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  • Cancer and Sex

    There is a new vaccine out that prevents certain kinds of cervical cancer. It protects against the HPV virus.

    Some states are wanting to require it for girls at about the age of 12.

    Now there are people against this. Some I understand. It is new and its safety is unknown.

    Then there are the idiotic morons against it.

    The social conservatives that think this will encourage sex among younger people. (HPV is transmitted by sexual contact.)

    The loopy anti-capitalists that, I guess, don't want Merc to make money.

    I just don't get those people. This is a drug that can prevent Cancer! A dream of how many people for how many years? Now that we have it we don't want to use it?

    Morons, the lot of them.
    Iím not racists, I have republican friends. Radio show host.
    - "The essence of tyranny is the denial of complexity". -Jacob Burkhardt
    - "A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds" - Emerson
    - "People should not be afraid of it's government, government should be afraid of it's People." - Line from V for Vendetta
    - If software were as unreliable as economic theory, there wouldn't be a plane made of anything other than paper that could get off the ground. Jim Fawcette
    - "Let me now state what seems to me the decisive objection to any conservatism which deserves to be called such. It is that by its very nature it cannot offer an alternative to the direction in which we are moving." -Friedrich Hayek
    - "Don't waist your time on me your already the voice inside my head." Blink 182 to my wife

  • #2
    Re: Cancer and Sex

    Texas is requiring girls to receive the vaccine in order to attend public schools.

    While not 100% fail proof or effective for every individual, vaccination is a very robust technique with a high rate of success and mild side effects. As critical as I am of the state gov't, I agree with this decision.

    If I had a daughter, I would have her undergo this vaccination.



    TacticalGamer TX LAN/BBQ Veteran

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    • #3
      Re: Cancer and Sex

      If you don't generally object to the practice of mandatory vaccinations, you're an idiot if you do object to this one specifically. 4,000 women die of cervical cancer every year. Even women who contract HPV caused cancer and survive may have difficulties in bearing children in the future. Men can contract the HPV virus and develop cancer as a result as well.

      As the governor of Texas said, "If we developed a vaccine for lung cancer, would these people be against it because it promotes smoking?"
      A policy of freedom for the individual is the only truly progressive policy. -F.A. Hayek

      "$250,000 a year won't get me to Central Park West."

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      • #4
        Re: Cancer and Sex

        Ah Governor Goodhair score a mooey bueno zing. Too true.

        I don't personally like that the pharmas are driving the train but that's a quibble.

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        • #5
          Re: Cancer and Sex

          Originally posted by leejo View Post
          I don't personally like that the pharmas are driving the train but that's a quibble.
          Merc has withdrawn it lobbying efforts according to the story I saw.
          Iím not racists, I have republican friends. Radio show host.
          - "The essence of tyranny is the denial of complexity". -Jacob Burkhardt
          - "A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds" - Emerson
          - "People should not be afraid of it's government, government should be afraid of it's People." - Line from V for Vendetta
          - If software were as unreliable as economic theory, there wouldn't be a plane made of anything other than paper that could get off the ground. Jim Fawcette
          - "Let me now state what seems to me the decisive objection to any conservatism which deserves to be called such. It is that by its very nature it cannot offer an alternative to the direction in which we are moving." -Friedrich Hayek
          - "Don't waist your time on me your already the voice inside my head." Blink 182 to my wife

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          • #6
            Re: Cancer and Sex

            Good.

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            • #7
              Re: Cancer and Sex

              It's about time people are getting on board with this. My only hope is that they make it accessible (and cheaper) everywhere else. As soon as they do, I'm in line.

              The thing that bothers me the most is the explanation those against the vaccine have for their view: that giving this vaccination will promote sex. It's the same thing with sex education- if we talk about it, then kids will want to have sex- but we can talk about drugs and alcohol and other risky behaviors to curb those and we expect that the education will make the abuse stop.
              --------

              Zephyr: Besides Wyzcrak and his godly voice; the kind of voice that you will expect to say "Zephyr, I need you to build an ark at Marine Start, with room for two of every structure so that I may turret spam for 40 days and 40 nights" that is.

              Squeak:Sometimes I'm awed by zibs genius. Then I remember he's Canadian and I feel significantly less threatened.

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              • #8
                Re: Cancer and Sex

                I'm with Governor Perry all the way on this one. I heard him say last week that he wouldn't want to one day see a girl dying with cervical cancer and tell her parents, we could've prevented this with a vaccine. It is dumb that people think it'll promote sexual activity. HPV is not hot on the minds of young teens anyway. They're more worried worried about pregnancy and more famous STDs. Kids just need to be educated that just because they're getting this shot, it doesn't make them invincible. I'm sure the state understands this. Go Texas for leading the way.
                "Common sense is not so common." -Voltaire

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                • #9
                  Re: Cancer and Sex

                  Sexual activity is promoted by everything; having a drug that prevents cervical cancer far outweighs the slight decrease in potential negative consequences. I'm slightly biased, I know; an aunt of mine recently died of cervical cancer. Even if that hadn't happened, though, I know I would still support it.
                  The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt. ~
                  I have a tendency to key out three or four things and then let them battle for supremacy while I key, so there's a lot of backspacing as potential statements are slaughtered and eaten by the victors. ~
                  Feel free to quote me. ~

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                  • #10
                    Re: Cancer and Sex

                    Some people just cant admit to the fact of teenage sex. Its gonna happen no matter what. So why not keep them safe? Teach kids how to use condoms, birth control, and get vaccinated. Whatever your view on abstinence is, it doesnt matter. Teaching safe sex saves lifes or at the very least a lot of discomfort down under.

                    Anyway, does anyone know anything about this vaccine? Can the same kind of vaccine be used for other cancers, or is cervical cancer unique somehow?

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                    • #11
                      Re: Cancer and Sex

                      Originally posted by Santa View Post
                      Anyway, does anyone know anything about this vaccine? Can the same kind of vaccine be used for other cancers, or is cervical cancer unique somehow?
                      This vaccine is effective against human papillomavirus (HPV) strains 6, 11, 16, and 18. These strains have been shown to cause cervical cancer and 16 or 18 anal cancer IIRC. It will not be effective against cancers that have already developed or cancers caused by other viruses.



                      TacticalGamer TX LAN/BBQ Veteran

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                      • #12
                        Re: Cancer and Sex

                        Originally posted by War.mongeR1 View Post
                        It is dumb that people think it'll promote sexual activity. HPV is not hot on the minds of young teens anyway. They're more worried worried about pregnancy and more famous STDs. Kids just need to be educated that just because they're getting this shot, it doesn't make them invincible. I'm sure the state understands this. Go Texas for leading the way.
                        Originally posted by Santa View Post
                        Some people just cant admit to the fact of teenage sex. Its gonna happen no matter what. So why not keep them safe? Teach kids how to use condoms, birth control, and get vaccinated. Whatever your view on abstinence is, it doesnt matter. Teaching safe sex saves lifes or at the very least a lot of discomfort down under.
                        Bingo. The fundies can't get this simple concept through their thick little skulls, though.
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                        • #13
                          Re: Cancer and Sex

                          Do a little research guys.

                          Firstly, the vaccine only prevents 4 strains, of which there are more than 40. Yes, those are primarily the 4 strains that have been shown to cause the largest number of cases of cancer, but that doesnt mean that the others dont.

                          Secondly, if a person is already been infected with HPV, it doesnt have a 100% chance of removing the virus. In reality its only about a 65% chance. While thats better than 0, what do you tell the people for whom it doesnt work after all the hype about the miracle cure that it was supposed to be for them?

                          Third, if HPV has metastized into cervical cancer, the vaccine does NOTHING. Chemotherapy or radical therapy and surgery are the only options.

                          Fourth, most clinics and hospitals charge over 500 dollars for the vaccine, of which, as its been pointed out, is on the books to be mandated to attend public school.

                          Fifth, the advertising campaigns they have on TV for this are a SHAM. Theres a direct quote from one commercial I saw last night about the vaccine that says "the vaccine has been shown to prevent cervical cancer in women." THIS IS A LIE BY OMISSION. Women: you can still get cervical cancer even if you've had the vaccine! HPV isnt the only thing that causes it! This drug was released about 8 months ago and I personally know a young woman who got the shot and then developed cervical cancer less than 3 months later. She was negative for HPV. She simply had a family history. Her mother and maternal grandmother both had cervical cancer. But she was led to believe that the vaccine would keep that from happening.

                          Dont get me wrong here guys, having a vaccine like this is a step in the right direction, but its not the answer. It has good points, sure. But we also dont know any long-term negative ramifications of it. What if it turns out that the vaccine causes an eventual erosion in neuropenephrine producers in the brain and slowly kills you over a period of 20 or so years like some of the early anthrax vaccines? Also, I dont know how many of you grew up less than priveleged, but I know that had my parents not been career Naval Officers, theres no way that they could have afforded to get me well over 1000 dollars worth of vaccinations just to go to school, which would be the case unless we see some kind of free vaccination program for schoolkids (which is highly unlikely considering its a huge cash crop for the pharmaceutical industry).

                          As a health care professional, I stress to everyone I know that there are things in life that you need to take seriously. Disease and infection is a big one.

                          We have a big step here with this vaccine, but people need to know that it isnt a wonder drug. It hasnt had long term tests. It doesnt have complete coverage and its remission rates are low by the standard. The reason its so big is because it's a media fad (pardon the use, but its true. you say over 4000 women a year die of cervical cancer. over 19000 women in the US die of breast cancer and do we have a cure yet?). This doesnt mean that you shouldnt get the shot. By all means, if you're a woman, get the shot (there is no shot for men yet). Take every precaution to protect yourself, it makes my job that much easier years down the line when you might end up in my ICU.

                          Guys, I know I seem to be downplaying this a lot, but I get a lot of people that come into the hospital and think that this amongst other drugs out there are miracle cures. Theyre not. You can still catch the virus even if youve had the vaccination and thats a FACT. I'm at risk of catching any number of life threatening ailments every day on the job and I do my very best to make sure it doesnt happen. I put myself at risk so that other people can get well and live their lives for as long as they can. Most of you are at a significantly lower risk, but that doesnt mean that you're not in danger. Safe sex practices are paramount in this day and age. Just because you had the vaccine doesnt mean you're immune. It might not have worked, or you might catch a strain that it doesnt innoculate against. Be safe and make sure you talk about things like this with your partners.

                          Just learn the truth and make sure that you're making the right decision. Before getting ANY kind of shot/pill/anything, make sure to consult with a physician about side-effects and dont be afraid to ask tough questions like "how was the drug tested" and "how reliable are the results". You have a right to know about things that can potentially help OR harm you.

                          Also, guys, when you're talking about fundamentalists not believing in teenage sex or wanting to outlaw it or whatever, just remember my favorite quote: "Never underestimate the power of human stupidity." Kids will be kids and hormones will be hormones and I'll be damned if anyone is ever going to be able to stop two determined teenagers from doing the horizontal mambo with anything short of wrapping them both in coats of razorwire and proximity-activated explosives (and even then they may find a way if theyre creative enough).

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                          • #14
                            Re: Cancer and Sex

                            stuff like this is why I don't like the pharmas doing the lobbying.

                            Ferris, you say there's no shot for men yet. Do you expect a cervical cancer vaccine for men any time soon or are we basically out of luck? :D

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                            • #15
                              Re: Cancer and Sex

                              Originally posted by Ferris Bueller View Post
                              Fifth, the advertising campaigns they have on TV for this are a SHAM. Theres a direct quote from one commercial I saw last night about the vaccine that says "the vaccine has been shown to prevent cervical cancer in women." THIS IS A LIE BY OMISSION. Women: you can still get cervical cancer even if you've had the vaccine! HPV isnt the only thing that causes it!
                              Good point. All the Gardisil commercials that I've seen have said that it's been shown to help prevent cervical cancer. And I've never heard anyone say it's a cure for cervical cancer. Hell, it doesn't treat cancer, it guards against HPV, which is a leading cause of cervical cancer. I think just about everyone that has been following this topic knows that, though.

                              And the vaccine is available for $12 here in Texas. I don't know where you get that $500 figure... Perhaps other states aren't subsidizing it?

                              The question here in Texas is whether it should be made mandatory for admission to public school, and whether or not the state should be paying for it. I think that the answers are yes, and yes. This is a health issue which has a reasonable and affordable deterrent. This is exactly why we have government, to take care of things that individuals cannot. Large scale health problems fall into that category.

                              Originally posted by xTYBALTx View Post
                              If you don't generally object to the practice of mandatory vaccinations, you're an idiot if you do object to this one specifically.
                              Quoted for truth.

                              Originally posted by leejo View Post
                              Do you expect a cervical cancer vaccine for men any time soon or are we basically out of luck? :D
                              There is no cervical cancer vaccine. We're talking about an HPV vaccine. Men can get HPV.

                              Damn, my funny bone must be broken or something. I need sleep...
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