WhiskeySix

<shudder>

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SmokingTarpan

First things first, not everly happy to see a derogatory term in the title of the thread.

Problem with this is that we call it Independence Day, not Victory over Britain/Brits/England/whathaveyou Day. So, that logic doesn't hold up too well.

Now, I'm usually one of the last people to push any PC move, but this seems one of those appropriate times. Rename it to Victory Day, and I wouldn't have as much of a problem with it. Perhaps there's a reason that apparently every other state has dropped the holiday, and RI should take the hint?

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Drizzid

Why? I mean it really isn't victory day is it? It's the day the Japanese surrendered correct? Why can't it be V-J Day. Just because everybody else did it doesn't mean NJ does. PC is getting to wide spread I think it's time someone makes a stance. I believe it is a stance more against PC than anything else in reguards to the day in question

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Apophis

In practice, it has been re-named to Victory Day in Rhode Island. But many people still call it VJ day because that's what they remember it being called for so many years.

And no, Rhode Island shouldn't take the hint, because I like my day off!

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WhiskeySix

Does the name really matter? I mean - even it was officially callled WWII Pacific Veterans Day, it'd still be celebrating the end of the war with Japan...

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Pickle

Next time I will say "Buttocks".

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Diceman

I think he means "jap".

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Pickle

I know...sarcasm

I purposely used the words Japs in the title because I am fighting the PC crowd on this. I figure if this term was good enough for my grandfather to use on Guadalcanal, other Pacific theater battles and today then it is good for me. I realize some may see the name as derrogatory but to me it is simply an abbreviation. However, I have no problem using it or the term Kraut. I see them both as period specific references.

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Wyzcrak

The term being derogatory in a "specific" "period" doesn't make it any less so today. Your grandfather being derogatory doesn't justify your choice to be.

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Pickle

I see your point and I knew this was coming up. I don't use derogatory terms toward anyone. Quite frankly I despise them. The only time I use the above terms is in reference to WWII period when quoting something else. On the flip side these two particular terms don't bother me as I don't really see them as derogatory. Many times it is is all in the mind of the listener if a word is derogotory or not. For the record I am caucasion and I could care less if I am called a cracker. I also can not name one person I know who would be offended by that term. In my mind the terms above do not carry near the same weight as other derogotory terms for other races of people. I don't think I need to stoop a low enough level to say those terms if you don't know what terms I am referring to.

When my grandfather uses the term he doesn't spit venom and vitreolic words. He doesn't hate the Germans or the Japanese. That is simply what he calls them. He has spoken admirably of their fighting capabilities. I suppose that is a benefit of living in a non-PC generation. They had thicker skin back then and people today should as well.

If people want to consider the term "Jap" or "Kraut" or "Jerry" derrogotory that is fine by me.
I think I need to become offended everytime I hear the name "Joe" used in reference to any of our soldiers.

Edit; I know I am mispelling derrogotory

And by "period specific" That means that I am calling the Japanese and Germans responsible for killing millions of people names I have no problem with that.

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TheFeniX

That's not saying much considering you aren't a visible minority who has to deal with racism that actually affects your life. Just because you can laugh off a racist comment doesn't mean other should have to. But I guess that's the benefit of being the majority.

Do you even know a Japanese person? How can you be the judge of what classifies as racist to them?

One of my good friends in high school was Japanese, and he did consider "Jap" a derogatory term. And I can't really blame him.

Yea, I know a few people who claim this same deal: "It's just a word, it doesn't mean I respect their race any less." It's usually BS.

So, if I simply call black people "darkies," that's ok because it's not racist? Because I say so?

Our grandparents grew up in a time where most minorities had no rights to speak of. A time when white people thought they were better than everyone else. There was no "PC" because it was perfectly acceptable to call a grown black man "boy." Or to shout other racist remarks at minorities.

It really irks me that your equating entrenched racism in this country with "Political Correctness."

Put it this way: would you walk up to a Japanese person you just met and ask "Are you a Jap?"

What about Italians?

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Beatnik

I'm glad we won the war and that dropping 2 atomic bombs saved American lives. But I don't the death of however many thousands (40,000?) of Japanese civilians, and the other casualties and the effects on their offspring, is an appropraite topic deserving the levity of the title of the thread. That's not being PC, that's just poor taste in my opinion.

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Coridon

Man, I hate getting drawn into the quagmire known as the Sandbox...

That's frightening.

Every free country will undoubtably perform morally assailable actions to protect its people, but there should always be at the very least a twinge of remorse for when that necessary evil occurs.

German and Japanese cities were firebombed during WWII with horrific results. Ultimately those firebombings, combined with two nuclear attacks, forced the Japanese to surrender. They had absolutely no way to counter American B-29s and to continue on with the struggle would have been suicide on a national scale.

After the war when it became apparent that the US and the Soviet Union were going to go round and round there were many cries in the United States to use the Bomb (yes, that one) against our enemies before they developed similar technology. Douglas MacArthur was fired for wanting to nuke China in 1951, for example.

Fortunately, rational thought prevailed and this was not the course chosen for the US to pursue.

George Kennan came up with a policy that would eventually be labled "containment" and I want to read an excerpt as it holds true today, particularly with the path the United States government has taken us in the past five years.

Finally, we must have courage and self-confidence to cling to our own methods and conceptions of human society.

Basically, we need to promote democracy and freedom in the world but not become monsters in the process, as we essentially became in WWII with the firebombing and nuclear attacks.

The US continues to promote "a picture of the world we would like to see" but in the last five years, in particular, we've become a veritable Chimera.

We're better than that.

To say that it's acceptable to call people "Japs" and "Krauts" because of what their nations did in the past means that it is just as acceptable to hear "DEATH TO THE CRUSADERS!! DEATH TO THE ZIONISTS!!" today based on many of the actions by the current administration all over the globe.

I can't imagine everything that goes on, but just knowing that our current leaders have deemed the Geneva Convention "quaint" suggests that in many regards those derogatory terms for Americans do indeed carry more than an ounce of credibility...

I'm not questioning individual soldiers; I'm questioning the actions of the government that holds them in the palm of its bellicose hand, and that these dubious orders are causing us to be called derogatory names in all four corners of the earth.

In essence, we ourselves are not without blood on our hands; let's not play the hypocrite and stoop to derogatory name calling simply because "that's the way things were".

marstein

Does that mean I shouldn't call the americans "amis"?

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Coridon

No no, only "Verdammte Amis!" will do!