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  • "Teams?"

    Sure, it's a nitpick, but it really irked me. That one game on NS_Origin we had tonight. Wyz was com, but he had to leave. I didn't even have time to ask why before the marine team yelled for the extra man. I volunteered to go once I blew my 15 res on an RT, but someone beat me to it.

    Towards the end, we lost furnace (again) and were hold up in vent. This is when my ping went insane, so I wasn't much good us. But I did notice we lost 2 teammates when the hive went down. At this point it was 6 on 4. Now, I don't like asking "Teams?" This is a reason I play here so much. It's understood, that you need even teams and marines get odd-man.

    So, we're hold up in vent, with HA and JP at our front door (er, vent) and one guy building the PG and TF while the others camp. A hard situation (which we pulled out of at least twice in the game) which becomes impossible when outnumbered as such.

    No one bothered switching even after I asked. I'm willing to sacrifice my spot on a winning team if it's needed. I was kinda pissed when all I could do was watch my team get gunned down, and knowing that not even a miracle could pull us through.

    I may just be whining about nothing, but I have noticed this a few other times over the past few weeks. It's rare, but it can ruin a back-and-forth game in seconds. That one man can make all the difference.

  • #2
    Re: "Teams?"

    many of us here ARE aware of "un even teams" and we try to help it out, even if our previous alliance was a winning team. as for me, i try to give a helping hand to a "less fortunate" team even if i have a heavy armor, hmg, and grenade (or any other fancy equipment)

    i hope others will consider giving each other a helping hand.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: "Teams?"

      Seeing this makes me sad. We know better than this. Fenix is a reg, not some idiot popping off.

      I switch teams all the time. Everyone who plays here knows that. This may quite possibly be the only thing I do right that everyone else can look to me for leadership on. Learn from my example. If you're not critical to your team, switch to the team that's losing the numbers game. Hell, I've switched when I *am* critical to my team, if my team doesn't compensate for the teams quickly enough (if I have time to realize what's up, so does the rest of my team... put up or shut up).

      The entire satisfaction of a good game can be ruined if you're down by two (or more) during your last few losing moments. Yes, you know you're going to lose no matter what, but losing while down two men just blows.

      It says that no one on the other team gives a damn enough about you to switch teams and stand by you... with you... while you lose. Regardless if it's intentional or not, it says that the only thing the winning team gives a damn about is winning.

      That attitude will leave a bitter taste in your mouth every time.

      That game on origin tonight was a disaster no matter how you looked at it. Both Ema and I had to kick people from both teams, I had RL-distractions before I left, and... what REALLY sucks.. is that we had the talent balance to have a REALLY fun game if all that other crap hadn't gotten in the way. To hear now about this is just plain irritating.

      Wyzcrak

      P.S. My 12-year-old sis-in-law is with us this week. You'll see less (not none) of me, and you'll likely see me go AFK or quitting mid-game, often without explanation (ala above-referenced game). My humblest apologies. It's only temporary. 12-year-olds aren't real keen on schedules. :)
      Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

      Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: "Teams?"

        I dont know about anybody else and I dont want to speak for my team mates on that map but. I didnt see a request to even teams. There was a lot going on, and I could of just missed it or something, but if I had seen it, I would of switched.


        I, like wyz, will switch teams when ever needed. I usually always say over voice though "last person who joined needs to switch", if no body switches then I switch. I honestly dont like leaving my team, winning or not, but will if needed, so its not really a problem for me. If I saw you asking to even teams, I would of switched, I just didnt see it becuause of everything that is going on.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: "Teams?"

          People sometimes don't realise, and sometimes pubs are joining and leaving a lot which makes the teams fluctuate wildly so there are sometimes excuses, but generally we should all know better.

          I suggest that if anyone is frustrated by long periods of uneven teams, take a screenie of the scoreboard and post it here to name and shame any of us who don't change.

          Also remember that you can ask an admin to do an amx_marine or amx_alien if the situation is desperate. We shouldn't have to resort to any of this though.
          Wintermute

          Play EVE online. It's like being an accounting addict in space.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: "Teams?"

            Originally posted by _Ender_
            I like wyz, will switch teams when ever needed. I usually always say over voice though "last person who joined needs to switch", if no body switches then I switch. I honestly dont like leaving my team, winning or not, but will if needed, so its not really a problem for me. If I saw you asking to even teams, I would of switched, I just didnt see it becuause of everything that is going on.
            Some one likes that pop tart?

            . . .

            Yeah, I switch teams alot. . .
            - 52

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: "Teams?"

              Once again I must say I'm confused by the lack of any sort of policy regarding this on the server. Usually, not always but most of the time, when teams get like this one of the players on the larger team has joined relatively recently. Simply put, that player should always be the one who's forced to change; they're the least team-critical, the least attached to their side of that game and just the only natural choice for someone to switch over. It is frustrating to see someone like the hive saver(*cough* Wyz) switch teams when someone else should clearly be doing so.

              So, a simple plugin request: we should have a plugin that keeps track of the newest player on each team, and when the teams are uneven by two it sends them a warning to switch over. If they fail to do so in 30 seconds, it switches them. Maybe the latter part could be disabled if an admin is present(so they can use their judgement, i.e. no comms), but the warning should still show up so they know who to deal with.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: "Teams?"

                Its not easy switching teams both ways, this is mostly due to the res system.
                Personally I dont watch the teams as much I believe that the res system can make up for small differences.

                I could careless if its 6 vs 4 I watch for talent balance.

                I find some people complain about teams when the marines are pushing on the last hive, which is just needless.

                Everygame's balance usually comes down to the pubs, god, I hate them sometimes.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: "Teams?"

                  Originally posted by Emanon
                  I could careless if its 6 vs 4 I watch for talent balance.
                  Even the dumbest team (provided they follow orders) can do loads more on a map with two extra players. They can match you man for man at a hive/marine start and still have one guy running around putting up ot taking down res.

                  I find some people complain about teams when the marines are pushing on the last hive, which is just needless.
                  We pushed the marines out of vent twice that game. We were losing almost the entire game, but it was fun. It was a challenge. When we were then outnumbered and boxed in with no way in Hell able to do anything, it got stupid.

                  That would have been on less HA/JP to kill and one more skulk to help kill the rest. That one man can swing the game so fast. Granted, we probably still would have lost, but I would have enjoyed the game till the end.

                  For the record, since my TFC days, hitting [TAB] about once every 15-30 seconds is a natural reflex for me. I did/do the same thing in Jedi Academy and UT to keep myself updated with people's respective scores and pings. It's cheap, but knowing your opponents ping can help you when choosing the best tactic to kill him.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: "Teams?"

                    The policy of this server, until someone convinces the admins otherwise, is that the difference in number between marines and aliens should never exceed one. It has nothing to do with who's winning or what stage of the game you're in. If you're on a team with 2+ more players than the other team, no matter how or why that state came to be, do something about it, preferably without having to be babysitted by the other team.

                    Either the smaller team's ability to win IS impacted by the number discrepency or it isn't.

                    If it isn't, then one player leaving the larger team to join the smaller team in the last few moments of defeat is harmless to the switching player's ego, as there's nothing his new team can do to push back his old team, which means he's certain to see and take pride in the victory of the larger team, which he helped bring about.

                    If, on the other hand, the smaller team's ability to win IS increased by the addition of the switching player, then we can all agree that it is critically important that a player switch from the larger team to the smaller team as soon as is possible (often measured in fractions of a gameplay minute).

                    Wyzcrak
                    Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

                    Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: "Teams?"

                      If I'm not presently focusing on something, I'm looking at my game THROUGH the scoreboard. The amount of game information that you can gather from the scoreboard is enormous if you know how to properly use the data.

                      For starters, it tells you how many enemies are on the map. Knowing that alone can be critical in making educated decisions about split-second moves and strategy changes. The number of opponents on the field changes several times within half of a minute. If you're not looking at the scoreboard SEVERAL times in half of a minute, you're not affording yourself all of the information that the game is offering you.

                      This in turn means that you're making decisions with less than the total information you could be considering as you make those decisions. That is not a favorable state in which to make gameplay decisions.

                      Wyzcrak
                      Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

                      Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: "Teams?"

                        I know the policy is to balance teams, Wyz, but is there a reason we haven't established a hard rule about the last person joining being the one to switch?

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: "Teams?"

                          What I was trying to get at was for example when TR took on TG (which I thought was fun) and we gave TG players 2,3 or even more extra players.

                          While both sides had skills, one had more talent.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: "Teams?"

                            I can understand your point, but you can't make a server-wide policy for balance based on something as ... debatable.. as who has more talent than who doesn't, and whether that disagreeable amount of talent should be switching teams or not.

                            Keep the team numbers balanced. If talent balance takes a hit, then the bigger team screwed up in balancing the teams. If the smaller team has ALL of the good talent BEFORE the team switch, then I guess God just hates the less-talented team that's losing a man in the switch. Oh well. Life sucks and then you die, I guess. :) Fortunately such a scenario won't happen often.

                            Wyzcrak
                            Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

                            Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: "Teams?"

                              Originally posted by Zek
                              I know the policy is to balance teams, Wyz, but is there a reason we haven't established a hard rule about the last person joining being the one to switch?
                              I found it just as time consuming to determine the most recent joiner as it was to randomly pick someone. Instead, I now move the player listed last on the scoreboard for the larger team. Often, this IS the player that joined last. Regardless, it is typically a player that has done little for his team and will be strategically replaceable with minimal sacrifice.

                              Wyzcrak
                              Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

                              Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

                              Comment

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