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  • Electrical Geniuses Read...

    So I may be dreaming a bit, but I've concidered the findings and have always wondered about the Iron Curtain.

    The actual machine that could target and zap anyone within a certain range. It's definately possible, just not... plausible. I can understand the risk of creating something of this magnitude, but I just wonder if it's actually possible to do it.

    And on another note. I've always had thoughts that amps can push tangible objects. We all know it's possible, due to Japan's creation of the electric race car, that can reach speeds of 150 mph in less than 15 seconds. It may go fast, but it won't go far.

    So here's it is. In theory, a generator attatched to a moving wheel can create enough electricty to keep a battery charged. I think that the people who are designing electric cars are thinking the wrong way.

    They created an engine recently I saw on TV. Instead of the engine being cylindrical, it was triangular based. Imagine a triangle with a smaller triangle moving inside it, positioned so it can turn, with ball bearings, or the equivalent, on the edges so that it would roll inside of the other triangle. Now smooth the edges, and points, into curves.

    Take that, and attach a rod to both ends of it, connected to a generator, attatched to an amplifier system. Say we can produce 30 volts from each generator on each end of the triangular device, without the amplifier system figured in. 60 volts on each side... blah I'm forgetting my formulas... Don't feel like getting the book out, so you do the math to total amps. Could we produce enough energy to be stored and reused?

    Now, say on the axles of the car, we attatch two of these devices, doubling our output to 120 volts, enough to power a home. Connect all of that to a capacitor. Could we create and store enough charge to power the car itself on strict electricity? This all goes back to realitivity, really. We know we'd have to have the enitial movement, but concider a car with a tank at about 2 gallons instead of 10... 20. 2 gallons to get the initial movement, reducing CO2 creation to a dull minimum, then the car will power itself.

    My question to all of you electrical geeks... is it possible?

    And on that note, if it is possible, say we doubled the size of everything, and stored them in cylinders, two pair sitting together. Connect all of that to a giant conductor, to store the charge, then release on command.

    The theory of the iron curtain itself relied on a discharge to a negative from a positive point. Concider you being the negative, and the lightning rod being the positive. Theoretically, it's possible. I don't believe that human's create enough disturbance, but larger objects do. Jets, tanks, etc. I'm not entirely sure this is possible, but imagine for a moment a newer targeting system. Spec ops paints a target with a red laser, and the missile goes to that laser. Would it be possible to create a device that painted a target with a negative charge.. enough for a positive charge to surge across open space and connect to it. I get tunnel vision when I think of positive and negative electrons attracting. I feel that there has to be something other than open space between the two for them to even know they are there. Lightning tells us differently, but lightning is a phenomenon. It's quadrupal anything we can produce, and chaotic to boot. So, with the technology we have today, does tunnel vision apply? Do you have to have A connected to B to pass electricity thru open space at long distances?

    Just some ideas, fellas.

    I know we got some electrical majors out there somewhere.

    Talk to me.

    -Mom

    *Edit/Footnote - On the theory of pushing a car with electricity. Say we came up with a formula to determine mph to amps. Say... 1 amp is 10 mph. The formula could be factored into the acceleration system, to determine how much of a charge the capacitor needs to emit to go 10 mph. If we could come up with enough amperage, could we produce something that would travel ATLEAST 60, and regenerate itself after its initial burst of movement? Think of the gas pedal as a rotational button, rather than a push down pedal. Set the knob to 60, and the capacitor knows that it has to emit 6 amps per cycle. I haven't figured out how to stabalize the ride yet, because every emition would be a burst of speed, rather than a carry-on. Maybe we could create another knob to factor in continual force? Or possibly, after the car reaches a certain speed, the back axle could become a continual force mechanism rather than a pushing mechanism.

    Or possibly, I should stop editting this. Maybe... I know that we're talking about seconds here when we talk about electricity. Hell, miliseconds. Relay systems take time for the electricity to pass through them. Would it be possible to create a relay system strong enough, and slow enough, to actually BACK UP the charge itself... kind've like NS overflow of res.. one person has 100, the next person gets what the first didn't get until they reach 100. If we made a relay system slow enough to hold 60 volts for say... 3 seconds... the 3 seconds it takes to create the second burst of 60 volts, would they double or just combine to a hold of 60 volts?

    And on a secondary note... say we spread the electricity over several capacitors, rather than one. Where I said before one capacitor held the initial 60, 6 capacitors hold 10. When you call for 60 miles an hour, the 6 capacitors release a paused burst... IE: cap 1 fires, wait 1 second, cap 2 fires, wait 1 second, cap 3 fires, etc.

    It may be a bit weaker, but it would definately smooth the ride from the initial 60 volt burst.

    Ideas?
    Last edited by Yer Mom; 08-07-2006, 12:16 AM.
    Yer Mom /O>

    To all but me is the look given but never received. My heart sinks faster and faster every time I look into them, yet I do not understand their controling power on my soul. - W11114m W45h1n670n

  • #2
    Re: Electrical Geniuses Read...

    This is a joke, right?
    Peace through fear... since 1947!

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Electrical Geniuses Read...

      Heat is an energy source? What kind of generator are you thinking about which is powered by heat?

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Electrical Geniuses Read...

        The heat thing was a kind've burst before my real explination started. Ignore it. And no, this is very much not a joke. If you'd like to read jokes, the sandbox is open, and you can show yourself to it, rather than to my post.

        Thanks.

        -Mom
        Yer Mom /O>

        To all but me is the look given but never received. My heart sinks faster and faster every time I look into them, yet I do not understand their controling power on my soul. - W11114m W45h1n670n

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        • #5
          Re: Electrical Geniuses Read...

          You need to read a basic physics book.

          Or just look at today's hybrid cars. You'll see that they try to recapture energy through regenerative braking, but you can't use a battery to power a generator that refills the battery without getting significant energy loss. You're forgetting all the other forces that are affecting the vehicle, as well as energy loss in the form of heat/resistance, the power required for the vehicles computer, displays and controls, the power for the environmental controls and some other means that I'm probably not even aware of...

          As for your Command and Conquer "weapon", it would be possible if you were able to charge your target either positively or negatively before zapping it, but even if you could do that, there are far, FAR more efficient ways to destroy someone/something.

          You need to read a physics book.
          Become a supporting member!
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          • #6
            Re: Electrical Geniuses Read...

            Originally posted by sordavie
            Heat is an energy source? What kind of generator are you thinking about which is powered by heat?
            Heat is an energy source? Ummm, yeah. Ever seen a train?

            I think Yer Mom must've edited whatever your comments were directed at, because they don't make sense now...
            Become a supporting member!
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            • #7
              Re: Electrical Geniuses Read...

              Sorry, maybe I was a bit rude, but much of what you wrote is so far off that I did think you might just be trying to mess with my mind. It is good to have an interest in these things, but you really need to spend some time learning about them before you try to invent the next big thing.

              The engine you are talking about sounds alot like a Wankel rotary engine.

              All energy transformations involve inefficiencies. You cannot recover all of the energy lost in ANY of these processes without breaking the laws of thermodynamics. Therefore, no process can produce motion and then use that motion to produce energy which in turn produces the original motion.

              I'm not sure what relativity has to do with anything unless you are using those amps to do some cold fusion.

              Your idea might work if the "gas" pedal was replaced with a pair of pedals attached to cranks. That way you could put energy into the vehicle to keep it in motion.

              As for the other thing, yes, if a voltage buildup is high enough, electricity will jump across a large gap. Like lightning, for example. Look up Marx generators, and don't blame me if you kill yourself.
              Peace through fear... since 1947!

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Electrical Geniuses Read...

                Apparently, I've mis-spoken my words in such a way that it's confused people. I will no longer continue with this thread, and I will keep my thoughts to myself from now on. To be absolutely honest, after 3 years of TG, I don't think I'll be returning to this portion of the forums.

                You guys have a good day.

                My apologies for expressing my thought.

                -Mom
                Yer Mom /O>

                To all but me is the look given but never received. My heart sinks faster and faster every time I look into them, yet I do not understand their controling power on my soul. - W11114m W45h1n670n

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Electrical Geniuses Read...

                  :(
                  ~~ Veritas simplex oratio est ~~
                  No matter how far a wizard goes, he will always come back for his hat. --T. Pratchett

                  <---- You know you're getting old when you rely on your forum meta-data to remind you how old you are.

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                  • #10
                    Re: Electrical Geniuses Read...

                    I don't understand much of what you've written, but I think you should calm down and try again instead. You might want to put some serious thought into your idea and organize your thoughts in order to better communicate your unpatented-and-therefore-fair-game idea. Please, continue.

                    Generally speaking, whenever a perpetual motion idea comes up, it has neglected some interactions with the machine's various parts. Usually friction and hidden momentum-killers (remember all those equal and opposite reactions to every forward push your machine generates). Usually those equal and opposite reactions are converted from kinetic energy to heat (otherwise the machine wouldn't move). Some devices, like a turbo charger, convert waste back into kinetic energy and make the machine more powerful or efficient. There are certainly tremendous gains to be had over the conventional combustion engine.

                    However, a perpetual motion machine is antithetical to current physics theories. You'll need a new playbook before you can get your machine to work fully.

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                    • #11
                      Re: Electrical Geniuses Read...

                      YerMom, what are you taking so personally? Why would you start a thread like this and then when people point out your errors, leave?
                      Become a supporting member!
                      Buy a Tactical Duck!
                      Take the world's smallest political quiz! "I was touched by His Noodly Appendage."
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                      • #12
                        Re: Electrical Geniuses Read...

                        The electrical weapon idea would be possible, but until the ammount of energy needed becomes cheaper than a bullet, it won't be used. Don't give up on your ideas, because all ideas hit problems. You posted this because you wanted help, and we are giving you our imput.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Electrical Geniuses Read...

                          You're basically trying to create a perpetual motion machine, which violates the laws of thermodynamics. Assuming even 100% (which a standard internal combustion engine gets around 30-40% (if even) efficiency, you still can't get more energy than you put in.

                          And heat really isn't an energy source, it IS energy. I may be off, but I'm pretty sure an energy source would reference potential energy (like fuel) rather than heat, electricity, etc.

                          Just like a battery is an energy source for electrical energy and coal is an energy source for heat energy.

                          Yea, it's a nitpick, but it's fun.

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                          • #14
                            Re: Electrical Geniuses Read...

                            Actually you can convert heat into electrical current with a Peltier Junction.
                            This page covers some this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peltier-Seebeck_effect

                            Of course you still cannot overcome the basic laws of physics. A device will ALWAYS dissipate more energy than you put into it. There is no such thing as a perpetual motion machine.
                            Retired 6th DB

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                            • #15
                              Re: Electrical Geniuses Read...

                              Noooo - MOM.. don't be that way! I like to see people post things to invite discussion.. don't let it get to you when your idea gets poked apart.. it could get built up just as well. Your thoughts DO have merit and they are in use to some extent in various ways, however as it was noted, without getting into a belabored explaination, the root of the issue is efficiency - for now the concept is too inefficient to be practical.

                              Once upon a time the hydrogen fuel cell was too inefficient to be used as a power source for cars and homes.. it's only recently been rated as 50% efficient.. so an HFC produces 50% heat/loss for 50% desired energy (in the form of electricity) per kg of fuel used. - before anyone tears me up on that, that is a rough recollection of what one of our companies publishes for it's HFC's efficiency stats.

                              That make sense?
                              sigpic


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