Pardons (political topic)

**Wolfie** · 11-23-2003, 11:51 PM

So what does everyone think about Presidential and Governial pardons?

I don't know, but it seems lately that it has become a habit to overrule a court's ruling to help out your friends.

Take for example President Ford. Pardon Nixon for all the bad things he did. Gave him a pardon that not only forgave him for Watergate but anything else he might have done shady up till the pardon was given.

Then there was President Clinton who did a lot of last minute pardons when he was going out of office and didn't have to worry about re-election. Loved the pardon he gave to the one guy whose wife donated money to his Presidential Library :?

Recently, alot of prisoners are asking the Kentucky Governor to pardon them when he leaves office. Outstanding citizens too, DUIs who murdered people trying to get out of their punishment and not take the consequences for their poor judgements, etc. I am hoping he will do the right thing and not grant the pardons....but it is the same governor that used his executive power to get stuff taken care of for his mistress, then to turn against her later on :?

Do you think the original framers of the US Consitution realized that these things were going to happen? Is the Executive pardon still a good thiing or has it become to easy to use for corrupt purposes?

**Wyzcrak** · 11-24-2003, 12:26 AM

Power corrupts. I've never heard of a presidential pardon and thought, "man.. that NEEDED to happen. THAT was the right thing to do."

:?

Wyzcrak

verbose · 11-24-2003, 12:27 AM

The executive pardon is a slap in the face to our judicial system, and should be abolished.

Geisha · 11-24-2003, 12:44 AM

Considering that the original framers of the constitution had mistresses, owned slaves, and only allowed men to vote...

I think they were living in a completely different world. And at the same time, a curiously similar one, since the Kings & Queens of England could still give pardons to their friends and lovers.

I image the idealists wrote in pardons as a last-ditch effort to save someone that everyone knows didn't do it, despite some really condemning coincidental evidence (again, like that 18-yr-old in Georgia who's got the 10-yr mandatory prison sentence on a legal technicality for having consensual sex with a 15-yr-old - when the rape charge failed he was charged with child abuse).

I image the less idealist constitution-contributors did it to protect their friends, same as any other politician.

They weren't gods or saints or anything. They were mostly just people trying to work out something a little better than what they already had. They had the ultra-creative Ben Franklin on the team, and yet they still had to get feedback from the public before they got the bright idea for the Bill of Rights. To me that proves that they were just human, no better or worse than the average person, albeit probably with a much greater sense of responsibility and accountability than your standard American these days.

And income tax was illegal. Those must've been the days, eh?

Edit: I answered the first question, but not the second. I think the executive pardons were designed for a much simpler and SMALLER society. Mayors really knew a lot of their constituents. No I don't think they really apply anymore.

fr1j0l3 · 11-24-2003, 02:15 AM

hehehehe... funny how you leave out all of the bush/reagan pardons

**Wolfie** · 11-24-2003, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fr1j0l3

hehehehe... funny how you leave out all of the bush/reagan pardons

I didn't leave pardons out on purpose, those were the ones I remembered at the top of my head. Besides, you will note that I did include a Republican President issueing a pardon...just need to open your eyes a bit

**Wolfie** · 11-24-2003, 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eternal

I am so bitter when it comes to politics because I honestly believe there is not one honest politician in the world. Some may start out that way but they don't end up that way.

Some politicians I believe are still pretty much honest:

Senator Richard Lugar
Senator John McCain

**CingularDuality** · 11-24-2003, 11:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wolfie

Senator John McCain

Ugh.... That's all I got to say 'bout that...

11-23-2003, 11:51 PM	#1 (permalink)
Wolfie Join Date: May 2003 Location: Michigan Age: 32 Posts: 1,405	Pardons (political topic) So what does everyone think about Presidential and Governial pardons? I don't know, but it seems lately that it has become a habit to overrule a court's ruling to help out your friends. Take for example President Ford. Pardon Nixon for all the bad things he did. Gave him a pardon that not only forgave him for Watergate but anything else he might have done shady up till the pardon was given. Then there was President Clinton who did a lot of last minute pardons when he was going out of office and didn't have to worry about re-election. Loved the pardon he gave to the one guy whose wife donated money to his Presidential Library :? Recently, alot of prisoners are asking the Kentucky Governor to pardon them when he leaves office. Outstanding citizens too, DUIs who murdered people trying to get out of their punishment and not take the consequences for their poor judgements, etc. I am hoping he will do the right thing and not grant the pardons....but it is the same governor that used his executive power to get stuff taken care of for his mistress, then to turn against her later on :? Do you think the original framers of the US Consitution realized that these things were going to happen? Is the Executive pardon still a good thiing or has it become to easy to use for corrupt purposes?

11-24-2003, 12:26 AM	#2 (permalink)
Wyzcrak Join Date: May 2003 Location: Memphis, TN Posts: 14,132	Power corrupts. I've never heard of a presidential pardon and thought, "man.. that NEEDED to happen. THAT was the right thing to do." :? Wyzcrak __________________ Steam Community? Add me. \| Join #tacticalgamer \| Search Results Legend \| New Posts Forum Filter \| Postbox Toggle \| Live Thread Review \| One Line Results \| Free Remote, Encrypted Backup Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Root: Welcome to TG. Feel free to punctuate your sentences correctly. Monkerz: Its gonna take all my skills to beat those boys off in the future.

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11-24-2003, 12:27 AM	#3 (permalink)
verbose Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Lincoln, Nebraska, USA Age: 27 Posts: 409	The executive pardon is a slap in the face to our judicial system, and should be abolished.

11-24-2003, 12:44 AM	#4 (permalink)
Geisha Join Date: May 2003 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 277	Considering that the original framers of the constitution had mistresses, owned slaves, and only allowed men to vote... I think they were living in a completely different world. And at the same time, a curiously similar one, since the Kings & Queens of England could still give pardons to their friends and lovers. I image the idealists wrote in pardons as a last-ditch effort to save someone that everyone knows didn't do it, despite some really condemning coincidental evidence (again, like that 18-yr-old in Georgia who's got the 10-yr mandatory prison sentence on a legal technicality for having consensual sex with a 15-yr-old - when the rape charge failed he was charged with child abuse). I image the less idealist constitution-contributors did it to protect their friends, same as any other politician. They weren't gods or saints or anything. They were mostly just people trying to work out something a little better than what they already had. They had the ultra-creative Ben Franklin on the team, and yet they still had to get feedback from the public before they got the bright idea for the Bill of Rights. To me that proves that they were just human, no better or worse than the average person, albeit probably with a much greater sense of responsibility and accountability than your standard American these days. And income tax was illegal. Those must've been the days, eh? Edit: I answered the first question, but not the second. I think the executive pardons were designed for a much simpler and SMALLER society. Mayors really knew a lot of their constituents. No I don't think they really apply anymore.

11-24-2003, 02:15 AM	#5 (permalink)
fr1j0l3 Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 1,340	hehehehe... funny how you leave out all of the bush/reagan pardons

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