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  • #16
    Re: you guys with accurate shotgun 'enhancement'

    I take it he's voting for Bush and wants you to, too.

    Comment


    • #17
      Re: you guys with accurate shotgun 'enhancement'

      Originally posted by Syn
      I didnt think the calibre of player this server promotes used any such tweaks, my mistake.
      does this make any sense to anyone?

      what, custom crosshairs are morally wrong? they're not mature?

      i don't get it...

      Comment


      • #18
        Re: you guys with accurate shotgun 'enhancement'

        Originally posted by Sasuke
        what, custom crosshairs are morally wrong?
        YES! Cast off ye modded crosshairs and repent, lest ye be damned! And on the seventh day, God rested and played Natural Selection with his default crosshairs...and it was good.

        I need to release shotgun crosshairs that are off to the bottom-left. Then when people complain about missing I'll say "GG hitbox l4g!"

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        • #19
          Re: you guys with accurate shotgun 'enhancement'

          Originally posted by TheFeniX
          YES! Cast off ye modded crosshairs and repent, lest ye be damned! And on the seventh day, God rested and played Natural Selection with his default crosshairs...and it was good.

          I need to release shotgun crosshairs that are off to the bottom-left. Then when people complain about missing I'll say "GG hitbox l4g!"
          misery loves company :>

          Comment


          • #20
            Re: you guys with accurate shotgun 'enhancement'

            Originally posted by Sasuke
            does this make any sense to anyone?

            what, custom crosshairs are morally wrong? they're not mature?

            i don't get it...
            Customizations are selfish indulgences, to put it simply. When these indulgences do not violate the tacit contract between playerA and playerB regarding what information playerB's client will provide playerB (and which playerB exclusively will use to make tactical and strategic decisions) while playerB engages playerA in battle, you'll often find that playerA has no objections to playerB's customization(s). However, when a customization is installed solely or primarily to advantageously influence decisions made by playerB during combat engagements, it is reasonable for playerA to object to playerB's seemingly-unannounced use of that inequality.

            While it's very accomodating for those trying to avoid the inequality stigma to point out that this crosshair's release was a public one, it's not reasonable to assume that, on average, any player on a public server is more likely to have this customization than they are likely to not have it. In this specific case at least, quite the opposite is likely to be the case, I think.

            Eventually, this customization (or some variation on its design) may reach mainstream. In the meantime, the above arguments apply.
            Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

            Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

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            • #21
              Re: you guys with accurate shotgun 'enhancement'

              Originally posted by Wyzcrak
              Customizations are selfish indulgences, to put it simply. When these indulgences do not violate the tacit contract between playerA and playerB regarding what information playerB's client will provide playerB (and which playerB exclusively will use to make tactical and strategic decisions) while playerB engages playerA in battle, you'll often find that playerA has no objections to playerB's customization(s). However, when a customization is installed solely or primarily to advantageously influence decisions made by playerB during combat engagements, it is reasonable for playerA to object to playerB's seemingly-unannounced use of that inequality.

              While it's very accomodating for those trying to avoid the inequality stigma to point out that this crosshair's release was a public one, it's not reasonable to assume that, on average, any player on a public server is more likely to have this customization than they are likely to not have it. In this specific case at least, quite the opposite is likely to be the case, I think.

              Eventually, this customization (or some variation on its design) may reach mainstream. In the meantime, the above arguments apply.
              So you're saying that using custom crosshairs is an inequality because it affects another player's judgement? You realize you're dead wrong, right wyz? Re-read what you posted (you used B when you should have used A once btw) and see how a crosshair fits into that. Crosshairs are clientside modifications. It doesn't affect how others see you. Making your updaterate 10 might fit into that situation you give, but not a crosshair.

              Most other games have many, many different crosshairs for you to choose from. In fact I use a NS crosshair that's simply a shrunken down crosshair from Quake 3, because it's easier for me to see. Almost no one in competitive play uses the default crosshairs because they're hard to see and are too bulky. It's open to anyone to change their crosshairs, and it's even allowed by the devs (note that consistency specifically does NOT block custom crosshairs. That was done for a reason). I'm sure some of you will moan and cry about a shotgun crosshair that shows where the pellets go, but realize what you're doing is just that: crying and moaning. Get over it.

              Comment


              • #22
                Re: you guys with accurate shotgun 'enhancement'

                Originally posted by TheAdj`
                So you're saying that using custom crosshairs is an inequality because it affects another player's judgement?
                What I wrote was exactly what I meant, and what I meant is quite different than the assumption you incorrectly made above. I did not switch player references at all, much less unintentionally or accidentily. You simply missed my message. I offer the following paragraph to assist you in your efforts to correct your error and more accurately understand what I meant and stated. What I wrote is involved, and I'm sure that you'll understand it more accurately if you take as much care in reading it as I did in authoring it.

                My comments weren't regarding the information fed to the player without the customization, or how that data modified the decisions made by the player without the customization. My comments regarded the information fed to the player with the customization and how that data modified the decisions made by the player with the customization.
                Originally posted by TheAdj`
                I'm sure some of you will moan and cry about a shotgun crosshair that shows where the pellets go, but realize what you're doing is just that: crying and moaning. Get over it.
                The inequality, whose existance you practically validated in this post's first quote, is what bothers people, not accurate crosshairs.
                Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

                Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Re: you guys with accurate shotgun 'enhancement'

                  You guys take this whole thing way to seriously. How about we just settle it with a poll? I would be more than happy to abide by the majority opinion of those that play here.
                  Rm 14:2 NIV
                  One man's faith allows him to eat everything, but another man, whose faith is weak, eats only vegetables.

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                  • #24
                    Re: you guys with accurate shotgun 'enhancement'

                    War of words:
                    Wyz > All


                    Sometimes reading your posts wyz it just makes me feel stupid :icon_conf :icon4:


                    If this is really a problem, mp_consistancy is the solution,

                    http://forums.tacticalgamer.com/showthread.php?t=6895

                    but if i do recall the reason we kept it of is because of people who liked different crosshairs.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Re: you guys with accurate shotgun 'enhancement'

                      As mp_consistency does not block crosshairs, a poll about crosshairs leaves in its result no actionable consequence.

                      We could enable mp_consistency, but, while those who oppose it could 'get over it', they sure did raise a fuss when I suggested enabling it before.

                      Short of me custom-writing such a plugin, there is no solution presently for blocking custom crosshairs. The crosshair argument is more an excercise in debate than anything else.
                      Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

                      Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Re: you guys with accurate shotgun 'enhancement'

                        Personally I see no advantage to it, because the shot is off by just so little. Also I think it is more of a disadvantage, becuase if you havent seen it yet, that thing is huge.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Re: you guys with accurate shotgun 'enhancement'

                          I think that as long as the crosshairs are open for anyone to download and use they should be allowed. Not doing so and then bitching about the inequality of custom HUD 'enhancements' (hah) is inexcuseably idiotic in my opinion.


                          Now, if the crosshairs were only available to download by certain people for certain people then it would be an issue, but as it stands the crosshairs are freely available.

                          I dont see a problem with them.

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                          • #28
                            Re: you guys with accurate shotgun 'enhancement'

                            I understand what you meant now, and you're still wrong. Information is out there that tells you "the shotgun spread is above and to the right of the center of the default crosshair. Using a crosshair that shows where the bullets are actually going isn't modifying the fact that you know the shot pattern isn't where the crosshair is. Saying "well some people don't know" doesn't work either: they should read the ns.org forums and they'll find it on their own. Ignorance of something doesn't mean everyone else should be punished for it.

                            And wyz can't win a war of words. I'll post until I'm banned arguing against him. That's just how I am, ask the rest of wmd.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Re: you guys with accurate shotgun 'enhancement'

                              I think there's bigger issues in NS than a crosshiar for the shotty. But then again, someone had this when it first came out (Zek?) and their game was hugely improved. I would hope that custumizations would take a little getting used to or skill to learn before mastery. However a insta-good-shotty improvement is pushing it.

                              I think all you're seeing is how good you are with this and how much more fun NS is for you and your time. Try being on the other end of it oh say....7 times before level 3 and see how you feel.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Re: you guys with accurate shotgun 'enhancement'

                                Originally posted by TheAdj`
                                And wyz can't win a war of words. I'll post until I'm banned arguing against him. That's just how I am, ask the rest of wmd.
                                Winning a war of words often isn't in the quantity, but in the quality, that is, the quality of the argument.

                                Say, for the sake of argument, that you are wrong, restating your opinion won't change the fact that you are wrong. This boils down to a opinion, plain and simple.

                                And I am quite sure that, given an audience with the pope (and a free ticket to italy), wyz has a fair chance of convincing him that catholisism is wrong. And it wouldn't take talking until the pope dies either, it would be in one or two conversations. :icon33:
                                --
                                CaveDog
                                "Go sell crazy somewhere else... we're all stocked up here."

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