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  • the cross-team recon/intel tool: your minimap

    Unless someone has questions, I don't have much to say about this. It's really quite simple:

    Use your minimap often, including before you ask others to give you recon/intel information.

    The minimap answers LOTS of questions:
    • node counts
    • tech structure availability
    • alien locations (and, once you gauge speed, their classes)
    • locations of dropped weapons (watch where your teammates die on the minimap)
    • locations of aliens before MT comes online (watch where your teammates die on the minimap)


    As we all work to silence the voicecomm as much as is reasonable to do, this is a great way to help. None of us should be on intel welfare. If each of us can take care of ourselves, let's do.

    If not, let's use the minimap, collectively, as a point of reference when it makes sense to do so while we communicate/coordinate our gameplay.
    Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

    Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

  • #2
    Re: the cross-team recon/intel tool: your minimap

    I often say on voice com things like "PG in vent" when I see one appear on the minimap and no one else has said it on voice com. I think there are things worth mentioning that you catch on the minimap because it matters to the whole team, and no matter how good people are about checking thier minimap not everyone will have seen it.

    I would say dropped weapons and phasegates are on the top of the list. That is, only if the dropped weapon is in a place people won't find it (hmg down on the ip...)

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    • #3
      Re: the cross-team recon/intel tool: your minimap

      Wyz's post is more about filling your own need for knowledge, whereas IP's is more about filling your team's need.
      [volun2]
      NS Game Officer. TF2 Admin. BF2 Admin / Scripter. PM with issues.
      Tempus: Pokerface is nailing it right on the head. Everyone who is arguing against him is simply arguing against reality.
      <anmuzi> it is not permitted to have privacy or anonymity
      <LazyEye> yeah when I play on TG the server digs though my trash

      Arm yourself with knowledge: TG NS TF2 BF2

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      • #4
        Re: the cross-team recon/intel tool: your minimap

        Correct.

        And I really do lean to the side that says get that information out on voicecomm if it /needs/ to be, but if each of us will take care of ourselves by /using/ our minimap to answer as many questions for /ourselves/ as we can, then the quieter the voicecomm will be for it.

        I know you can't know if everyone else sees what you see on the minimap, and I'm not saying that sharing that information in those situations is bad. I just want each of us doing everything we can to be as self-sufficient as we can when it comes to gathering intel and managing SA.
        Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

        Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

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        • #5
          Re: the cross-team recon/intel tool: your minimap

          Ah, like instead of saying "still need my help at aux gen?" you just look and answer the question yourself.

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          • #6
            Re: the cross-team recon/intel tool: your minimap

            Some of us have the minimap up nearly the entire game to get information as fast as possible. I don't think minimaps show up on demos, because if they did my demos would be nothing but minimap for a lot of the game. You can get nearly any piece of information you need from watching the minimap carefully: how many skulks were in that room (that a teammate could see), how many nodes you have capped, how many chambers your team has built, where those structures are that are under attack, etc. There are hundreds of things you can see by watching the minimap. It's also a good navigation tool for maps you do not know. I learn new maps as lerk by flying with the map down. It lets me focus on how to move around the room if I can't easily see the room (If you don't understand, go celerity lerk and bounce around a room for a while, it is disorienting). I see so many people ask things they can learn themselves by using the minimap.

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            • #7
              Re: the cross-team recon/intel tool: your minimap

              Originally posted by TheAdj`
              I see so many people ask things they can learn themselves by using the minimap.
              If someone missed something (like the pg location) and no one said what it was, would it be right to ask? I mean for the things on the minimap that do not appear for very long, if someone missed it they might want to know.

              I often ask if a certain hive is clear or if a node is empty even though if I had been paying more attention a minute ago I might have caught the answer to the question.

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              • #8
                Re: the cross-team recon/intel tool: your minimap

                We needn't have a culture that jumps on a guy every time he asks a question that his own minimap will answer. This isn't competitive play, and we're not all here to be billy badasses.

                One response style I like to use is "Yes, minimap says the node is still alive," or "No, minimap says we don't have a proto lab yet." You're giving a guy a fish and teaching him to fish at the same time.
                Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

                Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

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                • #9
                  Re: the cross-team recon/intel tool: your minimap

                  Originally posted by Irish Pirate
                  If someone missed something (like the pg location) and no one said what it was, would it be right to ask? I mean for the things on the minimap that do not appear for very long, if someone missed it they might want to know.

                  I often ask if a certain hive is clear or if a node is empty even though if I had been paying more attention a minute ago I might have caught the answer to the question.
                  The point is to teach people to use the minimap to answer questions for themselves. I haven't berated someone for asking a question like that, although it can be a bit irritating when half the team asks a question back-to-back-to-back that could have been answered if 1) they used the minimap and/or 2) listened enough the first one or two times it was said to get it. Liberal use of the minimap will make you a better player because you spend less time looking for information and more time acting on the information you have. Watching the minimap will tell you if a hive is clear because you will have seen billybob kill 2 marines there as fade then blink out, or you would have seen billybob get solo lmg'd as fade and know it's not clear. Using the kill/death messages, typed text, voicecomm, and minimap together will tell you literally everything you need to know about what is happening. Voicecomm should be about things people can't see clearly or easily on the minimap, or when the situation requires immediate attention. Examples would be "3 skulks in cargo" or "2 shotties in chem", it doesn't take a narrative to explain such a situation. People often simply say too many extra words that aren't needed, and it adds up.

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                  • #10
                    Re: the cross-team recon/intel tool: your minimap

                    What the minimap WONT tell you is, did that Fade just blink out after killing 2 marines because the room is clear, or because hes low on health and didnt want to get killed by the THIRD marine. Its still useful to ask on important questions like that, I'd say.

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                    • #11
                      Re: the cross-team recon/intel tool: your minimap

                      On the subject of voice com/intel/minimap I would like to bring something up not entirely on subject regarding a game I was in.

                      Marines had one hive locked down, and there was a stalemate between the rines and aliens for quite some time.

                      While watching the minimap I realized alot of aliens (higher lifeforms being of particular interest) were using the space between marine start and the locked down hive.

                      I tried to suggest we converge from both directions on this point when a fade or lerk comes in, but between difficulty communicating it and basically the requirement that everyone be on board and paying attention to when a fade came in made it impossible.

                      In general I think it would be cool to see more team-wide tactical opportunities used when available. One of the things that would benefit this would be more minimap use, and reservation of voice coms for more important things. Anything that facilitiates communication will help with teamwork.

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                      • #12
                        Re: the cross-team recon/intel tool: your minimap

                        Originally posted by Irish Pirate
                        Anything that facilitiates communication will help with teamwork.
                        Herein lies the crux, really. Yes, communication can help with teamwork, but...

                        Communication can also harm teamwork.

                        Imagine, if you will, someone on voicecomm telling the team what armor upgrade level the marines had every single time he engaged one in battle. You reaction is "why is he telling us what we already know, all the while making it harder for me to hear and manage SA?"

                        It's the same /type of/ thing when it comes to announcing things that the minimap has already told your teammates. The guys who've already /listened to/ the minimap are hearing me report how many nodes my team has, and all they're thinking is "why is he telling me what I already know, all the while making it harder for me to hear how many marines are coming around the corner?"

                        Again, TGNS will never be the server where players are expected to rise to every pinnacle of NS play, but we've got a lot of improvement ahead of us regarding (collective and individual) use of the minimap.
                        Steam Community? Add me. | Free Remote, Encrypted Backup

                        Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Zephyr: Apophis is clearly a highly sophisticated self-aware AI construct that runs on a highly modified toaster oven in Wyzcrak's basement.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: the cross-team recon/intel tool: your minimap

                          Originally posted by Kerostasis
                          What the minimap WONT tell you is, did that Fade just blink out after killing 2 marines because the room is clear, or because hes low on health and didnt want to get killed by the THIRD marine. Its still useful to ask on important questions like that, I'd say.
                          You can get a good feel by watching how the fade move around. Is he walking around trying to swipe people or his he moving really fast around the room. You also will likely see the marines on the minimap, although not 100% usually you will see everything the player sees.

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                          • #14
                            Re: the cross-team recon/intel tool: your minimap

                            er... I believe the implication was useful communication.

                            I mean that communication is a prerequesite for teamwork. There are bad forms of it however that do not lead to anything with "team" in it.

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