Root

Which proves my point. Hypocrits the lot of them. Popes not only used to fight with their armies, but a few of them enjoyed raping women (together with pillage and plunder). That's why catholic priests aren't allowed to marry.

I'm a born again athiest, but that doesn't mean I can't smell bull or tell an idiot when I see one.

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Addict

But aren't the Imam's effectively the judge/jury in the court of Islamic law? They make the edicts that the muslim world takes as religious fact (or maybe not fact, but "strong suggestion" or somesuch, as 2 Imam's can actually issue contradictory edit:fatwa or somesuch like that, man I need to do more research). YOU(and all western nations, I'd say) may not find a cartoon a criminal(let alone capital) offense, but they do for some reason. Dismissing it seems unproductive. Then again, understanding it may be unproductive too! So how about them stealers?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatwa

ah, Mufti's issue Fatwa's.

"Because Islam has no centralized priestly hierarchy, there is no uniform method to determine who can issue a valid fatwa and who cannot, and upon whom such fatwas are binding. Some Islamic scholars complain that too many people feel qualified to issue fatwas." Heh, as usual, in any group, there will be disagreements.

Root

Not relevant. Denmark isn't an islamic state, ergo Danish law is what matters. If you're a muslim living in Denmark, then...

I suppose you could add to that with "or get a court order banning further similar cartoons being printed".

I didn't realise it was such a disorganised religion. Perhaps they should sort their own house out before they start acting like French farmers, and making with militant protest.

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munchkin

Not wishing to cause offence, but I think that if you look carefully Christianity (and Judaism to a degree) are much the same, what with the huge amounts of genocide described in the Old Testament. Ever been rude to your parents? You should've been stoned to death.

One fundamental point (no pun intended...but hey, I made one anyway) about Islam is that Muslims have a spectrum of beliefs as wide as all the different sects of Christianity. One of the only things that they agree on is the prohibition against representations of the prophet Mohammed, and by violating that offensivelly they ticked off everyone.

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SmokingTarpan

Time to put the protesters down: http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/asiapc...sts/index.html

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[squadl]
"I am the prettiest african-american, vietnamese..cong..person." -SugarNCamo

AMosely

I wonder if humanity will ever evolve past religion and reach a more comprehensive and unanimous sense of being. The world really would be a much better place.

Trooper

yeah the flood was done because the people where wicked and full of evil.

the point i was making is the founding elements of Islam are violent. The founding element of Christianity and Judaism is free will. And believe me i know the history of Christianity. Before you call someone hypocritical you should really actually look at the history and context of all things. All of the violence in the old testament was people cuased. but thats for a different thread.

and since we dont see christians out there killing and blowing up people,"becuase we dont like them" we cant really lump them into this topic

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that sounds like a good idea trooper.
-Vulcan

Ben

Lock, Load and open fire at will. By this I mean that if you happen to see a mob of angry moslems with Molotove cocktails and pipes coming to destroy your countries embassy, load your rifle and shoot the bastards dead. simple, effective and justifiable self defence.

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A battle is dynamic, i.e constantly changing and evolving. Follow the strategy in place but never be afraid to improvise if the situation calls for it.
All I ask for is communication

Leonidas

Got that right.

Like I said, what I find amazing is that the embassy was actually burned. With the Marines at our embassies that would never happen. After it was evacuated, maybe, but not with them on duty. Mobs are cowardly. If you put down a few of 'em, the rest usually trample eachother trying to get away.

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War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling that thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety is a miserable creature, who has no chance at being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself. -- John Stuart Mill--

"O xein angellein lakedaimoniois hoti tede keimetha tois keinon rhemasi peithomenoi"- Monument, Thermopylae

Trooper

apparently you read more then i put cuase no where did i say that.

and its not a story its historical fact, do a google search. You can brand who ever you like

but back on topic, i really do hope things simmer down and get back on track cause this whole deal isn't helping anyone accomplish anything.

edit: i need to add one thing, my statement about founding on violence, although true was missing one fact, that its less then 15% that are that way now. many Muslims i have talked to online or in person are ashamed of the Jihad or radical secs of islam. Those areas just get the most attention becuase they are the loudest.

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that sounds like a good idea trooper.
-Vulcan

IceCold

Or calling all Catholics pedophiles based on the church supporting pedophilia amongst its leaders.
This is the truth.

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Santa

There are plenty of bad people out there, but you dont just kill them off for it. Besides, since that event didnt actaully happen, im sure its more a metaphoric religious teaching of some sort rather than anything else. Killing off almost everyone on the planet is pretty violent, though probably not the moral of the story.

I dont know enough about Islam, but id be extremely surprised if its not also based off of some good moral such as Free Will. Thats just simply putting ones own religion on a higher pedastal before knowing anything about Islam.

Er, Ireland? Theres been violence over there for a long time, and from what i know its largely religious (Correct me if im wrong). Also, the crusades is arguably the worst thing religion has done to Earth, and was largely due to Christians.

Religion, in ALL its forms, has sparked war time and time again. Religions have also sparked racial and social inequality. Islam isnt the only religion that has done so. Most religions are based off of some positive moral, and not just violence or bigotry. Some people, howerver, have skewed the teachings in some religions and have done violent or racist acts in the name of religion.

Wulfyn

Whereas I certainly wouldn't be one to disagree with the Mock Turtle, I would say that many of the 'historical facts' of the gospel surrounding the life of Jesus are on very shaky ground. Even where Jesus was born is in serious doubt, historically. Got to go with Bommando here in saying that it is unfair to isolate Islam as being founded on violence. I can think of few things that have not been founded upon violence. And before we condemn one religeon over another, lest we not forget that although it may not be the 'political stance' of a religeon to undertake something we consider today as anything from distasteful to plain evil, many members of such religeons have undertaken it, often by changing the rules. After all the holocaust is surely justifiable if you no longer recognise Jews as human beings? I honestly doubt that religeon really affects things at all.



To get back to the point of the pictures at hand I do not feel that they should have been published. Whereas I in no way condone any violent reaction towards it I feel that there should be limits to what the media should publish. I'm not a fan of any official laws upon censorship (and none would have any chance of succeeding, after all anyone who wants to curtail the media is obviously a book-burner). The right to free speach does not remove us from the moral and ethical obligations of what we publish. Just because you do not find them insensitive doesn't make it right. Cultures and customs are different, and the failure of the press to recognise and respect this is, for me, the real issue here.

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Faultline

While I agree that the media shouldn't have published the cartoons, I disagree as to the reasons why. The only reason I think they shouldn't have been published is because the reaction was typical and expected...they (the Danish media) should've known better.

This doesn't in any way mean I condone the rioting and ultimately the rioters are to blame. The cause in no way justifies the effect. I'm simply stating that with Islam these days we are all walking on eggshells.

Muslims and other religious conservatives need a dose of rational thought.

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Steeler

Wasn't there that one faith that started after someone nailed some guy to a tree?

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