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What's with the extreme hate of eclipse?

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  • What's with the extreme hate of eclipse?

    Veil was another popular NS1 map that has its own quirks, but doesn't incite the same level of antipathy that eclipse has (even then). I remember there being a similar period for a few months after veil was initially released much aching/complaining about how it was broken. Nowadays I'd say it enjoys the same level of rotation popularity it did back in NS1 now that people generally understand how to play it. Rule of thumb is if you have 2 decent teams, its going to be a long back and forth game on that map.

    Eclipse also has its own quirks that take some time to get used to. There is a lot of sharp corridors that you have to watch as marine. Being aggressive in the early game is paramount (moreso than other maps). If you can pressure both south loop and generator you will box the aliens in and severely cut off their res supply. If you manage to get a somewhat early PG in eclipse with mines you're in a much better position to push out and harass generator and defend alpha/triad on that side. Get a PG in keyhole after that and you can harass south loop and cap 2 nodes. Lots of great spots for ARCing alien nodes too. Also gotta love putting that obs in front of the comm chair to cover both entrances at once!

    I think a few months down the line eclipse will become more popular than it currently is, although, the same can't be said for biodome.
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  • #2
    Re: What's with the extreme hate of eclipse?

    Originally posted by aeroripper View Post
    Veil was another popular NS1 map that has its own quirks, but doesn't incite the same level of antipathy that eclipse has (even then). I remember there being a similar period for a few months after veil was initially released much aching/complaining about how it was broken. Nowadays I'd say it enjoys the same level of rotation popularity it did back in NS1 now that people generally understand how to play it. Rule of thumb is if you have 2 decent teams, its going to be a long back and forth game on that map.

    Eclipse also has its own quirks that take some time to get used to. There is a lot of sharp corridors that you have to watch as marine. Being aggressive in the early game is paramount (moreso than other maps). If you can pressure both south loop and generator you will box the aliens in and severely cut off their res supply. If you manage to get a somewhat early PG in eclipse with mines you're in a much better position to push out and harass generator and defend alpha/triad on that side. Get a PG in keyhole after that and you can harass south loop and cap 2 nodes. Lots of great spots for ARCing alien nodes too. Also gotta love putting that obs in front of the comm chair to cover both entrances at once!

    I think a few months down the line eclipse will become more popular than it currently is, although, the same can't be said for biodome.
    It's a very alien-favored map. Marines only have one res node close to them (Access Alpha) and the next to are pretty ridiculously far away (Triad and Keyhole). Even if marines can manage to cap them, it's extremely difficult to hold them for very long as there are just SO many ways for aliens to get around the map. While I have seen marines win on this map before, it's only been under very unfair circumstances (i.e. far more skill on marines), and those haven't been "good" matches for either team... (stompin or rollin...)

    The comparison to Veil is pretty unfair. Veil allows for a huge diversity of strategies: do marines rush nano? do they run to sub or pipe? Early phase in dome or system? etc) whereas with Eclipse, your options are much more limited.

    I don't understand the Biodome hate... I like it! Yea it's an unapologetic ripoff of Summit, but that's about it for me as far as criticisms about Biodome go, though I can understand people having performance issues on it :( .

    Until they fix Eclipse (seriously... move friggen keyhole to horseshoe... that would HELP) I don't have any desire to play it... Caged before Eclipse! Someone earlier tonight proposed removing it from regular map cycle for the time being, and I an 100% for that.

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    • #3
      Re: What's with the extreme hate of eclipse?

      I've seen some clever tactics on rhine's side that did made this map feel a lot more marine-favored. I've also won this map with rookies and veterans alike the same way you'd win a Docking map.
      I'm pretty much the same way as aeroripper. It's a learning experience.

      As for removing it from the map cycle, I'm not exactly for that...

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      • #4
        Re: What's with the extreme hate of eclipse?

        Yeah, I agree with the current Eclipse hate and I didn't play NS1 at all so I have no nostalgic feelings either way. The map itself just has some issues which make for gameplay similar to aliens going Shade hive first (to barrow a good point Wyz made about Shade..) it's often fun for either one team or the other but almost never fun for both teams. I feel that Eclipse is the same way, either it's a standard game where Aliens have free access to most Marine RTs (as has been mentioned above) or the Marines actually win early engagements and box the Aliens in for a marine win. After having played Eclipse probably >25 times now I'd say only 3 of those could have really been called a "gg" if I were being objective. The maps itself just needs a bit of tweaking, imo (and most of the changes have already been brought up in game and in this forums - aka, need at least one natural RT for marines and need a few alien biased corridors changed.
        Last edited by FARVA; 01-28-2014, 10:29 AM.

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        • #5
          Re: What's with the extreme hate of eclipse?

          I can do minor edits for the map if you guys think its needed.

          What I'd like to see if you want me to...

          Play the map in a Captains game. Give it hell. Find out exactly what is and isn't working. If its just move a node here or there or add a node, then that's np. Can be done in like an hour, tops. If it's OMG HORSESHOE SHOULD BE TWICE AS LARGE AND HAVE A TECH POINT LOLOLOL then it's going to take me a considerable amount of time. Tanith has proven that to me. I'm in the process of rebuilding Marine Start from scratch cuz I can't get the stupid floor to not be non-existent.

          Mom
          Games lubricate the body and the mind. - Benjamin Franklin
          Ever since the beginning, to keep the world spinning, it takes all kinds of kinds. -Miranda Lambert

          You're a 34, Mom. Thirty. Four.
          Forever Perplexed

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          • #6
            Re: What's with the extreme hate of eclipse?

            Originally posted by YerMom View Post
            I can't get the stupid floor to not be non-existent.
            It's a glass floor. That glass IIRC is invisible unless you're in the shaded-view mode.

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            • #7
              Re: What's with the extreme hate of eclipse?

              No, no.

              I mean it doesn't exist anymore in game. As in, when I try to place structures on it, they go through it. When I add it to commanderbuild it disappears. When I create a new face under it and add that to commanderbuild half the room disappears. It makes no sense. All I can figure is that the way he had it made got bugged out somewhere between all the changes I've made. So I'm working on making a new marine start. I'd say it's like... 15% done so far. Too little time, too much to do.

              Mom
              Games lubricate the body and the mind. - Benjamin Franklin
              Ever since the beginning, to keep the world spinning, it takes all kinds of kinds. -Miranda Lambert

              You're a 34, Mom. Thirty. Four.
              Forever Perplexed

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: What's with the extreme hate of eclipse?

                I overall like this map and it does introduce some commander tactics that are viable which are not found on other maps; 1st or 2nd shade hive and early arcing.
                I think most people dislike it because it seems to be Alien biased with the tight hallways but the counter to that is to try and be as quiet as possible as a marine. On another note as a marine you can't just run down a hallway with your buddies and hope to survive; having marines staggered a reasonable distance apart when going down hallways allows one marine(s) to act as a speed bump (being attacked / killed) while those behind have distance to kill.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: What's with the extreme hate of eclipse?

                  I overall like this map and it does introduce some commander tactics that are viable which are not found on other maps; 1st or 2nd shade hive and early arcing.
                  I think most people dislike it because it seems to be Alien biased with the tight hallways but the counter to that is to try and be as quiet as possible as a marine. On another note as a marine you can't just run down a hallway with your buddies and hope to survive; having marines staggered a reasonable distance apart when going down hallways allows one marine(s) to act as a speed bump (being attacked / killed) while those behind have distance to kill.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: What's with the extreme hate of eclipse?

                    if i recall, in ns1 you were able to weld the vents shut which limited alien mobility, can't do that here tends to make eclipse a much more alien sided map
                    There can be no greater pride than the egotism to quote yourself in an internet forum signature -Geriatric

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