Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Alien Res Dividing Plugin

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Alien Res Dividing Plugin

    This plugin needs some revision. You know, the one that takes the res of someone who leaves and distributes it amongst the team. I just lost a game as aliens because the hive saver was disconnected, and had all his res taken away even though he rejoined 15 seconds later; even with the distribution there was still no one else close to being able to drop it. Can we add a 30 second timer or something before the res is removed from a player if he doesn't rejoin?

  • #2
    Re: Alien Res Dividing Plugin

    That's possible.

    Given the effort required, however, I'd want several people to weigh in and say this is necessary (not merely that they're apathetic one way or another) based on having been the victim of this problem regularly.
    Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

    Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Alien Res Dividing Plugin

      <player>
      The plugin has no way of knowing whether or not someone is coming back. And 30 seconds can be an eternity, even if a player does return from a random network glitch.

      I'd much rather have that res immediately available to do SOMETHING for the team that remains on the server.
      </player>
      [volun2]
      NS Game Officer. TF2 Admin. BF2 Admin / Scripter. PM with issues.
      Tempus: Pokerface is nailing it right on the head. Everyone who is arguing against him is simply arguing against reality.
      <anmuzi> it is not permitted to have privacy or anonymity
      <LazyEye> yeah when I play on TG the server digs though my trash

      Arm yourself with knowledge: TG NS TF2 BF2

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Alien Res Dividing Plugin

        The amount of time is negotiable but the idea of delaying the res redistribution really appeals to me. This would also (somewhat) salvage the games that are completely destroyed by several people being disconnecting at the same time by that infamous steam error.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Alien Res Dividing Plugin

          I'm certainly not worried about designing around that bug, as, while it does happen enough to be damned annoying, it doesn't happen often enough to justify a redesign of a resources plugin. I often (not always, I guess, but usually) change the map when that happens -- the game is shot anyway.
          Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

          Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Alien Res Dividing Plugin

            Would it be possible to make it detect if a player quits (quit in the console, diconnect from the menu), or gets a network glitch or something?

            Chewy: i was paraphrasomg
            [19:01] Chewy: KAMER |
            [19:01] Chewy: i love you | Drake_Anra : I only have a problem when Kamer talks... /// Chewy : That's very much a universal problem, Drake. :D

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Alien Res Dividing Plugin

              What if the player that leaves, his res goes to the next player to join the server? The player joining the server then doesnt start with 0 res and only good for node chomping and dying but rather the new player would just take over the previous player's position. Think this is possible?

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Alien Res Dividing Plugin

                What if the player that leaves, his res goes to the next player to join the server? The player joining the server then doesnt start with 0 res and only good for node chomping and dying but rather the new player would just take over the previous player's position. Think this is possible?
                This is a "nice" idea, but I don't know how effective it would be in game. I'd rather see the res just redistribute to the entire team as it does now.

                No, say the next player to join is not a team player and decides to fade with the nice 50+ res he got when he joined and then because he is not very good he dies straight away, not only did you lose the hive but also the 50 res.
                This shouldn't be a problem, at all. If he is a regular, he should know better or will get banned. If he is an unregistered player, he will probably be communicated with (this requires his team to talk to him, if they don't step up then they will lose) and if he refuses to play by our rules he will be removed.
                USAR

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Alien Res Dividing Plugin

                  Originally posted by ----paranoid----
                  No, say the next player to join is not a team player and decides to fade with the nice 50+ res he got when he joined and then because he is not very good he dies straight away, not only did you lose the hive but also the 50 res.

                  NS games always have people leave and join, sometimes it hurts the alien team, sometimes it doesn't. I would leave it as is because at least the res doesn't get wasted and the alien team then have to re-organise who does what.

                  I thought the plugin was designed to not cripple the alien team if someone whores the res and then got kicked for it and the res got divided, maybe the plugin could be designed to produce a vote menu about who gets all the res and then the alien team can pick 1 person to receive all the res so a hive can be dropped or a fade can come into play. If the above can't be done I don't think it is worth changing as I don't see this as a big problem.
                  Even worse with the res going to the next peson to join is the realistic possibility that no one joins for a while.

                  When people get disconnected bad things can happen. A commander can get disconnected and there might not be any marines near marine start to hop in for more than 30 seconds, which can sometimes cripple the marines if it happens at a key point.

                  I think if we attempted to change this plugin too much we might make it useful in some scenarios, and strip it of it's usefulness in others.

                  There will always be scenarios where people getting disconnected will be a problem. What if someone just gestated into a fade or onos? Then the other team doesn't even get to share the res.

                  My vote personally is to keep the plugin as it is, and to be glad we get any res at all when someone disconnects. I have seen this happen at least once, but probably only two or three times since I have been here (at least when I have been on the alien team) where the person saving for hive gets disconnected. I think since the majority of time when someone gets disconnected they are not the only one able to drop the hive, this scenario isn't the one that should be addressed specifically over more common ones.

                  If you give all the res to one player, then if someone gets disconnected early in the game (25-30 res) someone will instantly be able to drop the hive or fade. The reason the res is given out evenly is to reflect how the aliens would have otherwise recieved it had the person who was disconnected not been there. Aliens aren't meant to get large amounts of res in small amounts of time.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Alien Res Dividing Plugin

                    The plugin, since it was released, has been designed such that it doesn't activate until the point in the game at which incoming alien players no longer receive 25 resources for free (mp_latejointime -- configurable; 90 seconds on our server). So, Irish's concern (that one) is moot.

                    paranoid, I'll tell your idea what I told DON's (he wanted to design around the Steam bug): I'm not going to design around a bug. That is: while it may be imperfect, we have proven solutions already in place for non-team players. They need only be used. When those solutions fail, I think it's safe to say it's an exception that doesn't warrant further plugin design. That is: as a rule, we've got the "team player" thing locked up.

                    I can technically do with this just about anything you guys can think of. I can make it smart enough to make decisions based on SteamIDs, I can save the cash for the next incoming guy unless no one shows for 72.8 seconds... whatever. Brainstorm all you want.

                    If we decide to leave it alone, I'm game. If we decide to change it, it will be because there's consensus.

                    Because, if there's anything you've learned about me, it's that I don't just throw crap on you guys without warning.
                    Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

                    Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Alien Res Dividing Plugin

                      Originally posted by Wyzcrak
                      (he wanted to design around the Steam bug)
                      Not at all. I simply like the idea that Zek originally posted and I think it is a perfectly acceptable compromise (and an improvement, IMO) between the way the game was designed and how the res plugin alters it. I brought up the steam disconnect error as an added bonus to the effects of a time delay.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Alien Res Dividing Plugin

                        Understood.
                        Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

                        Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Alien Res Dividing Plugin

                          While reading all the posts here, my opinion has swayed back and forth and I have even gotten a few ideas for changes... But by the end of my reading, I think the average winning concept in my mind is to leave the pluggin alone. It isn't by much though.

                          Theres alot to consider here including whats fair, what isnt, whats logical, and what could be abused or exploited if not monitored.

                          It may be a bad one, but here is my idea---------------------------------------------------------
                          pluggin follows these criteria:
                          1. plug checks player class of the dropped player (P)
                          2. plug redistributes res dependant on the class of the dropped player (P)
                          3. IF (P) = skulk,___Res is distributed evenly across the team.
                          4. IF (P) = Gorge,___Res is given in entirety to 1 existing random gorge, or if no other gorge exists, evenly across the team (or to 1 random lowest lifeform).
                          5. IF (P) = Lerk,___15 Res from (R) given to 1 random lowest life form, remainder evenly to the team
                          6. IF (P) = Fade,___30 Res from (R) given to 1 random lowest life form, remainder evenly to the team
                          7. IF (P) = Onos,___45 Res from (R) given to 1 random lowest life form, remainder evenly to the team
                          8. The res count (R) used for redistribution in cases 5,6,7 would be equal to the players total available res + 50% the upgrade cost of thier current evolution class.

                          --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

                          Thats the best I could come up with at the moment without drastically affecting the outcome of a game due to player drop. It may be a good idea, or a good idea with some variations, or a bad idea all together, but thats what I got right now if anyone doesnt like the idea of just leaving the plug as is.
                          _________
                          &lt;OP8-322>
                          %#^^^#%

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Alien Res Dividing Plugin

                            Oh... Sorry for the double post and I could have edited this in on the end of the first, but think it's better as a second seperate idea.

                            -On the topic of game spoiling player losses,
                            assuming it is at least semi possible to predict if a player consiously leaves the game or is "unnaturally" dropped, A Marine side function to the plug or seperate plug may be worthwhile.

                            --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                            1. Plug determines if (P) Player was commander
                            2. If (P) = not commander,___ plug observes outfitting (C) cost of (P)
                            3. If (C) = <14,___ No action taken (possibly 1 sub-hmg weapon, or equiped mines, etc.)
                            4. If (C) = 15-25,___10 res restocked to marine pool.
                            5. If (C) = >26,___ 50-80% (C) is restocked to the pool.
                            6. IF (P) = Commander,___perform sequence at times:
                            start at 0 seconds- Display centered message "COMMANDER DROPPED" for 20 seconds.
                            start at 5 seconds- Disable attacking and build inputs for both teams for 15 seconds.
                            start at 20 seconds- enable attacking and build inputs for both teams.
                            start at 20 seconds- Display centered message "RESUMING GAME" for 5 seconds.
                            --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

                            Section 6. would provide 5 seconds for the rines to realize whats going on, and 15 seconds for a replacement COM to start a mad dash for the com chair without being attacked or giving the aliens time to unfairly build. Then, after the build/attack functions were restored a breif message would reinforce that gameplay had resumed. The idea is to basically pause the game but still let the decided player run for the chair. I think Wyz could use a modified version of the "Pre-Captains game" plug to do this.
                            The other parts would help buffer the cost of losing players with various levels of equiptment while paying minimal interest in vanilla marines and considerable compensation for full blown HA/JP marines with heavy weapons based on cost.

                            Ok. Once again, it might not be a good idea, but I figured I'd type it out to see if it got any bites.
                            _________
                            &lt;OP8-322>
                            %#^^^#%

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Alien Res Dividing Plugin

                              Honestly, what I'd like to see on marine side is just for whatever the marine was carrying to drop on the ground just as if he had died. I don't know how feasable that is, as that requires checking his position as well as his equipment, and spawning new equipment (or possibly some more arcane workaround), but it seems the most fair.

                              Comment

                              Connect

                              Collapse

                              TeamSpeak 3 Server

                              Collapse

                              Advertisement

                              Collapse

                              Twitter Feed

                              Collapse

                              Working...
                              X