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  • New mod possibility

    Not sure if it would be a mod, or a series of maps, but why not make the maps have different MS points on them? Instead of always starting at the same spot on marines, we should edit these maps somehow where it's random where the marines start or there are certain set points where marines may start.

    I thought it was a good idea.

    -Mom
    Yer Mom /O>

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  • #2
    Re: New mod possibility

    Interesting concept, but I see a couple of problems.

    --Would an entire team of 8 marines show up in the SAME random spawn? Or might some get scattered across several different spawns? In theory you could simply define marine spawn to be really big, allowing marines to start most anywhere, but then you arrive at the problem that different marines may not start anywhere near each other (or the chair). See NS_Nancy for an example on a smaller scale--Marine Start on that map stretches all the way down the hallway and into some of the side rooms.

    --Com chair. Will there be several com chairs starting on the map in different places? Will the ones that dont have marines spawning near them disappear?

    --Distress Beacon. Which starting point will Beacon call all the marines back to? If its not the same starting point they actually built their base at, there will be problems.

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    • #3
      Re: New mod possibility

      It'd be hard to balance the maps. The official maps are designed around the "mapping guidlines for NS" meaning it has to be pretty balanced as far as walk times and assuming the marines start in one area all the time.

      As kero mentioned, other things like bacon would have to be re-worked. Besides, it makes more sense that the aliens have multiple hives since their like bacteria. The marines wouldn't come in a bunch of random locations entering a station.
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      • #4
        Re: New mod possibility

        Also note that the current ns maps are pretty much the max size the HL engine can handle. So it would be kind of hard to have a balanced map with 2 marine starts. If marines want to spawn somewhere else they can always relocate.

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        • #5
          Re: New mod possibility

          I would say the marines ability to relocate anywhere on the map already gives them freedom in that matter. Aliens start in one of three random locations, but those are the only three locations they can go to.

          I still wish I could drop a hive in marine start...

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          • #6
            Re: New mod possibility

            Good arguements, I agree. The multiple MS idea is a bit blank, but I thought I'd throw it out there. As far as a hive in marine start, I believe fully that we/they should develop a way for the aliens to be able to move as easily as the marines. Aliens already have speed advantages, I understand, but they also are screwed if a PG goes up in a hive across the map. Movements help, but you can't always get people near enough to the movements to save the hive. There should be some sort of alien beacon, and there should also be some sort of way for aliens to swarm MS the same as marines swarm hives with PG's. I can see the balancing issues in this as well, but it would make for much longer games due to the fact that you would have to build defenses in marine start instead of relying simply on marines being ready to come home.

            Just for discussion.

            Edit - Or better yet, an alien commander. Hive lord, "the mother"... someone who could control what the aliens do and see the map just like the marine commander. That's an interesting idea, I think. Instead of giving gorges the ability to build things, create a hive mother position by "e"ing on the hive. Similar to the marine commander, only they control what upgrades come first and where they are built. This would weed out some of the idiots on the pubby servers atleast, dropping SC's when everyone wants MC's. The gorges only use would be to build the structures dropped by the hive mother.

            -Mom
            Yer Mom /O>

            To all but me is the look given but never received. My heart sinks faster and faster every time I look into them, yet I do not understand their controling power on my soul. - W11114m W45h1n670n

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            • #7
              Re: New mod possibility

              Originally posted by Yer Mom
              Edit - Or better yet, an alien commander. Hive lord, "the mother"... someone who could control what the aliens do and see the map just like the marine commander. That's an interesting idea, I think. Instead of giving gorges the ability to build things, create a hive mother position by "e"ing on the hive. Similar to the marine commander, only they control what upgrades come first and where they are built. This would weed out some of the idiots on the pubby servers atleast, dropping SC's when everyone wants MC's. The gorges only use would be to build the structures dropped by the hive mother.

              -Mom
              That idea has actually been thought of many times on the old ns forums... the devs basically rejected it when they were making the game because they wanted the aliens to be truly different than the marine side. Somebody drew a picture of a giant slug carrying the hive... its was pretty funnny.

              I like the use of hive sight+teamwork to take the role of commander on aliens.
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              • #8
                Re: New mod possibility

                Related thread:

                http://www.tacticalgamer.com/natural...commander.html
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                Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

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                • #9
                  Re: New mod possibility

                  An alien commander would kinda ruin the whole "gorge" thing. Of things that make sense for the alien commander to do, all that would really make sense is choosing what chambers, how to divide up the res, and giving order to the aliens. Of those, the giving orders one is the only one that really makes sense to me, and I don't think it's worth the change.

                  I would like to see just a little more mobility for aliens though in regard to hive locations. I woudln't count on it happening though. The only way I can think of doing that is to have more than three hive locations, but only allow the building of three hives, but maps are so big already.

                  If there were 4 locations, all capable of being marine start or the starting alien hive (but never having first alien hive in the same spot as marines for that round) Then it would give marines more variety in starting locations, and aliens more choices for hive locations.

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                  • #10
                    Re: New mod possibility

                    hmmmm you could movement rush MS.


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                    • #11
                      Re: New mod possibility

                      Originally posted by Spartan25
                      hmmmm you could movement rush MS.
                      A plugin lets you do that. It adds a 4th hive in MS to counter the 1 hive reloate on pubs.
                      Current game name : Lost, Phantom Thief

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                      • #12
                        Re: New mod possibility

                        Originally posted by Kerostasis
                        Interesting concept, but I see a couple of problems.

                        --Would an entire team of 8 marines show up in the SAME random spawn? Or might some get scattered across several different spawns? In theory you could simply define marine spawn to be really big, allowing marines to start most anywhere, but then you arrive at the problem that different marines may not start anywhere near each other (or the chair). See NS_Nancy for an example on a smaller scale--Marine Start on that map stretches all the way down the hallway and into some of the side rooms.

                        --Com chair. Will there be several com chairs starting on the map in different places? Will the ones that dont have marines spawning near them disappear?

                        --Distress Beacon. Which starting point will Beacon call all the marines back to? If its not the same starting point they actually built their base at, there will be problems.
                        I always thought it would be cool if you could drop a distress beacon 'reciever' of sorts. You know, like an obs cept its only function would be to draw beacon'd marines to it's location instead of MS. This would extremely useful, both in real tactics, and in hilarious mass-comm-marinicide.


                        "Who put the fun in dysfunctional? I." - Aesop Rock

                        "Cuz you can choose to say 'Good morning, God! =)' or 'Good God, morning! =(" - Blackalicious

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: New mod possibility

                          Originally posted by Irish Pirate
                          An alien commander would kinda ruin the whole "gorge" thing. Of things that make sense for the alien commander to do, all that would really make sense is choosing what chambers, how to divide up the res, and giving order to the aliens. Of those, the giving orders one is the only one that really makes sense to me, and I don't think it's worth the change.

                          I would like to see just a little more mobility for aliens though in regard to hive locations. I woudln't count on it happening though. The only way I can think of doing that is to have more than three hive locations, but only allow the building of three hives, but maps are so big already.

                          If there were 4 locations, all capable of being marine start or the starting alien hive (but never having first alien hive in the same spot as marines for that round) Then it would give marines more variety in starting locations, and aliens more choices for hive locations.
                          I think the alien commander idea is wonderful, but like so many alien roles, can easily be misused. Consider the gorge who drops 1 MC at 20 seconds and then sits around and does nothing for 4 minutes, and compare the similarities. The alien commander would, more likely, spend much less time 'in' the hive than the marine's comm would in his chair. The [alien comm's] roles would more likely involve intel, and maybe even the controlling of which hive gets 'spawning priority' or 'attacking' the hive so that other aliens can movement. There are other small things that would benefit the aliens, but not too much, that the comm could do.

                          One thing I think would REALLY help gameplay on NS, in general, and would not be overpowered, is PARASITED/SOF'D marines showing up on minimap! Heck, even show if they're JP/HA/light, and what weapon! Is this parasite a living thing or not!?! Give us better info, para-buddy!


                          "Who put the fun in dysfunctional? I." - Aesop Rock

                          "Cuz you can choose to say 'Good morning, God! =)' or 'Good God, morning! =(" - Blackalicious

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                          • #14
                            Re: New mod possibility

                            Originally posted by aesop rock
                            Give us better info, para-buddy!
                            Agreed. Useful. Not overpowered.
                            Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

                            Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: New mod possibility

                              Originally posted by aesop rock
                              I always thought it would be cool if you could drop a distress beacon 'reciever' of sorts. You know, like an obs cept its only function would be to draw beacon'd marines to it's location instead of MS. This would extremely useful, both in real tactics, and in hilarious mass-comm-marinicide.
                              Only problem with implementing something like that is that beacon uses spawn points as a reference (I believe the force respawn code is fairly easy to access for HL, many mods use it, some even at the map makers discression).

                              Effectively you would have to create additional spawn points, enough to cover the maximum number of players you expect, and activate those instead. This might work in one or two other locations of the map, but to do it anywhere would probably require spawn points to cover the whole map, and take only the ones nearest the the beacon reciever.

                              Also, it would greatly effect rushing a hive.


                              I've wanted SoF and Para to show up on the map for quite some time. I don't like taking the extra time to try and gauge the distance and size of the icon while looking at the map and spinning around. This is something I would like to see, and it doesn't really give you any information you can't already get, it would just make it easier to interpret the information.

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