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  • WhiskeySix
    started a topic Bailout alternatives?

    Bailout alternatives?

    Originally posted by AMosely View Post
    The alternative is to do nothing and let the markets free fall
    Was going to reply directly, but I didn't want to muddy Magnum's thread too much more ;)

    Anyway, I don't see why it's a paulsen-plan or nothing situation. I just wanted a place for people to throw links/ideas for alternatives to the gov't buying up 700B "worth" of mortgages. So, have your read/heard/seen any alternatives that sounded solid?

  • Trooper
    replied
    Re: Bailout alternatives?

    Originally posted by Gambit7 View Post
    Welp, it's obvious now that we needed this money in some way/shape/form because we're already seeing the markets dry up regardless and states like California and Florida running out of money. My problem is with how they're giving the money, which is through Wall Street and private firms.
    Well its thru the firms that got us into this mess to begin with. But what ever we dont know whats best for this country our reps do.....

    Leave a comment:


  • Gambit7
    replied
    Re: Bailout alternatives?

    Welp, it's obvious now that we needed this money in some way/shape/form because we're already seeing the markets dry up regardless and states like California and Florida running out of money. My problem is with how they're giving the money, which is through Wall Street and private firms.

    Leave a comment:


  • WhiskeySix
    replied
    Re: Bailout alternatives?

    what's disgusting is the Pols that suddenly saw the light and decided it is a good plan - only after they got their own special interest funding.

    /me gags

    Leave a comment:


  • Greasy Mullet
    replied
    Re: Bailout alternatives?

    Well it passed. I think everyone that voted for it should be impeached and that both Presidential Candidates that have supported this should step down as well.

    This is going to do long term damage to our Republic of which we can not even begin to see and in the short term will only drag out the problems we are currently facing. This bill does not fix a single issue which got us into this situation.

    Leave a comment:


  • Gambit7
    replied
    Re: Bailout alternatives?

    That's right, they just added like a 200 million dollar injection to the bill to bolster the PR rum business... bwahahahh

    This bailout is an f-in joke. grrrrr

    Leave a comment:


  • Trooper
    replied
    Re: Bailout alternatives?

    just pisses me off i dont benefit from the nice tax cuts that went into the new bail out bill....race car track builders and rum producers....wooden arrows for kids....nope i dont fit those categories

    Leave a comment:


  • Morganan
    replied
    Re: Bailout alternatives?

    Originally posted by El_Gringo_Grande View Post
    Buffett suggestion
    That suggestion is no different then you taking my Yugo as collateral on a 200k loan. The car's probably worthless but theoretically you might find some sucker to pay that much for it, so gimmie my money!

    Anyone who thinks that idea is a good one I

    a) Want to do business with you so I can basically steal all your assets then laugh at you openly during bankruptcy hearings.

    b) Want to play cards with you since you have no comprehension of value.

    c) Want you to be quiet when people who aren't looking to rob the American public out of 850B are talking about possible solutions.

    Leave a comment:


  • El_Gringo_Grande
    replied
    Re: Bailout alternatives?

    Originally posted by [tR]Greasy_mullet View Post
    So we bail them out now and if we do not fix the real cause of the problem, then in a few years we will be faced with it all over again but perhaps by then it will be even worse.
    No. This is just wrong.

    Go look at a map of where the repossessions and bad loans are. A state like Oklahoma has many poor people yet we have very few bad loans, relatively speaking. In fact our housing prices are going up.

    The whole Fannie/Freddie is applicable to the entire country. Yet it only happened in relatively isolated areas. Why?

    It was because those markets where being speculated to death. You had those "no proof" loans being handed out like candy at a parade. Around my parts it was difficult to get "stupid" loans. I had to work hard and provide my 401k as collateral to get a VA loan. My previous loan was one of those special FHA no money down loans and it took me months to get it because I had to prove I could pay it off and clear up some college credit problems.

    Certain banks got greedy and stupid and they got stupid because certain financial geniuses where creating these wonderful devices that other idiots bought.

    Leave a comment:


  • Greasy Mullet
    replied
    Re: Bailout alternatives?

    Originally posted by Skylark View Post
    I don't like bailing out idiots. But....

    If I understand it correctly....
    law was passed saying that you HAVE to loan to some people (minorities or whoever) who can't afford the loan.
    you give the loans because you legally have to
    you get screwed because these loans defaulted.

    so SOME companies may be suffering because the government FORCED them to give bad loans? Am I understanding this correctly? (I know it isn't all of the problem).

    If that is true, I don't have TOOOOO much trouble helping out the COMPANIES that were screwed by the laws. In other words, we got you into this, we'll help get you out.

    I think it's funny because we are currently using this whole situation to try to buy a new house. Low interest rates and low new house prices = sweet deal for skylark!
    That is a large part of it but not all of it. This 700 billion does not fix that particular problem at all. So we bail them out now and if we do not fix the real cause of the problem, then in a few years we will be faced with it all over again but perhaps by then it will be even worse.

    Leave a comment:


  • Zebra
    replied
    Re: Bailout alternatives?

    Originally posted by Morganan View Post
    The gov't told fanne mae/freddie mac to give out a a higher percentage of those loans.
    Did it? Or did the government allow them to get into this business. It may be a subtle difference, but I don't think the shareholders of these companies felt like they were being forced into anything. If they felt it was excessively risky, they had ample opportunity to dump their shares and get out. On the contrary, I think they begged (lobbied, bribed, etc.) the government to allow this because they saw a killing to be made. They got what they wanted... for awhile.

    Leave a comment:


  • WhiskeySix
    replied
    Re: Bailout alternatives?

    do we have time for that? setting up (building, hiring for, ect) one mega bank seems like it would take a LONG time... setting up 10-20 would be a nightmare.

    Leave a comment:


  • Gambit7
    replied
    Re: Bailout alternatives?

    [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JPrW3AUWErk[/media]

    Leave a comment:


  • El_Gringo_Grande
    replied
    Re: Bailout alternatives?

    Buffett suggestion

    "One easy way to do part of the program is to say to anybody - hedge fund operators, Wall Street firms, or anybody else - that the Treasury will lend you 80% of the purchase cost of a bunch of distressed assets," he said, explaining the concept of his proposal. The investors benefit from borrowing at lower rates, but Treasury would get first claim on the sale of those assets, which means it would get its loan back plus interest and possibly turn a profit.

    "Now you have someone with 20% skin in the game," he explained. "Believe me, I won't be overpaying if I'm buying with that kind of leverage. And you have someone [the investors] to manage the assets to the extent they need to be managed."

    Leave a comment:


  • Morganan
    replied
    Re: Bailout alternatives?

    Originally posted by Kerostasis View Post
    Erasing greed is a dream of the left. Capitalism does not function by stopping greed, it functions by harnessing the power of greed for the greater good. You allow the greedy to make their money, but set up the course such that the quickest path to making money is by means of producing things. So no, I have no intention of blaming the wealthy. I am not a fan of class warfare. You do not increase production by attacking the producers. We just need to redesign the course, because the government botched it on its last attempt with the CRA and fannie/freddie.

    200% agreed The gov't made mistakes, no doubt there, but so did a lot of other supposedly smart people. The blame game is counter-productive until the problem is fixed. The only issue I really have is that companies were allowed to essentially lie to their equity-holders and their bond-holders and now they want money to makes their lies into truths..

    Leave a comment:

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