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  • combat idea

    Would it be possible to add in a vote for the 'combat communism' plugin? That way it's still on the server, but the players can decide if they want it on or not.

  • #2
    Re: combat idea

    What's the issue with it? Are people not levelling fast enough?
    [volun2]
    NS Game Officer. TF2 Admin. BF2 Admin / Scripter. PM with issues.
    Tempus: Pokerface is nailing it right on the head. Everyone who is arguing against him is simply arguing against reality.
    <anmuzi> it is not permitted to have privacy or anonymity
    <LazyEye> yeah when I play on TG the server digs though my trash

    Arm yourself with knowledge: TG NS TF2 BF2

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    • #3
      Re: combat idea

      when you doing well benefits your enemies, something is wrong.

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      • #4
        Re: combat idea

        I like that my doing well in CO benefits my enemies. That's right to me, not wrong. It gives me what I want from combat, the most important aspect being quicker CO-to-NS times.
        Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

        Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

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        • #5
          Re: combat idea

          I didn't like the idea to begin with, but it's grown on me.


          If you are getting owned, you still get a chance by leveling up.

          If you are owning, you still get a challenge, by your enemies leveling up.


          Now I agree that it shouldn't be the 100% communism that it seems to be right now, something closer to 60% of your earned xp goes to enemy players and maybe 30% to your own teammates, but I honestly do not care enough to put in more than a moments thought to co_.


          edit: sometimes it pisses off new players though because they can't show off thier leet skills. sucks for them when they miss all the good ns_ on the server.

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          • #6
            Re: combat idea

            Originally posted by micr0c0sm View Post
            sometimes it pisses off new players though because they can't show off thier leet skills. sucks for them when they miss all the good ns_ on the server.
            So many of those good players (not all), though, are the same ones who are eager to go tell everyone about how stupid TG is for running lame CO plugins instead of solid NS, at which point anyone who's anyone is going to reply: "Dude, you weren't on the server at the right time."
            Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

            Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

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            • #7
              Re: combat idea

              I'm fine with my enemies getting a boost to keep it challenging, I'd much rather struggle than dominate, but it doesn't work very well because a 50/50 balance in combat involves the marines having more kills and a higher level than aliens, because 1) aliens are on defense and 2) after like level 3-4 aliens are stronger per level than marines. What that ends up doing is make it so that as a marine you can either 1) spawn camp and kill the hive right away, which is no fun for the aliens or 2) face the fact that the more kills you get the less chance you have of winning, which is sad.

              I'm all for massive game-altering plugins for combat (not of the xmenu type mind you), especially ones that help out the late/worse players, but I think this one misses the mark a bit.

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              • #8
                Re: combat idea

                Originally posted by 1Stop|Beowulf View Post
                when you doing well benefits your enemies, something is wrong.
                Here's why it was written in the first place.

                Stock Combat is no fun if you're losing. None at all. There's no tech tree, there's no killing the other guys and there's no getting within sight of the CC/hive. If someone has better aim than you, the slippery slope of stock combat ensures that you're going to stay at the bottom of the hill, and the other team is going to stay at the top.

                For the winning team, there's no challenge. For the losing team, there's no fun.

                Since the plugin has been installed, I can count on one hand the number of CO maps I've played with more than six people on the server that haven't been nailbiters (IE, aliens win on timelimit, or marines are scrambling in the last 60 seconds to take the hive down).

                Both teams are able to make choices. Both teams are able to fight, and the deciding factor in any given skirmish becomes where the intersection between talent and the results of the choices you've made on upgrades lie (because all players are at the same level). You didn't lose the fight because the HMG JPer floated around the room and took your L1 skulk butt to town; you lose because the HMG JPer used his levels and his skill to top you out despite whatever choices you made with the same seven levels you took.

                If you're upset because you're not getting credit for your mad skillz, tough noogies. If you're that good, you should be able to stomp an opponent of equal level with the same fervor as one eight levels below you.
                [volun2]
                NS Game Officer. TF2 Admin. BF2 Admin / Scripter. PM with issues.
                Tempus: Pokerface is nailing it right on the head. Everyone who is arguing against him is simply arguing against reality.
                <anmuzi> it is not permitted to have privacy or anonymity
                <LazyEye> yeah when I play on TG the server digs though my trash

                Arm yourself with knowledge: TG NS TF2 BF2

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: combat idea

                  If you're upset because you're not getting credit for your mad skillz, tough noogies. If you're that good, you should be able to stomp an opponent of equal level with the same fervor as one eight levels below you.
                  You've entirely misunderstood me. If that were remotely what I cared about I would be totally stoked with this plugin, because I could go alien every time and not have to worry about the lvl 1 vs lvl 1 problem that skulks have in combat because i could sit back in a vent until i had leap + silence and from that point pretty much have my way with the marines (even straight shotgun < leap + silence). I'm upset because I find the gameplay lacking (even for combat). In the past few months I can count on one freakin finger the number of games ive played where it hasn't ended either a 3 minute spawncamping by the marines or by the aliens UTTERLY dominating the marines to the point where they can't even hit the hive. 3 fully upgraded fades and a superskulk(celerity adren silence leap focus cara sof) versus 4 jp/shotty a2 w2(w1 if you get scan or mt) marines does that.

                  Don't EVEN pull some "tactical" superiority complex on me.

                  I'm talking about when you doing well helps your enemies MORE THAN IT HELPS YOU.

                  and aliens winning on timelimit does not a tall signify a nailbiter, it usually signifies that the marines can't do jack as far as winning goes but the aliens don't feel like going through of the ordeal of hitting the cc because they're enjoying their position and are going to win in five minutes anyways.

                  I've already said I don't like the way stock combat works if your losing OR winning, I'm just saying I don't think this is better.

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                  • #10
                    Re: combat idea

                    Who has what action items here? Let's do something or drop this (the latter being my preference, FWIW).
                    Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

                    Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: combat idea

                      Progressive Income Tax. ;)

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: combat idea

                        Originally posted by Wyzcrak View Post
                        Who has what action items here? Let's do something or drop this (the latter being my preference, FWIW).
                        QFT. Combat accounts for what, maybe 1/100th of our total gameplay anyway? Let it rest.

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                        • #13
                          Re: combat idea

                          Originally posted by Wyzcrak View Post
                          Who has what action items here? Let's do something or drop this (the latter being my preference, FWIW).
                          Sounds good to me. I don't have time or really care enough to do anything constructive, so I'm good.

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                          • #14
                            Re: combat idea

                            Originally posted by Kerostasis View Post
                            Shot in the dark here:

                            Progressive income tax! :D

                            The less xp you have, the more of your own xp you get to keep. Your current level (as viewed by NS vanilla, since that conveniently caps at level 10) determines the % of your xp taken away as taxes and distributed to all players. At level 1, 10% is taxed and 90% is given to you. At level 5, 50% taxed and 50% to you. At level 10 and above, 100% of your earned xp is distributed evenly across the server instead of kept for yourself. (You do get a portion of the amount taxed, just no more than anyone else does.)
                            +1, now just write it kero :D

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                            • #15
                              Re: combat idea

                              I would also prefer either switching to progressive income tax, or dropping co communism entirely. I just don't see the point of playing in a game where your actions have almost no bearing on the outcome of the game, unless you choose to repeatedly rush the hive/cc. Knowing that I'd be helping my team just as much by afking just doesn't create what I consider a fun game. With this plugin on the server, I find myself considerably less willing to join a nearly empty server to seed it, since I know there won't be anything interesting to do while I wait. If the majority actually enjoys this plugin, I'll just leave them to it and join once the server is on ns, but I don't see the harm in at least allowing the majority to vote to turn it off.

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