About the whole "TG-wow people never go outside of the wow community" thing

[Happy-WoW]

Originally Posted by Grunt 70

My point was regardless or our point of view or circumstance we should endeavor to glean what we can from all viewpoints. The poster's comments indicated a highly limited viewpoint coupled with no desire to look beyond this viewpoint. While not spelled out in the primer I've seen this type of attitude few times from other TGers. On the whole my experience with others here runs towards open healty discourse, certainly opposite to the attitude of "I don't need to know anything outside of the WoW community" comment I remarked upon.

It is has also gotten to the point where the WoW player base has been harrassed in teamspeak by the FPS groups and a teamspeak admin from the FPS group let it happen and was in the channel.

When you get treated like that, especially from people in postions of authority, where is the motivation to venture out and keep an open mind about the rest of the community?

[Grunt 70]

Originally Posted by Happy-WoW

It is has also gotten to the point where the WoW player base has been harrassed in teamspeak by the FPS groups and a teamspeak admin from the FPS group let it happen and was in the channel.

When you get treated like that, especially from people in positions of authority, where is the motivation to venture out and keep an open mind about the rest of the community?

That sounds like an issue for your GO and Apophis or Asch. Harassment like that has no place at TG and if your charges are true than the perpetrator ought to be stripped of their admin status to help them remember what we're all about here at TG.

[Tarenth]

There are two things to also consider when you compare forum face time between WoW/MMORPG players in TG and other TG game vets.

Time and Pace.

WoW and all the other MMORPGs in TG that people take part in take more time and run at a slower pace than the run of the mill FPS game with the TG gold standard.

Example:

If I play 2 hours of TF2 or BF2142 I'm pretty much satisfied with my play time. I've accomplished a number of full rounds of fast pace strategic, tactical, and twitch combat. Maybe to wind down I'll hit the forums and get a look at an AAR then comment on what could've been done and should've been done. If I spend 5 hours on the whole thing I would've spend 2 hours in the actual game and 3 hours on the forums.

If I play WoW then I'm spending all 5 hours on the game server itself and then maybe a few minutes hitting the WoW forums to check up on news and upcoming events. That's about it. Why? Its not because I don't want to visit the rest of the forums, its because of the time block needed to accomplish in WoW what I did and more in TF2 or BF2142. When you play those FPS games a round can last 10-20 minutes, maybe 30 if things get pushed to the limit. If I spend 20-30 minutes in WoW in a raid we might, MIGHT, get to the second boss of Black Temple and still have 7 more to go. If I'm doing solo work (which, BTW, I hate) then I may have turned in 5-6 daily quests out of the 25 I'm alotted per day. So in the time it takes to play out a fast paced hard hitting nail biting round of TF2...I've made a few gold in WoW...maybe enough to pay for 1 repair bill on a raiding night if I use cheap arrows and fish for pet food (another time sink).

So that covers time, but what about pace? Well it covers that as well. If I'm spending 10-20 minute a round in a FPS I don't have much time to type something out and get a response or hold an indepth discussion over Teamspeak (which I wouldn't do anyways because that just holds up tactical chatter). In WoW there's not that much of a time crunch. We have time to hold conversations in the game through the communication medium provided or over TS. Hell, we've even had heated debates while raiding much to the annoyance of our raid leaders (though only during trash pulls). There is no need to step back and hit the forums for our discussions because as we're trucking along we're talking all the while.

Try having a conversation in team chat in an FPS. I double dare you. Half of the time people ignore it anyways. That's why such chatter gets moved to forums so they can be seen and responded to out of the heat of the moment.


That covers the game forums. but what about outside? Well eventually the longer you stand in one place the more the urge to wander hits you. If you spend a longer time on the forums then eventually you'll exaust all the conversations in your little 'nitch' of the world and venture out to see new topics and new conversations held elsewhere. Since FPS gamers (the staple of TG) have more time since they get their 'gaming fix' faster they reach that threshold on the forums faster and thus have a heavier presence. As Aestryd opened up on the post, people on WoW get there a bit slower and don't feel the pressure to add to anything a great deal of the time. Why add 2 cents when someone better can throw down the whole $2 volume?

Then there's the vicious cycle of the FPS v MMORPG gamer that rears its head from time to time. If you play an MMORPG like WoW you DESERVE respect and rarely get it from the twitch gamers. Why? Our performances might not be as flashy as a 20 headshot string in a 20 minute round, but we've stuck through it and evolved as players with our characters for hundreds, yes HUNDREDS, of hours. You may not like the game or how its played, but respect the player for their dedication to it. MMORPG players find what they like and stick to it much like a veteran of an FPS likes their game and sticks with it.

MMORPG players are just like FPS players in that they play a game they enjoy. The dedication both put into improving their game in their respective fields is why both are a part of TG. If one side has more time to devote out of game due to the pacing of their game then there's nothing wrong with that.

...and its 3AM and I have no idea where I was going with this. -_-

[ScratchMonkey]

I started here playing BF2. I don't play WoW with TG but I do play it as my primary game now (with a guild of my friends on another server). So I have to call shenanigans on the idea that WoW is somehow unique in doing all the discussion in-game. When I was playing BF1942 here Teamspeak was very active, and the squad channels were always active in-game in BF2. Same went when I played ETQW here.

And it's not like those games don't offer significant complexity. It's for that very reason that one discusses them in forums as much as within the game.

All these games have text chat systems, as well. (Back when I played Tribes 2, it even had its own forum system inside the game!)

I don't look at the sections for other games unless a subject line really grabs me (like the demotivators that someone in the BF2 sections reported), but I do read the general game-independent sub-sections.

But I'm also one of those weirdos who plays Horde, and plays every class and profession. I want to see everything, not just a little piece of the world.

[ScratchMonkey]

Crap, I hate it when someone shoots down my points while I've been typing. Nice post, Tarenth.

[Superfast]

It's like what's been said. TG is a diverse community. Some play many games, some play few. Some are active on the forums, some are not. But also some have strong forum activity and drive as well, and that always helps activity wise. And not all games point or use the forums, and hey maybe it's not needed like some of you say.

Either way, TG is also about respecting eachother regardless of game, activity-level or whatever reason.

[Iliana]

I personally don't feel the need to venture outside of the WoW forums. I've looked around the Sandbox at some of the threads but didn't see the need to post a reply to them. Typically when I get on the internet these days I have limited time so I'd rather spend it in game rather then trolling the forums of games that I have little to no interest in. I'm not saying WoW players shouldn't venture outside to other areas of TG I'm just stating that it's not really for everyone and that choice, yes CHOICE should be respected.

That's just my 2 cents since I just so happen to be off work today and have some free time to kill.

[ScratchMonkey]

I see the Sandbox as being a forum about yet another game. This one:

http://www.tacticalgamer.com/picture...ml#post1007076

[Grunt 70]

Originally Posted by Tarenth

There are two things to also consider when you compare forum face time between WoW/MMORPG players in TG and other TG game vets.

Time and Pace.

WoW and all the other MMORPGs in TG that people take part in take more time and run at a slower pace than the run of the mill FPS game with the TG gold standard.

Except Armed Assault...but this is less a first person shooter then a reality based combat simulator. Lots of time between missions to rearm and regroup. Like in real life there is lots of down time that can be boring followed by intense periods of combat. In a few months of intense ArmA play I've made more personal connections than all of my time playing other FPS titles at TG.

Don't get me wrong. I'm not on a crusade to sway you from one game or genre to another....just some added perspective from my end.

[WhiskeySix]

Some good posts in here!!

One thing I thought I'd share, is that for you firefox users, there are a bunch of TG-specific customizations you can use to make the forums more "user friendly". Personally, I don't "read" any forums other than those I frequent, but I DO click the "new posts" button a few times a day. It's a little hard to digest in the default state, but with the SearchResultsLegend script running it's NICE... The icons and single-line layout makes really easy to take a quick glance at ALL of TG to see what's going on!







There are also scripts for your UserCP, so you can quickly see if any forums or threads you're involved in have been updated:



If you're using firefox, I HIGHLY recommend these and other useful TG-specific scripts (PM-Reply-All is another good one). This TG-wiki page has the full list: http://www.tacticalgamer.com/wiki/in...p/Greasemonkey

[Grunt 70]

W 6 is the man.

[Gambit7]

The one thing TG-WoW has that the rest of TG doesnt is a group of players generally built from the ground up FROM THE GAME. Not the other way around. That automatically makes it a niche within a niche, and is one reason why there's success in TG-WoW.

If you had a lot of folk that meandered into the many 1000's of other topics and dozens of games, you'd probably end up with less dedicated people in the guild. There's one thing I've learned, it's that generally your most dedicated and best players will come from the game's playerbase... not TGs. (with regards to MMOs)

The caveat is you'll mostly have players that dont take interest in the rest of the forums, and that's understandable - and in many ways preferred... for the latter reasons.

We cant have our cake an eat it too here. We can with some... but not with most.

These are lessons I'm taking into many of these other proposed MMO ventures for TG. I'm realizing that it's extremeley difficult to hold people's attention long enough from Day 1 to grow a successful guild. You have to take the pick of the litter from within the game at later junctures. And in doing-so, we cant expect those folks to take an active role in all of the forums. The best that can happen (and it did with TG-WoW) is a successful guild and sub-forum that attracts native TGers later on down the road... we shall dub them "hybrids"

[Tarenth]

Suilung (you bastard) muddles the point along the way. TG games ALWAYS pull strongly from the game. Take any Pubbie and give them one of the rare slots on a BF server and you'll immediately get a convert to the TG way. Suddenly they have a squad that plays together instead of 23 other people who happen to be on the same team who are more likely to knife you to get your kit than hit you with health/ammo/or a revive.

[ScratchMonkey]

An opportunity for you to stick your head outside:

http://www.tacticalgamer.com/general...character.html

It's about WoW, honest!