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Thou Doth Protest Too Much

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  • Thou Doth Protest Too Much

    We always knew it was true. Now there is science to back up the claim that homophobes are really only afraid of themselves.

    http://www.selfhelpmagazine.com/arti...lbtphobia.html

  • #2
    Re: Thou Doth Protest Too Much

    Ha! I can't wait to show this to some of the rednecks at work!
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    • #3
      Re: Thou Doth Protest Too Much

      I'm just happy to see that science has managed to quantify boner wood. Bravo, Science!

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      • #4
        Re: Thou Doth Protest Too Much

        Originally posted by leejo View Post
        Bravo, Science!
        We're here to serve...
        ~~ Veritas simplex oratio est ~~
        No matter how far a wizard goes, he will always come back for his hat. --T. Pratchett

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        • #5
          Re: Thou Doth Protest Too Much

          According to this theory, viewing the male homosexual videotape may have caused negative emotions (such as anxiety) in the homophobic men, but not in the non-homophobic men. As the authors note, "anxiety has been shown to enhance arousal and erection," and so it is also possible that "a response to homosexual stimuli [in these men] is a function of the threat condition rather than sexual arousal per se.
          has it shown anything, we know that homophobic men will find the pictures of men having sex with other men disturbing and in some cases infuriating. so what did the study prove, its STILL a matter of interpretation.... :row__681:


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          • #6
            Re: Thou Doth Protest Too Much

            Ah but you see the threat condition is the result of one of Anna Freud's defense mechanisms: Reaction Formation. Defense mechanisms are designed to surpress anxiety by any means possible. In this particular case, and in homophobic reactions to homosexual activity in general, the sexual arousal increase, of which erection is just one factor, is the cause of the anxiety (Adams, Wright & Lohr, 1996. p. 443). Thus, with the anxiety (or as they say, threat condition) present, the mind attempts to neutralize the anxiety by reaction formation : homophobic males underestimate their sexual arousal and act stereotypically homophobic to surpress their anxiety, despite the recording devices used to track them still showing more arousal than that of nonhomophobic men. Arousal, and accordingly erection, to homosexual activity among those who biologically find homosexual actions appealing but are conditioned to treat it as evil suffer intense anxiety, which is countered by their reaction formation defense mechanism into various levels of "gay bashing", according to their degree of arousal. The more you subconsciously desire homosexual actions, the more you will speak out against them. If you find yourself with no anxiety towards homosexuals, you have no homosexual desires.

            Also, I may note that there are no studies that I am aware of that would link threat conditions to sexual arousal, as our ancestors having an erection while trying to flee a tiger was most likely not an effective use of blood that could have been rerouted to your leg muscles. Evolution simply wouldn't have it. There is no logical reason to link threat condition to arousal, I doubt any of you get erections while defending a flag in BF2.

            P.S. "The Lady Doth Protest Too Much, Methinks" is a direct quote from Hamlet having to do specifically with the idea of reaction formation, speaking vehemently against what we desire so that we are no longer anxious about it.
            -Zephyr
            Last edited by Zephyr; 12-19-2006, 02:10 PM.
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            • #7
              Re: Thou Doth Protest Too Much

              While I'd like to believe it, this study proves nothing.
              A policy of freedom for the individual is the only truly progressive policy. -F.A. Hayek

              "$250,000 a year won't get me to Central Park West."

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              • #8
                Re: Thou Doth Protest Too Much

                Sexual tastes dictate biological arousal.

                Biological arousal generates homosexual desires.

                Homosexual desires are not socially acceptable.

                Not being accepted in society is something people fear.

                Fear is a direct cause cause of anxiety.

                Anxiety is dealt with through defense mechanisms.

                A defense mechanism called Reaction Formation can stop anxiety through conversion of desire.

                Conversion of desire through Reaction Formation creates homophobic "gay bashing"

                (there are other conversions through the other defense mechanisms as well that provide additional variations of homophobia that are more uncommon and less visible than "gay bashing". "Gay bashing" may be the most popular, however, due to its highly visible nature to those around you).

                Homophobia is caused by Reaction Formation.

                Reaction Formation is caused by anxiety.

                Anxiety is caused by fear.

                Fear is caused by not being socially acceptable.

                Not being socially acceptable is caused by having homosexual desires.

                Homosexual desires orinigate in biological arousal.

                Biological arousal is dictated by sexual tastes.

                ---
                While you may still say it doesn't prove it, the logic and evidence is there and solid: (Adams, Wright, & Lohr, 1996)

                -Zephyr
                You were once like the newbie who needed a hand from above and TacticalGamer gave you it.

                You owe the newbie who comes after you that same outstretched hand from above on your honor as a Tactical Gamer.

                Tactics at TG come from trust and friendship, not meticulous detail and rigid discipline.

                Everyone should be assumed mature until proven otherwise.

                We are no clan.
                We are not a single game.
                We are mature, intelligent, and cooperative individuals.
                We are TacticalGamer, a community above and beyond its name.

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                • #9
                  Re: Thou Doth Protest Too Much

                  Originally posted by Zephyr View Post
                  Sexual tastes dictate biological arousal.
                  How these researchers progress from the above quoted statement to, "anyone who shows even slight arousal while watching xxx type of pornagraphy is therefore an xxx him or herself," I don't know.

                  Of course, the above quoted statement is not itself proven either. But that's a whole 'nother can of worms.
                  A policy of freedom for the individual is the only truly progressive policy. -F.A. Hayek

                  "$250,000 a year won't get me to Central Park West."

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Thou Doth Protest Too Much

                    Originally posted by xTYBALTx View Post
                    "anyone who shows even slight arousal while watching xxx type of pornagraphy is therefore an xxx him or herself," I don't know.
                    Okay come on that's not what I wrote or what I was trying to say...I mean IS AN XXX? There aren't two opposite points in sexuality, rather it is a very flexible spectrum. Just because you're more preferential to one side doesn't mean you don't have any interest whatsoever in the other. Yes there are men who happen to be at the extreme of only liking women and I would be led to believe that they're the ones who show no arousal at the sight of homosexual acts, not the one's aroused, threatened, and subsequently more homophobic after encountering it.

                    We are talking about an 80% arousal rate in self-identified homophobic men versus a 33% arousal rate in self-identified non-homophobic men. (Adams, Wright & Lohr, 1996. p. 443)

                    That difference is VERY statistically significant, and remember that threats do not sexually arouse, only something biologically preset or learned to be a sexual stimulation will.

                    -Zephyr
                    You were once like the newbie who needed a hand from above and TacticalGamer gave you it.

                    You owe the newbie who comes after you that same outstretched hand from above on your honor as a Tactical Gamer.

                    Tactics at TG come from trust and friendship, not meticulous detail and rigid discipline.

                    Everyone should be assumed mature until proven otherwise.

                    We are no clan.
                    We are not a single game.
                    We are mature, intelligent, and cooperative individuals.
                    We are TacticalGamer, a community above and beyond its name.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Thou Doth Protest Too Much

                      Well, from a medical standpoint, I can contradict this. Any guy who has ever walked the earth has become aroused for absolutely no perceptible reason. Could it be subconscious? sure. More likely, this is caused by a release of blood due to a sudden increase or decrease in blood pressure from one part of the body to another, causing a sterile equalization process, frequently resulting in sexual arousal (happens to both men and women).

                      I also know women who have become aroused due to atmospherical conditions, such as wind or heat. Does this mean that these women prefer to have sex with objects in nature because they are "biologically" aroused by natural phenomenon? For that instance, I know many straight women who feel that the phallus is grotesque, does this make them homosexual by the fact that they do not find arousal in the genetalia of the opposite sex? No.

                      Why do some people refuse and swear they "hate" certain kinds of alcohol? I'm sure every one of us knows someone who "wont touch" tequila because they had a bad experience with it. Isnt homophobia a rational conclusion to pull from a similar experience with someone who is homosexual? Everyone knows there are guys who get inappropriate and handsy around girls, couldnt the same be true of homosexuals around members of their preferred gender? It's a reflex action in this case.

                      Bottom line is that there are always going to be theories like this. The key word being "theory"; this is not scientific proof. Think about all the things that are disputed that we have proof of (e.g. we know that evolution exists, however it is still one of the most disputed topics of our era). Then think about all the things we can only speculate about (e.g. a cancer patient in terminal phase who goes into complete remission in less than a week without anything that we can explain taking place).

                      Some things you simply cant prove, which is why psychology is theoretical and is treated through human contact and communication. Psychiatry is treated with medication based on chemical imbalances we've discovered in the brain that can be helped or cured through pharmacology. Homosexuality or any other preference is not something we can explain or rationalize by saying "if you're a homophobe, you're homosexual".

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                      • #12
                        Re: Thou Doth Protest Too Much

                        Originally posted by Buck Fush View Post
                        We always knew it was true. Now there is science to back up the claim that homophobes are really only afraid of themselves.

                        http://www.selfhelpmagazine.com/arti...lbtphobia.html
                        If this were posted on fark.com, the tag would be "Still no cure for cancer."


                        The time for calm and rational discussion has passed. Now is the time for senseless bickering.

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                        • #13
                          Re: Thou Doth Protest Too Much

                          Personally, I don't really care *why* someone is homophobic any more than I care why someone is racist or why someone robs a liquor store. I simply put distance between myself and that sort of behavior.

                          With regard to this study, I suspect that it proves little more than the fact that pretty much anything will make most men horny. If you force 10 guys to watch a midget and a donkey and a chick throw down, the majority will find a way to...how to say this?....make the best of a bad situation.

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                          • #14
                            Re: Thou Doth Protest Too Much

                            Originally posted by Ferris Bueller View Post
                            Well, from a medical standpoint, I can contradict this. Any guy who has ever walked the earth has become aroused for absolutely no perceptible reason. Could it be subconscious? sure. More likely, this is caused by a release of blood due to a sudden increase or decrease in blood pressure from one part of the body to another, causing a sterile equalization process, frequently resulting in sexual arousal (happens to both men and women).
                            Yet this does not explain why in the given experimental condition twice as many men who were self-identified as homophobic experienced arousal to homosexual activity.
                            Originally posted by Ferris Bueller View Post
                            I also know women who have become aroused due to atmospherical conditions, such as wind or heat. Does this mean that these women prefer to have sex with objects in nature because they are "biologically" aroused by natural phenomenon? For that instance, I know many straight women who feel that the phallus is grotesque, does this make them homosexual by the fact that they do not find arousal in the genetalia of the opposite sex? No.
                            We are not critiquing the reactions of men to the penis but rather to homosexual actions. Biological arousal to atmospheric conditions is an interesting phenomenon in its own right, but far too different to be worth comparing to this study as counter-evidence.
                            Originally posted by Ferris Bueller View Post
                            Why do some people refuse and swear they "hate" certain kinds of alcohol? I'm sure every one of us knows someone who "wont touch" tequila because they had a bad experience with it. Isnt homophobia a rational conclusion to pull from a similar experience with someone who is homosexual? Everyone knows there are guys who get inappropriate and handsy around girls, couldnt the same be true of homosexuals around members of their preferred gender? It's a reflex action in this case.
                            Yes it is absolutely a reflex action, reaction formation is exactly that. However, do homosexually abused children additionally become sexually aroused to the point of erection upon encountering homosexual material? This is doubtful, however a study must be found to verify such an opinion. The issue at hand is the sexual arousal in addition to the reaction formation, suggesting a link between repressed sexual arousal and reaction formation violence/prejudice. There are still, however, 20&#37; of the self-identified homophobes who did not experience sexual arousal to the homosexual actions, yet are still homophobic. Absolutely not all homophobia is caused by repressed sexual desires and this study does not aim to say that. Those who may have sexual responses to homosexual material are also absolutely not guaranteed to be completely homosexual in their sexual attraction. Nonetheless, the evidence gathered from this study shows that there is a likely correlation between sexual arousal to homosexual actions and homophobia.
                            Originally posted by Ferris Bueller View Post
                            Bottom line is that there are always going to be theories like this. The key word being "theory"; this is not scientific proof. Think about all the things that are disputed that we have proof of (e.g. we know that evolution exists, however it is still one of the most disputed topics of our era). Then think about all the things we can only speculate about (e.g. a cancer patient in terminal phase who goes into complete remission in less than a week without anything that we can explain taking place).

                            Some things you simply cant prove, which is why psychology is theoretical and is treated through human contact and communication. Psychiatry is treated with medication based on chemical imbalances we've discovered in the brain that can be helped or cured through pharmacology. Homosexuality or any other preference is not something we can explain or rationalize by saying "if you're a homophobe, you're homosexual".
                            HEY! If you are going to incorrectly state what they're saying to slander their argument, don't say anything! This is twice now people have simplified the study's argument to something that it is NOT saying.

                            If you are a self-identified homophobe, it is statistically likely, but in no way guaranteed, that exposure to homosexual actions will enact sexual arousal and subsequent genital response. Such responses do not pinpoint you as being homosexual or heterosexual, as with sexuality being a spectrum and homosexual arousal and experience among heterosexual males being cited endlessly throughout both human and mammalian history, there is a plethora of evidence that homosexual arousal and actions do not equal complete homosexual attraction.

                            However, given the human brain's ability to reinterpret the anxiety brought on by socially unacceptable desires or experiences into actions that supress them (Defense Mechanisms, courtesy of Anna and Sigmund Freud), homophobia is statistically likely and supported as a human response to a given desire or experience that has or is actively traumatizing certain individuals. In this way, not all homophobes should be expected to be aroused to homosexual activity as their hatred for it may have been brought about by a determination to maintain social norms or a form of jealousy that is not sexual (per say, wishing to belong to a strong in-group).

                            In conclusion, what the evidence given suggests is that based on the sample of individuals chosen to participate who were both homophobic and non-homophobic, 80% of the homophobic group experienced a sexual response to homosexual activity while only 33% of the non homophobic group also did. What this suggests is that, among those selected for the study, it is statistically likely that 80% of the male self-identified homophobes were suppressing varying degrees homosexual desires that may have contributed to their personal beliefs and according actions against homosexuals. Generalizing this study to the overall public is irrational given the sample size, however further research in greater numbers throughout various cultures around the world are likely to, given the same operational definitions as this experiment, replicate similar results. Since 33% of non-homophobic individuals also experienced sexual arousal and 20% of the homophobic group did not, there is significant evidence to state, again within the bounds of this sample's subjects, that homophobia is not in its entirety a suppression of homosexual desires but is perhaps rather a reaction formed by prevailing social norms or a reflection of an individual's social needs. However, given arousal prevalence in the homophobic sample subjects versus non-homophobic subjects, the statistical data is significant and is thus greatly in support of repressed homosexual desires appearing to be be a particularly significant factor in homophobic reactions.

                            (All statistical evidence courtesy of Adams, Wright & Lohr, 1996. p. 443)
                            --These are entirely my thoughts on the matter and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of those involved in the research--

                            -Zephyr
                            Last edited by Zephyr; 12-20-2006, 05:26 PM.
                            You were once like the newbie who needed a hand from above and TacticalGamer gave you it.

                            You owe the newbie who comes after you that same outstretched hand from above on your honor as a Tactical Gamer.

                            Tactics at TG come from trust and friendship, not meticulous detail and rigid discipline.

                            Everyone should be assumed mature until proven otherwise.

                            We are no clan.
                            We are not a single game.
                            We are mature, intelligent, and cooperative individuals.
                            We are TacticalGamer, a community above and beyond its name.

                            Comment

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