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A second look may be necessary...

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  • A second look may be necessary...

    I was honestly shocked at the language that is allowed in TGNS when I first started playing last week or so. While I've been informed that this language is now partially accepted, it does seem to be a little excessive.

    I'll be the first to throw out vulgarities in a conversation, but the last few nights I've heard some language from people who have signed the primer that is inexcusable.

    Please remember what you signed. It may be more accepted to use vulgarity in our server, but I'm pretty sure the words "rape" and "gay" are still unacceptable.

    While I realize a lot of you guys may not recognize me, I still believe this community is the greatest place/group to game with on the planet, and I'd like to see the standards that made it that way upheld.

    :)

    Also, it's been proven in multiple forums that if you give a human an inch, they'll take a mile. I think that this is the case with the f-bomb in our server. I realize this is likely the most widely used vulgarity, but I'm pretty sure it's still frowned upon. I've got kids, and company is here sometimes when I play NS2. I'd rather not have those people listening to mad f-bombs just because I'm playing a game in the corner. If I can be honest, aside from the quality of game play and character of people, I actually wanted to pick up NS2 because I thought TGNS2 might help to curb my vulgarity a little bit. Maybe we can work towards helping me with that goal?

    Please don't be afraid to stand up for TGNS. I've heard multiple strangers openly insult people in the server at night. While we may be seeing vulgarity a little differently than has been tradition at TGNS, I'm sure disrespect of people in our server (stranger or regular or SM alike) is highly frowned upon. You guys come back to the server every night for games that are coordinated and friendly. Let's try to make sure that the strangers understand why we continue to fill our server.

    Mom
    Games lubricate the body and the mind. - Benjamin Franklin
    Ever since the beginning, to keep the world spinning, it takes all kinds of kinds. -Miranda Lambert

    You're a 34, Mom. Thirty. Four.
    Forever Perplexed

  • #2
    Re: A second look may be necessary...

    As most of the "policing" with respect to this issue is done by community volunteers (those who have opted-in to be a T or a G) different people have different tolerances for that kind of language.
    Personally, I'll excuse an accidental drop here and there if it's heat of the moment, but if it becomes excessive or it's clearly targeted maliciously toward someone, I would take action and warn them.
    I know a few other people with similar positions, and in the case of the f-bomb dropper, there was one the other night that was kicked almost immediately. He rejoined and was pretty quiet after that.

    I wouldn't agree with a zero tolerance policy because, as I understand it, this community is supposed to be comprised of mature gamers - that means we should know if or when to use such language, and when it is not acceptable or when it crosses a line.

    As far as the P's spewing this, don't let this stop you from warning them as well as letting an admin know who the offenders are.
    I feel this is partially due to the response of most people when strangers ask about our server to simply "Sign the primer on our forum."
    This tells them one thing only: If you expend effort to paste your name and Steam ID in a forum, you get "special access" to the server.
    Nowhere in the response does it tell people to read and accept the rules.

    Personally, I don't even mention the slot - it's a privilege meant to be bestowed upon people who agree to follow the rules.
    I would simply suggest that they register for the forum and read and accept our rules if they enjoy playing on the server.

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    • #3
      Re: A second look may be necessary...

      I haven't been on as much the last few weeks, but when I do join, I've noticed this as well. We may just need this thread to remind the T's and G's that they are expected to enforce all the rules regardless of how they feel about them (tho, I would expect all T's and G's to fully support the server rules... )

      If I've witnessed a few accidental curses dropped, I'll try to mention a "friendly reminder" to the server that there is a language rule. If one person is repeatedly getting obscene with his language, he gets one direct warning, and then a kick on subsequent offences. If said person is P, they really shouldn't need repeated warnings/kicks, and if they do, we will have to look into removing their priveleges, i guess...
      sigpic

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      • #4
        Re: A second look may be necessary...

        The language doesn't really bother me (outside of racism and similar slurs), it's the attitute and demeanor that often accomponies it. Hearing some guy drop an f-bomb every other sentence really sets the tone for the rest of the game. I'm sure I'm not the only one who can sense the tension over the mic channel when some stranger comes onto your team and starts cussing often. Teamwork goes down, less of the team keeps working together over the mic. Team cohesion suffers. Those guys need a boot sometimes to get the message.

        The atmosphere on our server is generally polite and relaxed, especially among regulars to the server. Behavior shaping through example and community is superior to a pure zero tolerance policy. If somebody is mildly disrespecting somebody on the team, just politely tell him to relax a little bit and a playful reminder about the respect rules. If he starts freaking out and can't handle it, give him the boot. MOST people get the message and start to shape their behavior automatically after that.

        Not sure if any of this makes sense, but treating them with respect as a first response goes a LONG way, especially if a '?'. If its something like outright racism and such, they aren't a good fit for the server.


        I wouldn't agree with a zero tolerance policy because, as I understand it, this community is supposed to be comprised of mature gamers - that means we should know if or when to use such language, and when it is not acceptable or when it crosses a line.
        ^ This. It is a bit of an unwritten rule, but everybody can sense when somebody is getting out of hand.
        Like the server? Become a regular! TGNS Required Reading
        Answers to every server question? Yes! TGNS FAQ

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: A second look may be necessary...

          Originally posted by aeroripper View Post
          The language doesn't really bother me (outside of racism and similar slurs), it's the attitute and demeanor that often accomponies it. Hearing some guy drop an f-bomb every other sentence really sets the tone for the rest of the game. I'm sure I'm not the only one who can sense the tension over the mic channel when some stranger comes onto your team and starts cussing often. Teamwork goes down, less of the team keeps working together over the mic. Team cohesion suffers. Those guys need a boot sometimes to get the message.
          ^this is what I'm more concerned about.

          I'm not asking for a zero tolerance policy. I figure 90% of us are probably pretty vulgar with the "guys" anyway, so it's easy enough to be vulgar with people we consider a member of that "the guys" group. I just think some people are taking it to a bit of an extreme. It goes back to what I was saying. We're given an inch, and we tend to take a mile.

          Please remember that the official rules state:

          *** LANGUAGE : Free television rules apply, mostly ***
          RESPECT : Treat fellow players with respect (no slurs; (fyi))
          COMMUNICATION : If you don't communicate, you don't play here
          FOLLOW ORDERS : If COMM/KHAMM explicitly tells you to do something, do it
          TEAMWORK : A TG foundation: your team comes first (always)
          RECYCLING : Recycling at game end is not allowed. (see WinOrLose)
          EXPLOITING : Don't exploit map or other defects during gameplay.

          When you look at those rules, and you're given the ability to go slightly beyond them, the admins and SMs and people who have spent time trying to develop this atmosphere expect you to respect that leniency. Technically, as much as I've heard the f-bomb lately, the server should stay empty every night according to those rules. I don't think it's too much to ask for the language to be a bit limited. Again, not asking for a complete cutoff... but I think those who are going well beyond the rules know they're taking it too far.

          Originally posted by DarkScythe View Post
          I wouldn't agree with a zero tolerance policy because, as I understand it, this community is supposed to be comprised of mature gamers - that means we should know if or when to use such language, and when it is not acceptable or when it crosses a line.
          This, in my experience with TG, has been a common miscommunication. While we're playing kinda by ear with the vulgarity, and more than what the rules state has been accepted, it is not because we call our server Mature. Mature at TG does not mean the same thing as M on a video game. I realize you probably understand this, Dark, but I feel like a lot of people don't. I like to think of TG kinda as a work place. If I were to ever use vulgarity, it would be at a time when I knew for a solid fact that everyone on the server had no problem with it. That's what Mature means to TG, or at least how I understand it. We're mature enough to respect each other, suck up our pride, and act the way an adult should. It doesn't mean we can talk about sex or use excessive vulgarities or anything of the like.

          I guess what I'm getting at is that we're getting to a line in this leniency we've been given. That line is likely to be crossed soon. I'd say the first time Wyz comes in the server and hears 20 f-bombs in the first 10 minutes of a game, we're going to be cut off completely again. I can't blame him. So maybe we should try to tone it back a little bit before we lose all our leniency completely.

          Mom
          Games lubricate the body and the mind. - Benjamin Franklin
          Ever since the beginning, to keep the world spinning, it takes all kinds of kinds. -Miranda Lambert

          You're a 34, Mom. Thirty. Four.
          Forever Perplexed

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: A second look may be necessary...

            Originally posted by YerMom View Post
            So maybe we should try to tone it back a little bit before we lose all our leniency completely.
            This, combined with the Sensitive Ears Folks asking others for stricter self-enforcement, gets it done.

            I can speak with anyone who returns anything other than polite compliance after a polite request to tone down the language.

            Mom's right about TG's "mature" not translating to "adult language entitlement".
            Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

            Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

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            • #7
              Re: A second look may be necessary...

              I just wanted to say, if you ever hear/see me doing this please say something. I know my mouth sometimes gets way ahead of my brain and unfortunate things come out of it.


              I do have to point out that its a guy who picked a your mom reference as a name who started this, that made me laugh.

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              • #8
                Re: A second look may be necessary...

                :)
                Games lubricate the body and the mind. - Benjamin Franklin
                Ever since the beginning, to keep the world spinning, it takes all kinds of kinds. -Miranda Lambert

                You're a 34, Mom. Thirty. Four.
                Forever Perplexed

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: A second look may be necessary...

                  Most of you know I try my best to police the unruly players on the server, but i'm not on the server all the time. I started a thread a few weeks ago and hoped it would wake up the few people that have opted into the guardian and temp admin role to play a more active part in keeping players in check; I can only hope that this thread will help accomplish the same goal.

                  Normally I give a warning to any offenders and have to remind members they agreed to the TG rules. After the warning, they get booted for a second offense but most of the time people understand my seriousness and obey the rules.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: A second look may be necessary...

                    I'm not sure if it was a product of this post, or just a coincidence that the vulgarity has been held back the last couple nights.

                    For those of you who heard my request, I'd like to say thank you.

                    I may even go so far as to say that the gg's we've been having of late may have been a product of a lack of excessive vulgarity. :)

                    Mom
                    Games lubricate the body and the mind. - Benjamin Franklin
                    Ever since the beginning, to keep the world spinning, it takes all kinds of kinds. -Miranda Lambert

                    You're a 34, Mom. Thirty. Four.
                    Forever Perplexed

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: A second look may be necessary...

                      That and a lot of kids started school today

                      Comment

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