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SK upset over USA gold win in Gymnastics

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  • SK upset over USA gold win in Gymnastics

    In case you haven't heard, a South Korean athlete lost the gold to an American athlete. Lots of news stories are calling for the American to give up his gold.

    For example

    http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/200....ap/index.html

    However, I thought I would point out a different article that says the American should keep his gold.

    http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/200...gym/index.html

    I thought these points were interesting

    That is not to say Yang would have finished .10 higher at the end of the night, which some are suggesting. Gymnasts don't operate in a vacuum, nor do judges score in a vacuum.
    And this one

    Yes, the videotape of the parallel bars showed the judges erred by assigning a 9.9 start value. But it showed something else, too. In the course of his routine, Yang had four holds on the bar, when the rules allow for a maximum of three. The deduction for that mistake? Two-tenths of a point.

    The judges missed it.
    The mistakes of the judges increased Yang's score by 0.1, not cost him the gold but I don't think we will see much of that being said in the media, especially foreign media.

  • #2
    Re: SK upset over USA gold win in Gymnastics

    Also this

    [quote]Under the rules, protests have to be filed immediately, and the South Koreans waited until after the meet to lodge their complaint. FIG rules also prevent scores from being changed once the meet is over.[quote]

    Too late I'm afraid. They should have complained earlier and then it could have been taken up. There is also this...

    He finished third, 0.049 points behind Hamm, who came back from 12th with two events left for the victory. With the extra 0.100, Yang would have finished first and Hamm second, and Kim Dae-eun of South Korea would have won the bronze instead of silver.
    But even so the 2/10 of a point from the missed 4 hands means that Hamm would still have won. If the judges aren't perfect and can miss points then that's part and parcel of the scoring system and tough titties I'm afraid. What else did the judges miss?

    The only resolution to this would be for the judges to go back through both performances in slow motion, 10 times over, and make sure they get every point and rescore it (as they may have missed other stuff).

    Perhaps it's time to change the scoring system. How angry would you be if the judges missed a point or 2 from your routine. OK so the scoring takes longer but at least they'd get it right. The human eye just isn't fast enough sometimes.
    Jex.

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    • #3
      Re: SK upset over USA gold win in Gymnastics

      "Judging" sports always leads to this. In my simple mind, sports is all about doing stuff that your opponent can't duplicate or stop. I can jump over that stick. I can beat you to that line. I can beat you up or pin you to the mat. My team can score more points than yours. Nothing ambiguous or really debatable as long as the rules are followed.

      When you get some silly person asking themselves "sure that was a nice twirly move, certainly worth a 9.5, but was it twirly enough for a 9.6?" it becomes more like a dog show than a sport.

      Now when will we see Olympic TvT? Imagine the computers the team gets!

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      • #4
        Re: SK upset over USA gold win in Gymnastics

        I'm not sure how open to interpretation the scoring is. There are strict rules as how to perform the events and slowing this down would allow the judges to score more accurately. AFter all we're looking at Olympic athletes here who train extremely hard for these medals. If judges are missing points or adding points erronously, then they should change it. Why do we have to have it open to the human eye? Why not go over it again and score it fairly and squarely?

        They do the same in cricket - leave it to the umpire's eye. Now they have a 3rd umpire who uses a tv. Years and years went by before the finally bugged and allowed TV umpiring (basically showing replays). What is this fictation on tradition anyway? Some traditions are good, but having a tradition of always judging by the eye only came about because they didn't have video playback.
        Jex.

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        • #5
          Re: SK upset over USA gold win in Gymnastics

          Argentina knocked England out of the world cup when Maradona scored by punching the football into the net and the ref and two linesmen didn't see it. The result stood because football is too fast paced to allow video refereeing. When asked about it he claimed it was "the hand of God."
          Wintermute

          Play EVE online. It's like being an accounting addict in space.

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          • #6
            Re: SK upset over USA gold win in Gymnastics

            Originally posted by Wintermute
            Argentina knocked England out of the world cup when Maradona scored by punching the football into the net and the ref and two linesmen didn't see it. The result stood because football is too fast paced to allow video refereeing. When asked about it he claimed it was "the hand of God."
            I remember watching that game on TV. Yikes. What does that tell you.

            But still, something as large as a soccer ball!
            I do what I can.

            cpgf: (n.) Acronym describing a significant other who has not yet acheived full spousal status and is in possession of a cable modem; of note because at YOUR house, you still have dial-up -- and crappy dialup at that.

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            • #7
              Re: SK upset over USA gold win in Gymnastics

              Originally posted by jex
              I'm not sure how open to interpretation the scoring is. There are strict rules as how to perform the events and slowing this down would allow the judges to score more accurately. AFter all we're looking at Olympic athletes here who train extremely hard for these medals. If judges are missing points or adding points erronously, then they should change it. Why do we have to have it open to the human eye? Why not go over it again and score it fairly and squarely?

              They do the same in cricket - leave it to the umpire's eye. Now they have a 3rd umpire who uses a tv. Years and years went by before the finally bugged and allowed TV umpiring (basically showing replays). What is this fictation on tradition anyway? Some traditions are good, but having a tradition of always judging by the eye only came about because they didn't have video playback.
              We have to keep in mind that there are sports that are strictly judged by technical points (softball, fencing, marksmanship, etc...) and there are sports that are strictly judged by a subjective judgement (all those weird dancing "sports": synchro swimming and stuff) and there are sports that combine the two types of scoring (gymnastics, figure skating, boxing, etc...). I think that having a panel of judges is the only practical and the most fair way to handle these things. Besides, I think most individual sports each have an organization that advises the Olympic Committee as to the way a particular sport should be judged.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: SK upset over USA gold win in Gymnastics

                It almost happened again. I turned on the Olympics last night just in time to see a whole stadium booing as Paul Hamm (the American from the controversy) was getting ready for a high-bar routine. I thought they were all booing him, but it turns out that the guy right before him had done some routine and they thought the score given was too low. The booing was so loud and persistant that the judges changed the score and the Russian (who's score was changed) actually had to come out and motion for the crowd to quiet down before Paul Hamm could go. Paul Hamm ended up tying for the gold, and the tiebreaker went to the other guy.

                Also, the South Korean who is trying to get a gold medal out of all this hit his leg on a spin or whatever you call it when they flip and stuff and didn't even come close to placing.
                [volun]

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                • #9
                  Re: SK upset over USA gold win in Gymnastics

                  Originally posted by H-Hour
                  It almost happened again. I turned on the Olympics last night just in time to see a whole stadium booing as Paul Hamm (the American from the controversy) was getting ready for a high-bar routine. I thought they were all booing him, but it turns out that the guy right before him had done some routine and they thought the score given was too low. The booing was so loud and persistant that the judges changed the score and the Russian (who's score was changed) actually had to come out and motion for the crowd to quiet down before Paul Hamm could go. Paul Hamm ended up tying for the gold, and the tiebreaker went to the other guy.

                  Also, the South Korean who is trying to get a gold medal out of all this hit his leg on a spin or whatever you call it when they flip and stuff and didn't even come close to placing.
                  This was such an obvious mistake by the Canadian and Malaysian judges. They changed their scores by 1.0 and 1.5 points respectively....is that an oops, or something reminiscent of the French judges in the figure skating incident two years ago?

                  I agree with Jex to a point, but where do you end it. "well his toe was not quite pointed enough, I could still see the hangnail....deduct .10".
                  New to TG?

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                  • #10
                    Re: SK upset over USA gold win in Gymnastics

                    I'm too addicted to CS, my first thought was what is that Swedish clan doing at the olympics? :p

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