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Captain's Night 9/5

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  • #16
    Re: Captain's Night 9/5

    I editted the post above quite a bit, should give you some more info.

    Your "level" is only impacted by play-time, in a similar type of curve as you'd expect from RPG games (as you go up in level, you need to play longer to go up again).
    remi.D

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    • #17
      Re: Captain's Night 9/5

      2.Nothing you do during the round other than winning the game has any effect on your skill level. This means that there’s no incentive to rack up kills at the end of the game rather than finishing it, or to play skulk instead of gorge, or to go offense rather than build.

      This property of the skill model is what concerns me the most. Essentially the only factors that affect your "skill level" is how long you play a game and whether or not you won on that team. There is nothing to balance out the fact that you could essentially be carried by your team in which you just stand in a corner until the round is won and your skill goes up; by which you haven't contributed at all but your skill still goes up. How does the skill score counterbalance that?

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      • #18
        Re: Captain's Night 9/5

        Hey now. Some of us like being carried by the team.
        Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

        Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

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        • #19
          Re: Captain's Night 9/5

          That's the same as how NS1 TG balance worked, iirc (and I remember being on the opposite side of this argument with Wyz back 10 years ago). If you are someone who frequently carries, your W:L ratio will be better, and your skill will be going up.
          remi.D

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          • #20
            Re: Captain's Night 9/5

            I also would love to have a "Was that a good game?" or "Did those teams feel balanced?" "yes"/"no" query at the end of games recording the info about the team, the length of the game, etc. I'm betting some interesting trends could be spotted (like players on the winning team are more likely to think the teams are balanced).
            "If you would like to participate in our survey please stay on the line after you speak with the representative."

            There's no perfect balance system as there are too many variables to factor. unfortunately we don't have a "batting average".

            How does ns2 stats measure skill?
            how does tgns balance? Spm is what exactly? point based? w:l?

            Maybe we could some how combine all of these for an average? it may provide a more accurate picture assuming there is enough data.

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            • #21
              Re: Captain's Night 9/5

              correct, i've watch a good handfun of games were people complain about "stacks" but then the underdog wins. it doesnt mean the game is over, but rather that you might have to approach it different.. and communicate.

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              • #22
                Re: Captain's Night 9/5

                I think morale is the bigger killer when teams don't seem balanced.

                Is there any way we can eliminate the morale shock from seeing teams that do not seem balanced? Can we hide the scoreboard till the round is live? Or... only display the player's team on the board after balance?

                ^jack - I think you are replying to a post I deleted... but I know what you mean. Lol.

                Mom
                Games lubricate the body and the mind. - Benjamin Franklin
                Ever since the beginning, to keep the world spinning, it takes all kinds of kinds. -Miranda Lambert

                You're a 34, Mom. Thirty. Four.
                Forever Perplexed

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                • #23
                  Re: Captain's Night 9/5

                  I don't see us hiding or pruning the scoreboard toward this effort.
                  Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

                  Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Re: Captain's Night 9/5

                    Hiding the scoreboard can have ill effect since there are often times that people disconnect for whatever reason and we need to postpone the start of a game to accommodate.

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                    • #25
                      Re: Captain's Night 9/5

                      Yeah.

                      In hind sight, I cautioned Wyz just the other night about trying to automate something we should be solving socially. The morale thing kinda falls into that, too. I don't see a solution for it, personally.

                      Mom
                      Games lubricate the body and the mind. - Benjamin Franklin
                      Ever since the beginning, to keep the world spinning, it takes all kinds of kinds. -Miranda Lambert

                      You're a 34, Mom. Thirty. Four.
                      Forever Perplexed

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Re: Captain's Night 9/5

                        [MENTION=11204]blu.knight[/MENTION] can you explain the difference between skill and level?

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                        • #27
                          Re: Captain's Night 9/5

                          Your "level" is only impacted by play-time, in a similar type of curve as you'd expect from RPG games (as you go up in level, you need to play longer to go up again).
                          Level only ever goes up, and is only reflective of (hive tracked games) play-time.

                          Your skill number is in effect how likely your team is to win with you on it. Or that may be an oversimplification, and it might be better to say your skill is representing the amount your being on a team will effect the outcome based on the amount of time you're on the team. See here for the formula used in "the basic model":
                          A Skill Ranking System for Natural Selection 2 | Ryan Moulton's Articles
                          Your skill will go up and down when you win or lose based on the makeup of the teams. Mine went up from 1109 to 1254 during captains night, and over the weekend it has gone up to 1400. It will stop increasing (or may decrease) as it gets to be a closer indicator of my "value" to predicting the outcome of a team.
                          remi.D

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