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12-20-2007, 07:56 PM #1
TF2 Update 12/20/07
What are you waiting for? Restart that client of yours.
From the looks of it, Valve is preparing us for those new achievements.
Team Fortress 2
* Sudden Death mode is now a server option (a convar) and defaults to OFF
* Sapped buildings now take slightly less damage from the Spy who sapped them
* The Medic's Medigun now charges at an increased rate during Setup time, to remove the need for self-damage grinding
* Fixed an rcon/console command that could cause server crashes
* Prevented players from playing the "civilian" class
* Prevented players from hiding their name in the scoreboard
* Fixed exploit where the Medigun UberCharge wouldn't drain if you switched weapons
* Fixed decals not being correctly applied to the world in some cases
* Fixed critical bullet tracers not being visible to players other than the firer
* Fixed first person spectator view of the Spy watch not showing the correct cloak value
* Fixed the teleporter's player shaped particles not drawing
* Fixed the flamethrower stuttering when firing directly into a building
* Fixed a rare crash that can happen when a player being healed leaves the server suddenly
* Fixed rocket trail effects sometimes existing permanently in world
* Added effects to players when they earn an achievement, visible to other players nearby
* Tweaked achievement HUD fonts and color palette for more readability
* Improved stat gathering for map play times to increase accuracy
* Improved stat gathering around draws to better understand why they're occurring
* Fixed occasional misreporting of syringe gun & fireaxe damage distances to the stats system
* Fixed an occasional crash caused by an achievement not being found during a game announcement
Dustbowl
* Now waits until either team wins fully before changing to another map on server timelimit expiring
* Teams now score a point per captured control point, rather than per sub round
* Prevented Demomen being able to launch grenades into the stage three alleys while standing at the final cap point
* Fixed gaps in stage gates that allowed snipers to kill defenders during setup
* Fixed several model and brush perch exploits in stage three
* Added stair access to the upper area in stage three after the first cap
* Limited line-of-sight at the first control point in stage 3 to remove a griefable sniper spot
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12-20-2007, 08:42 PM #2
Re: TF2 Update 12/20/07
* Fixed exploit where the Medigun UberCharge wouldn't drain if you switched weapons
Nice while it lasted.
Anyways, the server was updated ASAP and it currently full. Get gaming and show the pubs how it's done at TG.
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12-20-2007, 10:40 PM #3
- Join Date
- Nov 2007
- Posts
- 111
Re: TF2 Update 12/20/07
Damn the medigun switching was an exploit? That should have been a feature, its one of the best advanced tactics I used. And its not game breaking, you can't heal any one while your doing it unless you want to go uber again. Oh well it was definitely fun while it lasted
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12-20-2007, 10:56 PM #4
Re: TF2 Update 12/20/07
NOOOO THEY REMOVED CIVILIAN
That was one of my favorite features
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Doc-in-training
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12-20-2007, 10:57 PM #5
Re: TF2 Update 12/20/07
"Sapped buildings now take slightly less damage from the Spy who sapped them"
WHY? It already took forever to break something by sapping alone. Why not just give Engineer a wrench cannon that fires a small nuclear wrench that breaks all sappers in the map, repairs all buildings in the map, and kickbans all spies in the server.


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12-20-2007, 11:04 PM #6
Re: TF2 Update 12/20/07
I like it mainly because it will hopefully force spies to be less like James Bond, going solo and trying to do everything themselves, and make them more reliant on their team.
I think good spies should still be able to solo average engies and their SGs. But a smart engy should need to be beaten by a sapping spy backed up by a combat class. Essentially, the sapper is to keep the gun from firing while the solider/etc takes it out.
Magna, I doubt this will affect you much because you're one of the few spies who can run a good chance of soloing me and my sentry. I cut you some slack on this, but nothing annoys me more than a single spy trying (and failing) over and over again to sap my sentry to death. If he would just wait for one teammate to back him up, he could actually make my life difficult.
You've got a team, use it.
Wow, that turned into a rant. Anyways..... back to your regularly scheduled thread.
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12-20-2007, 11:07 PM #7
Re: TF2 Update 12/20/07
Sometimes a sapper isn't meant to destroy a sentry- just to disable it long enough for more people to get in. I've also noticed that a spy repeatedly sapping a sentry, if the engie is close, often totally occupies the engie- thereby, again, allowing others to move in.
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Doc-in-training
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12-20-2007, 11:58 PM #8
Re: TF2 Update 12/20/07
"I like it mainly because it will hopefully force spies to be less like James Bond, going solo and trying to do everything themselves, and make them more reliant on their team."
That's a problem of people not understanding the capabilities and limits of their class. Making them slightly worse at it won't teach them anything, and weakens the class for the wise players.
"But a smart engy should need to be beaten by a sapping spy backed up by a combat class. Essentially, the sapper is to keep the gun from firing while the solider/etc takes it out."
"nothing annoys me more than a single spy trying (and failing) over and over again to sap my sentry to death. If he would just wait for one teammate to back him up, he could actually make my life difficult."
What teammate to back him up? In an imaginary wonder world made of brave players who have a plan, that can work. But my experience speaks that people in general will not push forward against a Level 3. They just won't do it, unless it's Dustbowl III and that's the only thing they can do. They'll get close, they take a futile pot shot, then they'll see a pyro somewhere and go kill him to score a frag. They won't watch for gun breaks on the scoreboard, either. But when I break guns and announce that they're broken, suddenly everyones' heads become full of eyeballs and they go marching in. When your team just frags around waiting for the spy to break all the guns and clear all the snipers, needing even more alone-time with a gun to break it does nothing but hate on the player who's trying to help his team make a move.
Finally, while I've heard many people (excluding myself) complaining about failed backstabs, goofy frontstabs, and getting stuck when decloaking, I've never heard anyone say that it was too easy for a Spy to break a gun by:
1) Sneaking in.
2) Catching an Engineer off making a sandwich.
3) Getting the sapper on it.
4) Not getting wrenched.
5) Shooting the gun.
6) Four times.
7) Without getting wrenched, pyro'd, demo'd, or crit rocketed.
8) Optionally escaping.
So how much is this "slightly less?" Five bullets? All six? Will I need to reload? I don't have time to reload, I've died plenty by going after an L3 with three in the Taurus because I don't have a second and a half to spare. Gunning down an L3 is not a fun job as it was.
What more can I say... they're fixing what isn't broken, and meanwhile I can't stab at someone without it not registering, me getting stuck to them, and eating rockets.


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12-21-2007, 01:07 AM #9
Re: TF2 Update 12/20/07
I tried it out, an unattended L3 took a sapper, ALL SIX ROUNDS, plus a stabbin' to break.
That's absurd. Slightly less damage my non-reg backstab. By the time I got done beating it up with my Nerf shooter, I had the whole Cherokee Nation on me.


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12-21-2007, 03:24 AM #10
- Join Date
- Mar 2007
- Age
- 41
- Posts
- 1,127
Re: TF2 Update 12/20/07
I think the issue was the constant sapping that could occur would lower the guns health incrementally where if the engineer couldnt get at the spy the spy never needed the his gun or the sapper to run to it's duration to destroy the sentry, but could "spam-sap" it to death.
I guess theoretically that's where your teammates would come into the picture, but as you stated in your post, that's at best a crap-shoot.
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12-21-2007, 04:07 AM #11
Re: TF2 Update 12/20/07
Read the update: "Sapped buildings now take slightly less damage from the Spy who sapped them"
Breaking out my M:tG rules lawyering, while the building is the target of the Sapper effect, only damage dealt by the Sapper's controller is reduced by the effect added by this modification.
Sapper does the same thing as always, but my ability to get the gun to break in under twenty minutes is nerfed. Meanwhile, I still instadie to wrench, instadie to fire, instadie to rocket, instadie to any random spam, instadie to stuck-to-guy, and can't recover watch time with ammo pickups.
Oh yeah, and those six bullets, that's 20% of my ammo capacity. Which is a lot. And leaves me nothing to fight the angry bull engineer with. I guess I could throw my sappers at him and hope to break his nose. That's the only thing they're good for anymore. Well, I guess it can work as a tenth disguise...
Last edited by MagnaCentipede; 12-21-2007 at 04:43 AM.



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12-21-2007, 08:21 AM #12
Re: TF2 Update 12/20/07
I think there's some merit to the response above stating that perhaps they're trying to encourage more teamwork. A place like TG should be at the forefront of demonstrating what good teamwork can achieve. I say if we can't get on the horn and encourage people to work together, we should just rip our miicrophones out of the computer anyway.
My observation has been that tactical chat on our TF2 server is pretty low. I'd like to hear more situational information; this will lead to more organization. Most of the time, it's dead silence or useless information.
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12-21-2007, 09:28 AM #13
Re: TF2 Update 12/20/07
They've also crippled Spy in another way. Level 3 turrets instantly throw rockets now. That eliminates the stab-and-sap maneuver that let a spy at least have a chance to try to shoot it down.
So guess what? Now spy is useless as destruction and is only good for kill hunting. GG Valve, GG.


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12-21-2007, 07:43 PM #14
Re: TF2 Update 12/20/07
Maybe we can reserve judgement till we've had more than 24 hours to evaluate the update...
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12-22-2007, 01:52 AM #15
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