previous decades. Since 1993, it has fallen 11%, and in 2003, it remained virtually unchanged. Most violent crime categories recorded declines in 2003, except for robbery, which increased 5%, and attempted murder, which rose 4%. The national homicide rate fell 7% last year to its lowest level in over 35 years. A total of 548 homicides were reported to police, 34 fewer than in 2002. A major factor was a large decrease in both British Columbia and Quebec. However, there were 32 more attempted murders in Canada last year." Don't forget as well, that with Toronto having 62 murders in 2004, if they have 65 next year, it would represent a 5% increase... 30 million people, with estimated between 7-11 million firearms, and only 548 murders in 2003. (I don't have the 2004 numbers.) http://www.garrybreitkreuz.com/publi...nsinCanada.htm

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