Vinzalf

I also want to see it.

I also want to say that arguing what "We" show on our Television is a moot point as frankly, I know many, many, many people, including myself, who would like Television Censorship to end.

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CingularDuality

Indeed. I mean "we" as a society. "We" are going to punish those soldiers for torturing prisoners. "We" aren't going to start beheading captured enemy in retaliation for this one. (although it wouldn't surprise me if some sicko decapitates some innocent American of arab/muslim heritage in the next few weeks...). Individuals obviously can't be spoken of in the same way...

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Vinzalf

I diddnt mean all censorship was uneccesary, but You cannot get a good, uncensored movie anywhere on our airwaves because Little Billy might have nightmares... The way I see it, better Little Billy have these nightmares while he's young so he learns to deal with them, rather than him growing up not knowing that evil exists in the world...

On a side note, I dont believe Little Billy should see a video such as this, but dont shelter Little Billy from everything either. Maybe when Little Billy isnt so Little anymore, someone will be able to explain to him that there were real human beings behind those masks, and they were wrong.

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Zebra

He also conscripted nearly every military-age male into the army or one of the various militias. There was no shortage of armed men there before the war, and there certainly aren't now. Most of them appear to have no sac, imo.

LOWDRAG

I agree... but you cant use that video as a measuring stick on your anger or as a tool for retalitory evidence.

We dont have that option being the supreme fighting force in the world.

DudeMan

actually cobra i judeged my interpretyation from the reactions gaged here and the people that said they did not mind it was all in good fun were a minority. most of the people here condemed it as something they did not want chilldren exposed to. if thats the case, then dont post a link on a website that kids can and probably will come and look at.... we are a gamers community it is highly likely we get visited daily by kids.

LOWDRAG

PM sent.................

GhostintheShell

Here's something posted on another board I go on for my car club, I'm not validating it, not saying I agree with it. I just thought you guys might think its something interesting.

PLS. Don't shoot the messenger.


Sorry if the links don't work, I had to upload them to my imagestation account to try to make them work. If they don't I can try to upload them to my webspace or something.


" I'm sure all of you have seen or at least know about the beheading of American Nick Berg in Iraq. Apparently conspiracy theories have begun to pop up all over the world as to the real killers and source of the tape.

If you have any interest this is a fairly good read.

where are the records of bergs company?

nick berg had started his own company called prometheus methods tower services. when searches were conducted in his state to find this company, they came up empty. you are not required to file for a business i.d. but usually, you cannot exist without one. there is absolutely no record of his company, either through state records, online, or anywhere else. he also worked on the tower at the very prison in the center of the abuse scandal, however his company name can not be found on the list of approved u.s. contractors.

last year, the media ran national news stories about israeli spies infiltrating the u.s. phone companies. many people were arrested and charged with spying for israel, although, israel officially doesnt spy on the u.s.

http://www.totse.com/en/politics/for...es/168266.html
http://www.newsmax.com/archives/arti...8/224826.shtml

in war-torn iraq, the phone systems were entirely hardlined. saddam required it. hardlined systems are the easiest to bug, and saddam loved bugs. these systems were heavily damaged during the war, and needed repair. nick berg was in the country, helping to set up radio and cell phone com towers, transmitters, etc. nick berg was also jewish and had recently been to israel. this leads to the next question...

was nick berg possibly an israeli spy?

bergs family claims that the u.s. military held him for 13 days, yet the military denies this, and claims that the iraqi police detained him. the iraqi police, however, deny holding berg as well. what is clear, is that at some point, iraqi police suspected that he was an israeli spy (his passport contained an israeli stamp, and is widely regarded as a no-no in iraq.) when he was questioned, he was found to have an anti-semetic book, and a quran. this does not make sense. remember, he was jewish. was nick berg trying to understand the religion of islam, and the hatred of jews at the same time? were these books required reading material? this leads to the next question...

was nick berg playing both sides, and caught in a double cross?

the f.b.i. questioned berg in iraq at some point, up to three times reportedly, also suspecting that he was up to no good. they asked berg if he knew how to make pipe bombs, or if he had ever been in iran. after questioning, they offered him a flight home and released him. he turned down the offer for a flight home, saying he thought it might be too dangerous traveling to the airport, but when asked how he planned to leave iraq, he said that he was going to travel by land to kuwait. this particular stretch of road is a dangerous one, even for iraqis. it is a haven for thugs and kidnappers. a westerner in jeans, t-shirt, and ball cap wouldnt get too far. surely he would have known this?

nick bergs father, michael berg, and nick bergs company name are on a 'list' at free-republic since 2003 as being enemies to the occupation of iraq, yet nick berg was a 'bush supporter'. his father was not a supporter of the current administration, and has clearly made his position known on national news and radio broadcasts. he has stated that he blames the military for his sons death.

was there a deeper link between berg and 9/11 suspects?

nick berg had a connection with zacarias moussaoui, the only 9-11 suspect indicted by the the united states so far. nick berg let an individual on a bus use his email account and computer to send mail to various people, one of which was moussaoui, who then in turn, ended up with bergs email account password. strange. the f.b.i. thought so too, and questioned nick regarding his contacts. his name was known to the f.b.i. since as early as 2002.

finally the video itself leads to many questions...

the white chair?





funny that such a chair is so famous these days. you might remember this chair featured in some of the iraqi abuse photos at abu ghraib prison. sure there are a million of these patio chairs in iraq, but it is worth noting.





the yellow walls?

the chair in itself might not seem like much, but how about the yellow walls behind berg, the same yellow walls in the iraqi prison that the u.s. military is now using, the same one at the center of the abuse scandal. remember, nick also worked on a radio tower here, and was supposedly detained here at some point. which leads to my next question...

the orange prison uniform?

why is berg in a prison uniform? this is the same uniform the u.s. military sticks on prisoners in iraq as well as down at the bay. do the insurgents shop at the same store as the americans? same chairs, same uniform. whats next? same soldiers?

the couch potato combatants?

in every video i have ever seen such as this, i can honestly say i have never seen a fat terrorist, not a foot-soldier at least. all of the men behind nick berg look out of shape, overweight, and in some cases, even white. one of them is wearing sneakers.



strange accents and trouble reading the words?

the man in the center, was having trouble reading the papers, and was constantly flipping them around. many muslims have said that their accents arent proper either. they sound neither iraqi or jordanian. some news agencies are reporting hearing russian for a brief moment. others say possibly iranian.

dead man walking?

this brings up another question. the man in the center is reported to be abu musab al-zarqawi. the video itself was entitled 'abu musab al-zarqawi slaughters an american'. why would he name the video after himself, and then wear a mask? another potential problem is that the military and iraqi militants claim he was killed months ago in a bombing raid by u.s. warplanes. he was supposed to have an artificial leg, but he doesnt seem too handicapped in the berg video. this man is supposedly responsible for the madrid train bombings as well as the plot to kill up to 80,000 people in jordan. under normal circumstances i am happy to see terrorists die, especially when it involves u.s. warplanes, but if this man is dead, that is big trouble for someone.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4446084/
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/...in604191.shtml



the man who cuts bergs throat, is also wearing a gold ring on his right hand which no extremist would do. it is against the fundamentalists version of islam.

berg killed before the beheading?

finally, some are speculating that berg was already dead before his head was cut off. this may mor may not be true, no matter who did it. the tape is edited right when the beheading begins, and the timestamps are different, yet you do hear him screaming. a human head holds over a gallon of blood. when a heart is still pumping, the second someones throat was cut that severely, they would be literally spewing blood everywhere. we do not see this in the berg video. just a small amount of blood, on his shirt and the floor. the red carpet may hide some of this. either way, maybe the terrorists did kill him first, or maybe someone else did.

wag the dog?

the timing of this video release raises questions too. some reports even show that u.s. troops found his body on the 10th, yet the execution supposedly took place on the 11th. i support the united states, the troops, and the president, but i do wonder...just what the f**k is going on in iraq? whether it be mossad, c.i.a., f.b.i., or just plain old insurgents, there is certainly more to the story than meets the eye. "

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DeRanger

PM the link to me please LOWDRAG, thanks.

Sniper

Wow Ghost. REALLY REALLY good points...

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GhostintheShell

Whoa...thanks but those aren't my points, just something I found on another board.

(I don't even know exactly what I think of all that yet other than there's some weird stuff going on there.)

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Certainly there is no hunting like the hunting of man and those who have hunted armed men long enough and liked it, never really care for anything else thereafter.
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DeRanger

I like your thinking Ghost, truth is stranger than fiction more often than not.

phyllis

Yea...something isn't jiving with the stories of who held him, and when....


any links to said info...that'd be a strange coincidence...


That one struck me right away when I saw the pic on CNN...since when would terrorist's put a captured man in an orange suit... this one really bugs me...


no comment yet...I haven't had the right mindset to watch the full video yet....

Yes, it definetly does, and the closer we get to November, the more of this I think we're going to see....

All in all...something does feel wayyyyyy fishy....

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leejo

If you assume that every weird thing about this video is true and meaningful, then where does it lead you? Terrorists aren't really terrorists and Israel and the USA are in some bizzare collusion to make the world think that nice people like Zarqawi cut off heads.

Who does that sound like?

I do wonder that there's more to the connection between Berg and Moussaui. For goodness sakes if some dude IN IRAQ happened to loan out his email address to Moussaui I'd hope that he'd turn up on the news as someone we're holding indefinitely! I am troubled that this connection exists and the party line is "oh we looked into it and there's nothing to it."

GhostintheShell

Another unanswered question, Why is the man on the far left of the video standing at "Parade Rest"??

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Certainly there is no hunting like the hunting of man and those who have hunted armed men long enough and liked it, never really care for anything else thereafter.
Ernest Hemingway, "On the Blue Water," Esquire, April 1936