01-26-2010, 05:51 PM #1
What is more important on an ethics decision, agreement on the answer or basis for?
This is in regards something that occurred on a separate forum.
The topic was gay marriage.
I pointed out that someone who is born with male parts and is classified as male can get surgery and a legal change to become female, then marry a male under the law in the states where same sex marriage is not legal.
My example is Kansas, where gender and sex are legally the same thing:
Customer question: I would like to change my sex or gender on my birth certificate because I had a sex change. How to I change my birth certificate?
Answer: If you have or are going to have a sex change operation, you can change the sex or gender listed on your birth certificate to the sex or gender to which you have changed.
Please provide our office with medical certification substantiating that a physiological or anatomical change has occurred. The certification must be from the doctor who performed the surgery. You also need to provide a notarized statement requesting that your sex or gender be changed. Click here for a sample of a notarized statement.
Note: Taking hormones or breast reassignment surgery does not qualify as a sex or gender change.
I just want to point out that currently, under the homosexual marriage bans that are applied in states including my own, transgendered homosexual s (yes, they are still homosexuals to me) can still get married:
Man 1 goes through transgendered surgery and is legally reclassified as a female.
He can now marry a man who is still a legal man.
When talking about the whole homosexual vs straight, this is why it doesn't matter. The ban is a ban on legally defined men and women. If they get a legal change to the other gender they can marry legally. In all of the states that ban homosexual marriage it only punishes homosexual couples where one doesn't go through the process of changing their gender.
And no, a man who goes through all of that is not a female. He's still a dude. The argument that 'well he got a legal status change' doesn't matter because that means that all that needs to happen is a judge makes that happen. While most require effort, it doesn't have to be that way. And what about people born with both genders? Are they not able to marry anyone or do they get to pick and choose based on how they were reported as a gender at birth?
Marriage needs to be reclassified as two people and the religious need to stop getting into other people's business when it doesn't affect them at all. There are so many things that a marriage certificate gives that you can't even get through the courts (federal tax brakes, health care access, emergency room access) that restricting it to a pair that simply has a XX and an XY match is just ridiculous.
So the question is: Is an ethical conclusion more important than the logic used to reach that conclusion?
Some other possible scenarios where the same result comes from different starting points:
Being opposed to steroids because of unfair advantages vs being opposed because of the negative physical effects on the users.
Being against the death penalty because it disproportionately targets minorities vs being against it because innocent people may be put to death.|TG-6th|Snooggums
Just because everyone does something does not mean that it is right to do.
01-26-2010, 06:05 PM #2
Re: What is more important on an ethics decision, agreement on the answer or basis fo
Lol, while doing a quick search for X=fem Y=male confirmation, I come across this.
Of note, they don't have functioning uterus's, but internal testes.
Me, I'm for gay marriage rights. As long as those rights didn't force religious groups to marry them if it violated their own beliefs. (the government can marry them, or willing religious groups)