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  • 8800GT performs worse than X1950 PRO.

    Here 's the deal, my MSI X1950Pro 512Mb pci-e died 2 months ago and the most obvious choice to replace it with was an Nvidia 8800GT, so I got myself an ASUS 8800GT. After removing the ATI drivers and installing the latest Forceware drivers everything seemed perfect, loaded up Project Reality in a local server and got an average of 70FPS. Now for some reason when I joined a full server - with the same settings as my older ATI card - I got worse FPS...

    A card that outperforms the PRO in every benchmark should not perform this bad, even on a 2-3 year old engine. I checked the temps with Everest on my keyboard LCD (G15) after playing for a few hours:

    GPU = 84, CPU= 63, HD=45, MOBO=45.

    This all looks normal and same as two months ago so all I can think of is that my PSU cannot deliver enough power for the GT to run at full power. Box sais it 's recommended to have a min PSU of 400W. I got a webpage from Sabre here on the forums where I went to check the recommended PSU for my system and when I filled out the fields I got the next results:

    With GT -> Recommended PSU Wattage: 354W
    With PRO -> Recommended PSU Wattage: 328W

    Does anyone think a GT will run at lower clock speeds if it doesn't get enough power and can anyone give me a good program to monitor this?

    Full specs:

    Manufacturer: Medion
    Processor: Intel(R) Pentium(R) 4 CPU 3.20GHz 200FSB (HT on)
    Memory: 4GB DDR PC3200 (4x1GB Kingston)
    Hard Drive: Western Digital WD1600JD-00hBB0 (160GB S-ATA)
    Video Card: ASUS 8800GT 512MB PCI-E
    Monitor: Samsung SyncMaster 205BW ([email protected])
    Sound Card: C-Media Rear Panel Audio
    Speakers/Headphones: Panasonic/Typhoon
    Keyboard: Logitech G15
    Mouse: Logitech G7
    PSU: Fortron 350W
    Operating System: Windows XP Professional SP2 Dutch
    Xfire: Iaintyourm8 | Ingame: GhostDog | Steam: Zuigmijnballen


  • #2
    Re: 8800GT performs worse than X1950 PRO.

    I'm not a hardware expert, but I know your PSU wattage looks really low considering the build you have. You might want to upgrade that first of all. With 4GB of RAM and that GPU you have, I would just get a 500W. It can't be that much more expensive than plopping a 400 in there.

    Second, your GPU temp looks way too high. If you haven't already, you might want to consider picking up an Arctic Cooling (or Zalman, or whatever brand you prefer) cooling unit for your GPU. I was running at around 85-90 sustained during gameplay on my current video card when I first got it, and I was getting major artifacting and crashing to desktop playing games like BF2. The Arctic Cooling unit brought me down to about 60 sustained and I haven't had any of those problems since.
    "No bastard ever won a war by dying for his country.
    He won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country."

    - Attributed to General George Patton, Jr.

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    • #3
      Re: 8800GT performs worse than X1950 PRO.

      I 'm thinking of getting a 600W PSU, in case I wanna run Crossfire or SLI when I upgrade in a few months.

      I heard people who have their GT running at 92 or higher, it 's normal for the GT afaik. Whether it 's healthy or not, I don't really care cause I got a 2 year warranty and if it crashes like my PRO did (within 1 year), I 'll get a cheap upgrade :).

      Just wondering if the GT is running on lower clock speeds than it should...
      Xfire: Iaintyourm8 | Ingame: GhostDog | Steam: Zuigmijnballen

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      • #4
        Re: 8800GT performs worse than X1950 PRO.

        Doesn't sound like you need more power or it's too hot, it usually just shuts off, restarts or gives you artifacts if that happens.

        - Try another game or run 3dmark or some other test program and see what you get. Problem may be with PR itself like it's been said here.

        - Lower your settings or try just different graphic settings (turn off AA and AF etc) and see if that helps



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        • #5
          Re: 8800GT performs worse than X1950 PRO.

          Originally posted by Superfast View Post
          Doesn't sound like you need more power or it's too hot, it usually just shuts off, restarts or gives you artifacts if that happens.
          What I thought, I used to be able to monitor my clockspeeds with Everest, but it doesn't seem to work with the GT... maybe I need to upgrade to a newer version. My PRO did stop working after 10 months after giving me artifacts... I had about 3 VPU recovers/month but one day the VPU recover kept resetting my GPU and I ended up with artifacts after a reboot.

          Originally posted by Superfast View Post
          - Try another game or run 3dmark or some other test program and see what you get. Problem may be with PR itself like it's been said here.
          Team Fortress 2 works fine with everything maxed out, AAx16 etc...
          I had the same problem with PR 0.61, so it 's not related to 0.7.

          Originally posted by Superfast View Post
          - Lower your settings or try just different graphic settings (turn off AA and AF etc) and see if that helps
          I 've set dynamic shadows + lighting to medium and AAx4, which helps but I still drop below 20 FPS when there 's a lot going on. Used to run with both these settings on high and AAx6 without any drops like that :(.

          Thx for the info all.
          Xfire: Iaintyourm8 | Ingame: GhostDog | Steam: Zuigmijnballen

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          • #6
            Re: 8800GT performs worse than X1950 PRO.

            Originally posted by Ghost Dog View Post

            GPU = 84, CPU= 63, HD=45, MOBO=45.
            If that is 63 C, then your processor is overheating and is what is causing your "horrible framerates".
            |TG-18th| Acreo Aeneas
            TG World of Tanks Clan Executive Officer
            Former 9th & 13th

            Pronounciation: Eh-Cree-Oh Ah-Nay-Ess
            Still can't say it? Call me Acorn then. -.-





            SSDs I Own: Kingston HyperX 3K (240 GB), Samsung 840 Pro (256 GB), Samsung 840 EVO (250 GB), Samsung 840 x 2 (120 GB), Plextor M5S (120 GB), OCZ Vertex (30 GB)

            TG Primer and Rules

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            • #7
              Re: 8800GT performs worse than X1950 PRO.

              Not if the same temperature was fine with the ATi card. It's warm, but Intels can handle it.

              It is possible that the misbehavior is because the video card is struggling for juice, and I'd definitely get 500+ watts in there. I'd spend the hundred clams and fix that problem just on principle and because it's always bad to have a power supply die on you. However, you should test many games and see if it's specific to any one of them. Your video ram is the same, but if the new card is doing something stupid (rendering eye candy) that the previous card didn't, or if you pushed the resolution up, you might be just crossing the video ram limit and are suffering paging hell. Try dropping texture by one or two steps and seeing if that fixes it.

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              • #8
                Re: 8800GT performs worse than X1950 PRO.

                Originally posted by Acreo Aeneas View Post
                If that is 63 C, then your processor is overheating and is what is causing your "horrible framerates".
                It is 63C. When I switch off hyperthreading it 's usually at 100% when I play PR. With HT enabled both CPU 's are around 40-50%.

                I know the Core 2 's should stay below 62C but I had no idea whether this applied to P4 's too. Weird thing is, I did not have this problem with my PRO so maybe the GT is heating up my CPU and the rest of my case with its 84C...

                I 'm gonna buy a new PSU nevertheless, a modular one with two fans to draw more heat out of my case. I should upgrade around may so a new PSU will be a good start :).
                Xfire: Iaintyourm8 | Ingame: GhostDog | Steam: Zuigmijnballen

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                • #9
                  Re: 8800GT performs worse than X1950 PRO.

                  your browning out m8. replace the psu. i have a 680 in mine.

                  and yes heat will effect everything else and also keep your fans running at full tilt longer. all in all your putting everything under stress with that current psu.

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                  • #10
                    Re: 8800GT performs worse than X1950 PRO.

                    Originally posted by Ghost Dog View Post
                    It is 63C. When I switch off hyperthreading it 's usually at 100% when I play PR. With HT enabled both CPU 's are around 40-50%.

                    I know the Core 2 's should stay below 62C but I had no idea whether this applied to P4 's too. Weird thing is, I did not have this problem with my PRO so maybe the GT is heating up my CPU and the rest of my case with its 84C...

                    I 'm gonna buy a new PSU nevertheless, a modular one with two fans to draw more heat out of my case. I should upgrade around may so a new PSU will be a good start :).
                    Intel CPUs should operate at under 61.4 C (throttling temperature).

                    For Intel chips, if you go beyond 61.4 C in temp, then the CPU will throttle down to about 15-25% efficiency. In short, instead of having a nice Pentium 4, you'd have something more akin to a Pentium 2. The throttling happens so the CPU itself doesn't burn out form the overheating.


                    @Magna,
                    I bolded the CPU temperature not the GPU temperature. The GPU temp is fine as far as I can tell, but the CPU temp is higher than what it should be for a Pentium 4.


                    Ghost, check to make sure you have the heatsink/fan on your Pentium 4 seated properly (all four hooks are in and there is no wobbling from corner to corner).

                    If they are all in, then you should probably consider getting a better heatsink fan for your processor.

                    I know from experience that the P4's with HT (especially the E class Prescotts) are way hotter than anything out on the market today (even the Pentium Ds).
                    |TG-18th| Acreo Aeneas
                    TG World of Tanks Clan Executive Officer
                    Former 9th & 13th

                    Pronounciation: Eh-Cree-Oh Ah-Nay-Ess
                    Still can't say it? Call me Acorn then. -.-





                    SSDs I Own: Kingston HyperX 3K (240 GB), Samsung 840 Pro (256 GB), Samsung 840 EVO (250 GB), Samsung 840 x 2 (120 GB), Plextor M5S (120 GB), OCZ Vertex (30 GB)

                    TG Primer and Rules

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: 8800GT performs worse than X1950 PRO.

                      Clear out the shader cache for Battlefield even if the game already did it for you. That may cause a performance issue.

                      The PSU seems to be ok but may be the cause of the poor performance. Although, it's more likely that an insufficient PSU would cause instability problems or not turn on.

                      - It's who you game with.

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                      • #12
                        Re: 8800GT performs worse than X1950 PRO.

                        i know my 8800 performed better when i got a good quality 600-watt PS...the old 400 i had could not cut the mustard i guess..


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                        • #13
                          Re: 8800GT performs worse than X1950 PRO.

                          My understanding is that only a few of the highest end brands of PSUs are actually equiped to deliver their maximum rating day in and day out. I agree with the others that this needs to be addressed (and would have to be with any additional changes in the future). Start there and see what happens.


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                          • #14
                            Re: 8800GT performs worse than X1950 PRO.

                            unbelivable !
                            You are very lucky, that your computer post's ! PSU all the way.
                            You also have to get some airflow going. Ambient temp is 20 C too high?
                            Heat and power is your problem.
                            3 fans = 30 bucks or less
                            500+ PSU = 50 bucks or less

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: 8800GT performs worse than X1950 PRO.

                              Originally posted by Acreo Aeneas View Post
                              For Intel chips, if you go beyond 61.4 C in temp, then the CPU will throttle down to about 15-25% efficiency. In short, instead of having a nice Pentium 4, you'd have something more akin to a Pentium 2. The throttling happens so the CPU itself doesn't burn out form the overheating.
                              If that 's true than this might be my problem. I know the GT spreads a lot more heat than the PRO...

                              Originally posted by Acreo Aeneas View Post
                              Ghost, check to make sure you have the heatsink/fan on your Pentium 4 seated properly (all four hooks are in and there is no wobbling from corner to corner).
                              It hasn't moved since the day I bought it so I 'm pretty sure it 's well seated.

                              Originally posted by =Sarc= View Post
                              Clear out the shader cache for Battlefield even if the game already did it for you. That may cause a performance issue.
                              I always do that when I install new drivers :).

                              Originally posted by IcemanGER View Post
                              3 fans = 30 bucks or less
                              500+ PSU = 50 bucks or less
                              Things are a little more expensive on this side of the water... you won't find a good, efficient PSU of 500+ for less then 80€. I think I 'm going with the Zalman ZM600-HP, which costs about 100€. I prefer modular cause I like to keep my case as clean as possible.

                              Thx all for the advice, I 'll let you know how it turns out :).
                              Xfire: Iaintyourm8 | Ingame: GhostDog | Steam: Zuigmijnballen

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