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  • Captains Vote

    Hey guys! Back with another silly idea. What if we adjusted the Captain's voting system to the following.

    -----

    Initially, you cannot vote sh_iwantcaptains.

    It will return the message:
    There must be two captains to initiate a vote
    So, in order to start the process, two people must first opt in to be a captain. Only sh_iwillcaptain will start the process. Once a player has opted in to be a captain, a message states:
    rad4Christ has opted to be a Captain, 1 more captain needed to start vote.
    This optin has a silent 5 minute timeout, and maybe it makes a green mark by his/her name on scoreboard to minimize spammy text messages.
    Once another player opts in to captain, the general vote begins.

    rad4Christ and miragezors want to play a Captain's Match. Opt in! (2/12)
    Standard timers for voting now apply. Then once critical mass is reached, boom it starts.

    -----

    Why I like this idea:
    • No one can just start a Captain's vote out of nowhere. For a player to opt in to be a captain, it infers open conversation in the server has commenced. This gives players UNFAMILIAR to the concept time to ask questions, and for there to be a better idea of how many WANT to play a captains match.
    • This removes the oft spammed voting at mapchange of most evening games. People like to play Captain's games. That's awesome. Initiating a vote that blows away all text chat and cover 1/3 of the screen without talking to other players on the server, and then watching it fail as no one wants to step up to the role of team Captains gets old. Especially when we sit in RR for 2 minutes discussing whether it'll pass, while players not common to our server leave because most of the server is idling in the RR.
    • This will, I hope, persuade more people to step up to lead a Captain's Game, and get to know our playerbase more. We have a lot of players who love captains, but know very little of their fellow players' strengths and abilities. As more people take on the role of team captain, they will also be more aware of fellow players and future teams will have more balance.
    • Captains night always overfull? People want to play, but we all wait on mirage to tell us when to vote? Then we all vote and wait on someone to reluctantly captain? Well, if we need Captain's FIRST, then it give people more opportunity to step up. Want to get this party started? (wo)Man up and lead it! Then it's not about who can spam I want to play, as much as whomever will pick up the mantle and move it forward.


    Just a silly idea, but I thought I'd throw it out there.

  • #2
    Re: Captains Vote

    I like the idea, but I'll have to defer to Wyz for technical limitations. I now have a new command available to me that prevents voting until I allow it, so it should stop the connection chaos before someone accidentally triggers a vote.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Captains Vote

      That's approachable technically, but it's enough effort that I'd like some more consensus here around it.
      Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

      Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Captains Vote

        This sounds like a really good idea to me. It will make the whole process smoother.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Captains Vote

          1) I like this idea.

          2) Since we're on the topic, should it be necessary to opt-in for captains games in order to play them? I think a minimum of 14 votes (+2 Capt) should be required to begin Captains mode, but why is it necessary to opt-in in order to play? Since there is a 8-player limit on the teams, can't we just allow the captains to pick whomever they wish from the server, leaving the unpicked to sit out this round? I find that a better alternative to excluding the players slowest to spam iwantcaptains. Asking players who wish not play to spectate could alleviate any accidental picks. If the issue is having players trolling and joining a side w/o being picked my counterargument is, 80% of the players can already do that now if they want. Also, the unpicked players will not know they are unpicked until the teams are full. If the issue is the 'fat kid' that never gets chosen, I think we can be democratic enough to handle it properly.

          3) Can we make opt-in timer a little longer? Or set the timer to ~20 seconds and have it reset to 20 seconds each time a new player opts in, thus keeping the timer alive as more people continue to join? (Though I suspect this issue is nearly moot if we choose the two captains first.)
          -- P> Singularity

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Captains Vote

            I brought this up in the server and we tried it out a night or two ago. Wyz volunteered, and mirage reluctantly did. I said I'd support that pairing, and we started the voting. I thought it worked very well. I'd love to hear other people's perception of it. I know mirage, Wyz, and Re-traced at least were there.

            I agree with you on your points. I also feel that as it stands the captains selection is kind of like drawing out of a hat, as opposed to what it was in NS1 where the captains were discussed. Since the captain selection is so critical to captains mode, it seems to me that it should have more prominence as opposed to how it is treated almost as an after-thought now. This also gives the opportunity to actually discuss who the captains will be prior to enabling which can mean that less familiar captains could be chosen (it wouldn't be A>Wyz vs. P>OnlyPlayed10GamesAlmostStranger) and balanced against. It also means if someone like denalb wants to captain, we could ensure the other captain is of similar skill to help keep the teams even.
            remi.D

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Captains Vote

              In theory, this sounds great.

              However, my problem with this, and really it feels like we tend to gravitate toward this fairly often as of late for whatever reason, is that we are attempting to code in some process that is easily achieved via basic communication.
              You specifically mention last night, and I was there as well when Wyz and mirage volunteered. There was absolutely nothing stopping us from discussing that at that particular moment, nor was there anything slowing us down from doing that. In essence, we already /can/ have people pipe up and volunteer to be Captains before initiating the vote.

              Yes, coding in such a change will /enforce/ the idea of having Captains before voting, but as Wyz says, it is extra work involved in creating, testing, deploying, and maintaining such code. Is it worth the effort to code it when we can simply try to train people to speak to each other before voting?

              "Hey guys, I want to try playing a Captain's game. Anyone want to be a Captain?"
              "Sure, yeah I'm up for it. I don't really want to be a Captain, though."
              "Eh, why not, I'll do it. Anyone else?"
              "What's a Captain's game?"
              "Oh, it's this thing we have on this server that's like a PUG on a pub."
              "Ahh, okay, sounds interesting."
              "We still need another Captain, though"
              "Well, I guess I can do it."
              "All right, let's give the vote a shot and see. Everyone, hit M > Captain's, please."
              -Inevitably-
              "Come on, one more vote! One more!!"

              All that can be done inside of 15-20 seconds.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Captains Vote

                Above post has been deemed amazing.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Captains Vote

                  Originally posted by DarkScythe View Post
                  Above post has been deemed amazing.
                  Although we can always train our community, it's even better when new people to the server don't need to be trained because the desired behaviors automatically emerge from the system we have designed. The flip side of this is that if the plugin as implemented is causing negative behaviors to emerge, we are constantly needing to fight/train against them as a community which causes more social friction and barrier to entry for new players to our community. Yes it's more code work but I think the value you get out of a harmonious system is worth it, and I believe is part of what motivates Wyz* to keep improving upon these systems instead of just having admins enforce and train our users with more and more social rules.

                  *sorry if this is totally off-base, Wyz.
                  remi.D

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Captains Vote

                    I'm mostly motivated by the undulating praise and ass-kissing. The whole "community" thing is a distant second.
                    Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

                    Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Captains Vote

                      Originally posted by wyzcrak View Post
                      i'm mostly motivated by the undulating praise and ass-kissing. The whole "community" thing is a distant second.
                      :.D

                      edit: Wow. It won't let me make a smiley face without a period for a nose.
                      remi.D

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Captains Vote

                        I like this idea.
                        aka Roland tHTG

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Captains Vote

                          Originally posted by bentring View Post
                          I like this idea.

                          Ditto, i think it will help get things moving along faster and more ppl will opt in for talking the captain role.
                          Kalost_tpf/twitch.tv

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Captains Vote

                            I would like to add in an idea here for Captain nights, as we often end up with quite a few people that can't play due to player counts.

                            Rather then require everyone to vote for Captains, when the Roland rule is activated. Only the two captains can vote in to be captains. As soon as the second one votes in, a 30 second or so countdown starts, were afterwards everyone that is not in spectator is assumed to want to play captains.

                            Then randomly, the lesser of 14 or the number of players on the server not in spectator are selected to be allowed to play in that game of captains.

                            Everyone else is told to join spec if they wish to watch the game, as they were not selected as a player in this game. Should someone that is chosen leave before the game starts (AFK kick for example) or has been in spectator for more then 5-10 seconds, then a new person still in the ready room will be given the slot. Allow for an Admin command to disable that if someone needs to rejoin for a reason. This behavior is disabled as soon as the first round starts.

                            After the game starts, I want Captain votes works as it does now, so should a player drop and not be able to return for some critical reason. We would be able to add people in as needed.
                            Current game name : Lost, Phantom Thief

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Captains Vote

                              Captains must now opt-in before players are allowed to. Please provide feedback/defects.
                              Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

                              Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

                              Comment

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