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  • [ANNOUNCEMENT] connected time, not score, is now our final bump factor

    As you know, a few factors combine to choose who is bumped when a player successfully joins the full server. The last of these variables was score. It's now connection time: all other factors being equal, the player who has been on the server the longest is now bumped. And that's not longest-connected on the current map, but rather across map changes (see next paragraph).

    Disconnections lasting less than 5 minutes are ignored when calculating a player's connected time. This allows for map changes (NS2 servers disconnect every player during every map change) and client crashes. Reconnections are subject to reserved slots logic, of course. But, if you get in after such a short absence, it'll be as if you never left.

    Tracked connection times are player-specific, not server-specific. So, if you spend a lot of time on one TG NS2 server and then join the other immediately (well, within 5 minutes), you're considered as having been connected the whole time.

    Extending strangers' stays on our server gives them better opportunity to discover what's special about our offering, and it gives us more time to get to know them.
    Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

    Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

  • #2
    Re: connected time, not score, is now our final bump factor

    What are the other variables?

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: connected time, not score, is now our final bump factor

      The following logic determines who's bumpable. Every player ("target") is considered bumpable unless excluded for any of these reasons:

      1) joiner is a Stranger (Strangers can't bump anyone, so every target is safe)
      2) target is Supporting Member (SMs never get bumped, ever)
      3) target is Commander (could go away in the future if gameplay tolerates it)
      4) target is one of the last two Strangers left on the server
      5) target is one of the last two PrimerOnlys left on the server
      6) joiner and target are both PrimerOnlys (PrimerOnlys are only ever bumped by Supporting Members)
      7) target is PrimerOnly and more than two Strangers are on the server (when Strangers number more than two, the server will always prefer Strangers when searching for a player to bump)

      If even a single of these is true, the target won't be bumped by the joiner. If the server can't find anyone bumpable, the joiner (including Supporting Members) is denied entry.

      Combined with the new longest-connected final bump factor, #4 and #5 incentivize Strangers and PrimerOnlys to seed the server, as they'll never be bumped (by anyone) after being the first two of their class to arrive.
      Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

      Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: connected time, not score, is now our final bump factor

        Originally posted by Wyzcrak View Post
        Combined with the new longest-connected final bump factor, #4 and #5 incentivize Strangers and PrimerOnlys to seed the server, as they'll never be bumped (by anyone) after being the first two of their class to arrive.
        Hold on, that doesn't sound right..

        If the ? or P seed the server until it's full, they would then have been connected the longest out of any other ? and P wouldn't they?
        With the new logic saying the person with the longest connection time gets bumped, doesn't this effectively mean that those seeders are the ones who will be preferred to be bumped first until the server is down to 2 each of ? and P? (Which by the time this happens, would end up being that these were the last 2 ? and P to join the server, as they'll have the shortest connection time relative to any other existing ? and P until they become ineligible for bumping.)

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        • #5
          Re: connected time, not score, is now our final bump factor

          You're right! I had it backwards.

          I'll update the code such that Strangers having one of the two longest connection times among all present Strangers will be bump-immune. I'll do the same for PrimerOnlys.

          So, #4 and #5 will change such that "last" reads as "longest-connected".

          That will make things more confusing when explaining this to people, but it will encourage non-SMs to seed, which is a very good thing.
          Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

          Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: connected time, not score, is now our final bump factor

            This is fixed.

            The Strangers (?) with the two longest connection times among Strangers are immune from reserved slots.

            The PrimerOnlys (P) with the two longest connection times among PrimerOnlys are immune from reserved slots.
            Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

            Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: connected time, not score, is now our final bump factor

              Glad I was able to help.
              That seems to make more sense now.

              With regard to the remaining P's and ?'s though, does this mean that the one with the shortest connection time is bumped, or is everyone outside of the 2 longest connected grouped together and one chosen at random?

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: connected time, not score, is now our final bump factor

                I think the old rules are now in effect because I was only on the server 20 minutes, (Taunt on Mineshaft) and had lowest score; got bumped for Knappe.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: connected time, not score, is now our final bump factor

                  The old logic is not in play. Maybe there's a defect in the new logic. Let's review how the new logic is supposed to work.

                  How many Strangers were left when you were bumped?
                  How many PrimerOnlys were left when you were bumped?

                  The following would explain your being bumped after being on the server only 20 minutes:

                  You're a PrimerOnly. Incoming player is Supporting Member.
                  Only two Strangers left. They're both protected (reason: the two Strangers with the longest-connected times among Strangers are immune to reserved slots).
                  Three PrimerOnlys left (including you). The other two have been on the server longer than you, and so they're protected (reason: the two PrimerOnlys with the longest-connected times among PrimerOnlys are immune to reserved slots).

                  Regarding that last sentence:

                  Even though the "last" factor in choosing who gets bumped is "longest-connected", there's an exception: the two Strangers with the longest-connected times among Strangers, and the two PrimerOnlys with the longest-connected times among PrimerOnlys, are immune from reserved slots (even across map changes). Beyond keeping some Strangers and PrimerOnlys on the server when it's full, this encourages Strangers and PrimerOnlys to seed the empty server.

                  If you're in for a night of gaming, and you don't help pay the bills, it definitely benefits you to show up early.

                  I'm all for discovering and fixing defects in this logic, and I'll need as much of the following data as you can manage with each bug report:

                  ) how many Strangers (including yourself) were present when you were bumped?

                  ) how many PrimerOnlys (including yourself) were present when you were bumped?

                  ) were there three other folks like you (Stranger or PrimerOnly) that had been connected longer (across map changes)? If so, the third should have been bumped (not you).
                  Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

                  Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: connected time, not score, is now our final bump factor

                    Ok this makes more sense, there were I think only 2 ?'s and 2 P's on the server not including me so that would make sense about the 2 longest. I thought it was 1 for each category and not 2.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: connected time, not score, is now our final bump factor

                      My only suggestion would be that an exception be made for people with higher life forms or in an exo suit. I was in an exo suit at the time and I was the last exo on the team. Losing a player with that much invested in the team may unbalance the game and affect the outcome. I don't know how the mod works but I know you can already make the exception with a person commanding. Once the person becomes a marine or a skulk, then they are free to be kicked.

                      I would say that since we have 7 open "waiting" slots, a supporting member could be free to wait in the ready room until a spot opens as they do presently based on the forumla of waiting for a higher life form or exo to become a basic unit again. Like I said, I have no idea if this is possible, but just an idea.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: connected time, not score, is now our final bump factor

                        The server does address this, but at the team level, not the individual player level. That is, it protects investments, not those holding them.

                        Team Res

                        Your team was compensated 75 resources (the cost of your Exo suit) for losing you. Those resources went immediately to the player replacing you.
                        Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

                        Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: connected time, not score, is now our final bump factor

                          Having an exosuit or onos suddenly disappearing off the field can seriously disrupt game play even if the joining player is given the resources for what it cost. Also, there could be situations where the marines lose all but one command chair, but still had exosuits on the field, in which case the disconnecting players exosuit is not repurchase-able.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: connected time, not score, is now our final bump factor

                            This may be involved, but is there any thought to having these "bumped" players automatically connected to the second server?

                            Or better, if there was a way to have the joiner pushed to the "less busy" server?

                            The logic (and coding, i expect) could get a lot more complicated, and creating situations generally un-likeable; maybe it's a behavioural aspect of the joiners that needs fixing.

                            Should I feel bad as a SM joining the more full server because I know it'll kick someone? Guess I'll start joining the quieter server and try to balance things out myself... =P
                            sigpic

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: connected time, not score, is now our final bump factor

                              You shouldn't feel bad. I say "seed the empty server when you can". Sometimes, you've had one of those days that needs to end with playing, not seeding. So, it's your call to make every time.

                              I don't have any plans to redirect players automatically, but it's been discussed (either here or in the admin forums -- I forget which) before, and it might get discussed again (here or in the admin forums). The main problem I have with it (above and beyond the technical challenges) is players getting surprised. Some find that disingenuous given the surprises we're already putting players through with our current reserved slots implementation, but it's not.
                              Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

                              Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

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