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  • New to TG + a question

    I stumbled onto the NS Tactical Gamer server this past weekend and was very impressed by the teamwork, hospitality, and patience of the players. I've found a new gaming home!

    About me: I'm a 35 y.o. gamer who likes to play just about anything on Steam. I've played NS on public servers but never in a structured style like TG offers. Once I get some $$ put aside I plan on subscribing.

    Now my question: When playing the marines, I noticed the commander does not build any turrets around the command chair. Why is that? Is it because the resources are better spent on other things?

  • #2
    Re: New to TG + a question

    I can not answer your question but Welcome to Tg. When you get a chance please read our rules and SOP's.


    18th SF Operational Detachment Delta

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    • #3
      Re: New to TG + a question

      Originally posted by Capt Quark
      I stumbled onto the NS Tactical Gamer server this past weekend and was very impressed by the teamwork, hospitality, and patience of the players. I've found a new gaming home!

      About me: I'm a 35 y.o. gamer who likes to play just about anything on Steam. I've played NS on public servers but never in a structured style like TG offers. Once I get some $$ put aside I plan on subscribing.

      Now my question: When playing the marines, I noticed the commander does not build any turrets around the command chair. Why is that? Is it because the resources are better spent on other things?
      Welcome to TG. :)

      To answer your question: generally, yes. The command chair and the area around it are where marines spawn, and if it's the map's Marine Start, where they'll beacon to. Marines are better shots and cheaper than turrets, and there's usually a more cost-effective way to spend your res (particularly in the early game) than to turret up your base. An exception would be for relocates; lacking the ability to beacon, the tradeoff is generally a justifiable one.
      [volun2]
      NS Game Officer. TF2 Admin. BF2 Admin / Scripter. PM with issues.
      Tempus: Pokerface is nailing it right on the head. Everyone who is arguing against him is simply arguing against reality.
      <anmuzi> it is not permitted to have privacy or anonymity
      <LazyEye> yeah when I play on TG the server digs though my trash

      Arm yourself with knowledge: TG NS TF2 BF2

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      • #4
        Re: New to TG + a question

        @ Capt Quark, welcome to TG, enjoy your stay, and dont let me scare you off.

        A bit off topic but @ Pokerface, I thought turrets had god-like aim.

        Chewy: i was paraphrasomg
        [19:01] Chewy: KAMER |
        [19:01] Chewy: i love you | Drake_Anra : I only have a problem when Kamer talks... /// Chewy : That's very much a universal problem, Drake. :D

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        • #5
          Re: New to TG + a question

          Originally posted by Kamer
          @ Capt Quark, welcome to TG, enjoy your stay, and dont let me scare you off.

          A bit off topic but @ Pokerface, I thought turrets had god-like aim.
          Aim-wise, they're pretty spiffy. Rate of Fire, not so much.

          I'll take one marine over three turrets any given day. And that's a savings of 45 res (TF + 3Ts), meaning I can make that marine take more damage AND shoot for more damage.
          [volun2]
          NS Game Officer. TF2 Admin. BF2 Admin / Scripter. PM with issues.
          Tempus: Pokerface is nailing it right on the head. Everyone who is arguing against him is simply arguing against reality.
          <anmuzi> it is not permitted to have privacy or anonymity
          <LazyEye> yeah when I play on TG the server digs though my trash

          Arm yourself with knowledge: TG NS TF2 BF2

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: New to TG + a question

            But marines don't always tell you when they are firing at the enemy :p.

            Turrets tend to be most effective early game, but too expensive to bother with. Once there are fades an oni about, the turrets don't usually last.

            They are good for helping lock down a hive (buys time for marines to get there through the pg to defend it) and sometimes as added support during sieges (you already have the tf there...).

            Almost always a shotgun is a better buy than a turret. You give one shotgun to a group of three marines, and even if the one guy dies the others will pick it up.

            Shotguns are also more effective against higher life forms than turrets are.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: New to TG + a question

              Originally posted by Capt Quark
              I stumbled onto the NS Tactical Gamer server this past weekend and was very impressed by the teamwork, hospitality, and patience of the players. I've found a new gaming home!

              About me: I'm a 35 y.o. gamer who likes to play just about anything on Steam. I've played NS on public servers but never in a structured style like TG offers. Once I get some $$ put aside I plan on subscribing.

              Now my question: When playing the marines, I noticed the commander does not build any turrets around the command chair. Why is that? Is it because the resources are better spent on other things?
              Hey quark, welcome :D.

              There are lots and lots of different strategies in NS but turrets in base almost always is a bad idea. Mostly because you should be able to have marines there, or watch base closely enough to know when there's a skulk munchin' on a building. The only time I have really ever used turrets is either locking down a hive (which I rarely do anymore) or set up about 2 turrets to assist with a siege to give some extra protection against skulks rushing in.

              Welcome to NS :D Here is a link to the manual:

              http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns/comm...asic/index.htm

              I saw you in the game that night we were doing captains, but you got booted a few times because the server was packed (usual for that time of night) and other SMs were coming in. The subscription is the way to go, having a reserved slot is the best.
              Like the server? Become a regular! TGNS Required Reading
              Answers to every server question? Yes! TGNS FAQ

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              • #8
                Re: New to TG + a question

                Werlcome, Quark.

                Originally posted by aeroripper
                The subscription is the way to go, having a reserved slot is the best.
                This is correct.

                About the turrets, there's no black and white. Turrets aim better and fire faster, and notify the commander of problems faster and slower than some marines vs others. As with damn near everything in Natural Selection, it just depends. The game takes pages to explain even the smallest details in full. You're not going to get a short answer that explains every side of anything.

                I like turrets when I need to know when aliens are around, among other reasons.
                Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

                Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

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                • #9
                  Re: New to TG + a question

                  Welcome buddy.

                  I won't add another point to the turrets debate, but within a few weeks of playing here, you will definatly have a MUCH better view on stratagy, specially if you join our HLTV sessions.
                  Ambriento for comm! Vote today!

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                  • #10
                    Re: New to TG + a question

                    The only time marine spawn turrets are justifiable are if you're totally swimming in res and are frequently getting pestered by single skulks. In that case the turrets could save you some manpower that would be better spent elsewhere. That's really their only use in the base though; in the early game you just can't afford to spend so much precious early res defending your comm chair of all things, and in the mid-late game turrets are completely useless against Hive 2 aliens, or even hive 1 fades/onoses. Turrets are pretty much only routinely useful to hold remote locations, like hive rooms or chokepoints, and even that is pretty questionable sometimes.

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                    • #11
                      Re: New to TG + a question

                      I would argue that is a slight mischaracterization. Turrets don't care a whole lot about hive level--what they do is deter skulks from entering a room, and lerks from staying in a room, at any level, while being largely useless against all other lifeforms.

                      What this really means is that you have to be very careful about how MANY you drop. It only takes 1 to 2 turrets to scare skulks off a location, and no matter how many you have you won't hold back Oni or biling Gorges, so you never need more than a small number in one place. Spending 80 res to turretfarm a room is just silly, but I can definately see the value of spending 20 or 30 res to make a location more marine-friendly for awhile. A single 10-res turret in your base will often mean not losing a 15-res obs or a 40-res AA to a patrolling skulk.

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                      • #12
                        Re: New to TG + a question

                        I just read something interesting last night that comes up on this...

                        Onos only takes 1/2 dmg from turrets. (I'm 90% sure it's true, not 100%).

                        Kerostasis, that's exactly what i use them for. if they sit in a major junction on teh map, then skulks have trouble running past without losing life. that's where it ends.
                        Ambriento for comm! Vote today!

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                        • #13
                          Re: New to TG + a question

                          Turrets are not an effective use of resources, and I would only endorse using them if you are already winning and have an excess amount of res coming in. Even then, I would only do so in the event of a 2 hive lockdown, and I emphasize only if you have excess res. 200 res does not mean you have excess if you are just oblivious to everything and have not spent your res on upgrades.

                          Turrets are weak and ineffective. Mines are much more viable in most situations. Not to mention, placing mines takes only moments, and they have the potential of killing fades, whereas turrets can kill stupid skulks, and that's about it. They take too long to build to help in a pinch, can potentially become useless if your tf has a blind spot, and phase gate hitboxes and such often make all but one turret a complete waste. If you don't have marines there, you aren't going to hold the position anyway.

                          If you have the res, drop a turret or two during 2nd hive siege, just to help with the skulks, but that should be pretty much the extent of their usefulness in the game.

                          And don't even get me started on early game electrifying. That second hive isn't going to not go up because you decided to electify the rt near base, and then they will just bile it, and your team will lose.

                          2 turrets can't kill a smart skulk, and you can hear the pinging noise, so yeah, I would have to disagree on only dropping 2 turrets. Turrets are just generally crappy, and only effective in bulk, and even then, they still can't do a thing to an onos, so they aren't worth the investment. Turrets don't snap to skulks, so a skulk can just circle around it and kill it, and if he plays his cards right, hide behind the turret/turret factory to avoid as much damage as possible from any other turrets, and just repeat on the other turret(s).

                          In conclusion, please don't drop turret factories. They ruin games. Thank you.

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                          • #14
                            Re: New to TG + a question

                            I really can't think of any one asset in the game that has no place in gameplay.

                            That is, if people are saying "don't X" or "don't Y", and they're not qualifying those exclusions, there's likely a piece of the puzzle that's being left out. Early-game node electrification does have its place. Turret factories don't "ruin games." You can get a lopsided and strong opinion from anyone (myself included), but the only thing that's going to give you your own is a lot of time playing the title yourself.

                            This is one of the things that makes Natural Selection this community's longest-running title: the strategic possibilities are so varied, and they're dependent on so many variables.
                            Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

                            Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: New to TG + a question

                              Welcome Quark!

                              Most of what's been said already is true about turrets. I've seen them most effective in early game hive lockdowns and choke point lockdowns.



                              Also, welcome to the forums lollies. You've done a fine job pointing out the scenarios when not to drop turrets, but you left out quite a lot which I think really invalidates your conclusion:

                              Originally posted by lollies
                              please don't drop turret factories. They ruin games.
                              What NS background do you have that gives you that impression?

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