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  • Cybersecurity Act of 2009, S.773

    http://hotair.com/archives/2009/04/0...-the-internet/

    When Mother Jones and Jules Crittenden agree, isnít that a sign of the apocalypse? Both take a hard look at the Cybersecurity Act of 2009, S.773 sponsored by Jay Rockefeller (D-WV), Bill Nelson (D-FL), and Olympia Snowe (R-ME). The bill addresses the need to protect vital networks from cyber attack, but it gives a lot of power to the executive branch ó perhaps too much power.
    Sounds a little tin foil hat. Is it legit?

    I keep hearing the Who singing "Won't Be Fooled Again".
    Dude, seriously, WHAT handkerchief?

    snooggums' density principal: "The more dense a population, the more dense a population."

    Iliana: "You're a great friend but if we're ever chased by zombies I'm tripping you."

  • #2
    Re: Cybersecurity Act of 2009, S.773

    Consider the source.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Cybersecurity Act of 2009, S.773

      I thought it interesting that Mother Jones was criticizing what appears to be a liberal-sponsored piece of legislation.

      Bush was roundly attacked for increasing the power of the Executive branch, and now we have legislation threatening to do the same for Obama. "Meet the new boss, same as the old boss."
      Dude, seriously, WHAT handkerchief?

      snooggums' density principal: "The more dense a population, the more dense a population."

      Iliana: "You're a great friend but if we're ever chased by zombies I'm tripping you."

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Cybersecurity Act of 2009, S.773

        This isn't liberal-sponsored legislation. This initiative is derived out of national defense, which, while not immune to politics, tends to be more Washington-based than political-based. America is a military superpower, after all, and its economy is very much leveraged by the government sponsored military-industrial complex that keeps it that way. There is widespread political (not public) support for this among Washington 'insiders.'

        You need to remember that the government (specifically the defense department) created the Internet, because they most certainly remember this. Also recall why the Internet (or, more specifically, packet switched connectionless internetworking) was created - because the traditional telephone system was deemed too vulnerable to failure in the event of a nuclear attack. The Internet evolved out of a need for an asymmetrically redundant communication network. Today, what was originally designed to be independent has evolved into an entirely new set of dependencies - not just in terms of defense, but socio-economic as well. It's not just power plants and electrical grids that are tied into it, a major chunk of the economy is as well.

        I am not at all supportive of this legislation as it is currently proposed - it is far too vague and far too overreaching, but on the other hand I think this is a process that has been ignored for far too long. Cybersecurity presents several legislative problems right now - most especially regarding what powers the President has in the event of a cybersecurity attack. People are asking if the President will shut down the Internet - but what is really at issue here is what if someone else shuts down the Internet? Are we going to expect the government to contain that? Do we expect the government to protect against that, as we do more 'traditional' attacks? Under current law, they don't have much authority to accomplish that in any reasonable amount of time. This is precisely this legislation is designed to address, at least theoretically. My concern is it doesn't seem to be written very well, or well thought out. Where's the transparency on this one, Obama? I'm still searching for material on this and am not having an easy time.

        Another thing to keep in mind is that there are some severe misconceptions about the Internet. While there have been legal cases involving the telephone system with regard to privacy law, these are not always applicable to the Internet, which is a vastly different kind of network. Intellectual property law also has many ambiguities when it comes to Internet transmissions at the points at which data can be intercepted. These grey areas can lead to serious misconceptions on both the public side, the private (ISP) side, and the legislative/regulatory side. No one is truly sure of which rights apply.

        Another legislative area where these issues have bubbled up is the network neutrality matter. This has more to do with commerce than defense, but has encountered many of the same overlaps, ambiguities and misconceptions.

        If you are not familiar with the importance of cybersecurity, go look up Richard Clarke and his work at the NSC under Bush. He may have left in disgust, but the NSC is still carrying the flag. Frontline did a documentary a few years ago called 'Cyberwar' that I still use in one of my classes - it's a good entry point into the realm of cybersecurity - the major players and what is at stake. Clarke is interviewed as part of it.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Cybersecurity Act of 2009, S.773

          Originally posted by AMosely View Post
          You need to remember that the government (specifically the defense department) created the Internet, because they most certainly remember this.
          No, they created ARPAnet. This is akin to saying the wright brothers invented the SR-71. TCP/IP, Ethernet, DNS, and numerous other protocols which make the Internet as a whole possible were developed by private entities. This ignores the numerous routing protocols used to move that data around. No single entity can claim credit for the creation of the Internet.

          Anyways, I've looked around and this source hasn't been verified yet. I'm waiting to hear more on this topic before getting worked up about it. I will say that the emergency powers themselves aren't what worries me. It's that these powers are given without any supervision or ground-work for when they should be used. It's a blank check for the president. Then again, I've also read many bills are framed up with insanity in them and that they are (usually) cut down in committee.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Cybersecurity Act of 2009, S.773

            Originally posted by TheFeniX View Post
            No, they created ARPAnet. This is akin to saying the wright brothers invented the SR-71. TCP/IP, Ethernet, DNS, and numerous other protocols which make the Internet as a whole possible were developed by private entities. This ignores the numerous routing protocols used to move that data around. No single entity can claim credit for the creation of the Internet.
            I see your point, but the Internet grew out of NSFNet, which used to be DARPANet. TCP/IP was developed by Kahn and Cerf in the 70's when they were on the DARPA payroll. Ethernet was developed at Xerox PARC, which funded in large part by ... guess who - DARPA and NASA. Even the intial develpments in long-haul transport like the T-Carrier and SONET that raised the bandwidth ceiling were born out of then federally subsidised telephone monopolies and their research labs.

            You're correct in that DNS and most application-layer protocols like HTTP were independently developed (often at research institutions and universities), but it is very difficult to argue that the Internet would exist today had it not been for government money, most of all from DARPA.

            Broader still, this is a solid lesson in the socialist foundations of a military-industrial economy, which America has undoubtedly been since at least World War II. It blossomed the telephone system (who is still paying out the universal service fund), broadcast television (DTV revolution = spectrum payback for the FCC), the Internet and satellite technology. Private enterprise took these and ran with them (when it was allowed to do so), but it was public money that started the fires. America still spends more than the entire rest of the world combined on defense and military technology. Is this still working for us? People barking about socialism right now fail to grasp some of these historic underpinnings, and think they do so at their own risk.

            The Wright Brothers example is actually great one because it pre-dates the military-industrial complex. Would there have been a Wright Brothers of the Internet? I think so, but it wouldn't have happened nearly as quickly - think of the costs and legal issues of laying transcontinental and undersea cables, for example. Good luck getting public funding for that!

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Cybersecurity Act of 2009, S.773

              The government funded development of the telephone? I hadn't heard about that. I just know that the gov protected AT&T from competition and granted them a monopoly, which effectively shut down most innovation for much of the last century.

              Look for a book called "The Victorian Internet". Order from Amazon.com It describes the development of the telegraph and how it rapidly spread around the world, with a culture that largely mirrored the 20th century early Internet. Yet it was a private operation, largely following the rights of way of the railroads.

              Without the telephone monopoly, I'll bet we would have had something like the Internet a lot earlier, developed by competing private entities.
              Dude, seriously, WHAT handkerchief?

              snooggums' density principal: "The more dense a population, the more dense a population."

              Iliana: "You're a great friend but if we're ever chased by zombies I'm tripping you."

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Cybersecurity Act of 2009, S.773

                Originally posted by AMosely View Post
                but it is very difficult to argue that the Internet would exist today had it not been for government money, most of all from DARPA.
                Replace "government" with "pornography" and I could make the same argument. On it's face though, the Internet is just an extension of a LAN. The minute people started networking computers, the idea of linking them together with other LANs kind of took over.

                People barking about socialism right now fail to grasp some of these historic underpinnings, and think they do so at their own risk.
                Most people don't even understand the concept of socialism outside of a "it's the boogy-man" context. I'm not arguing against Socialism, I just wanted to point out that the government has no inherent claim to the Internet just because they helped it along the way.

                The Wright Brothers example is actually great one because it pre-dates the military-industrial complex. Would there have been a Wright Brothers of the Internet? I think so, but it wouldn't have happened nearly as quickly - think of the costs and legal issues of laying transcontinental and undersea cables, for example. Good luck getting public funding for that!
                Neither the idea nor the implementation of the Internet could ever be traced to an individual or small-group. It would be like trying to determine who thought using words to communicate was a good idea. Working to communicate more efficiently and faster has been a driving goal for humanity since, at least, roman times. The Internet is really just an extension of that goal.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Cybersecurity Act of 2009, S.773

                  We're pretty much splitting hairs here, but the government had a hand in the telegraph system too, to the tune of $30,000 for a line to Baltimore. It was mostly private enterprise from there, but still, government had a hand.

                  It is debatable as to whether or not the telephone system in America would not be what it is today (or in the 1950's) if it weren't for government regulation and sponsorship at key points - specifically with regard to the AT&T monopoly and the universal service fee, which rapidly expanded service to places that would have been deemed to expensive by private enterprise alone.

                  I realize this is a subject of much debate, but I've studied telecommunications regulation pretty carefully so have a good deal of respect for it in the U.S. It worked.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Cybersecurity Act of 2009, S.773

                    What do you think of France's Minitel? Should the American Internet have followed its example instead?

                    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minitel...d_the_Internet
                    Dude, seriously, WHAT handkerchief?

                    snooggums' density principal: "The more dense a population, the more dense a population."

                    Iliana: "You're a great friend but if we're ever chased by zombies I'm tripping you."

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Cybersecurity Act of 2009, S.773

                      Originally posted by ScratchMonkey View Post
                      What do you think of France's Minitel? Should the American Internet have followed its example instead?

                      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minitel...d_the_Internet
                      How does it differ from such things as Delphi, CompuServe and BBS's of the early to mid eighties?
                      Iím not racists, I have republican friends. Radio show host.
                      - "The essence of tyranny is the denial of complexity". -Jacob Burkhardt
                      - "A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds" - Emerson
                      - "People should not be afraid of it's government, government should be afraid of it's People." - Line from V for Vendetta
                      - If software were as unreliable as economic theory, there wouldn't be a plane made of anything other than paper that could get off the ground. Jim Fawcette
                      - "Let me now state what seems to me the decisive objection to any conservatism which deserves to be called such. It is that by its very nature it cannot offer an alternative to the direction in which we are moving." -Friedrich Hayek
                      - "Don't waist your time on me your already the voice inside my head." Blink 182 to my wife

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Cybersecurity Act of 2009, S.773

                        Those were all private (and expensive) services.
                        Dude, seriously, WHAT handkerchief?

                        snooggums' density principal: "The more dense a population, the more dense a population."

                        Iliana: "You're a great friend but if we're ever chased by zombies I'm tripping you."

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Cybersecurity Act of 2009, S.773

                          Originally posted by ScratchMonkey View Post
                          Those were all private (and expensive) services.
                          Even more important, I think, is that they where closed systems. I sounds like users had few abilities to contribute and create their own services. That is so un-networky.
                          Iím not racists, I have republican friends. Radio show host.
                          - "The essence of tyranny is the denial of complexity". -Jacob Burkhardt
                          - "A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds" - Emerson
                          - "People should not be afraid of it's government, government should be afraid of it's People." - Line from V for Vendetta
                          - If software were as unreliable as economic theory, there wouldn't be a plane made of anything other than paper that could get off the ground. Jim Fawcette
                          - "Let me now state what seems to me the decisive objection to any conservatism which deserves to be called such. It is that by its very nature it cannot offer an alternative to the direction in which we are moving." -Friedrich Hayek
                          - "Don't waist your time on me your already the voice inside my head." Blink 182 to my wife

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Cybersecurity Act of 2009, S.773

                            They were the Myspace and Facebook of their day, gated communities that "sheltered" users from the rough and tumble of unmoderated Usenet.

                            There were addons for Compuserve, much like mods for BF2142. I used one called Golden Commpass that provided a way to rapidly log on, download/upload messages from many forums, and get off quick before one's connection charges became outrageous.
                            Dude, seriously, WHAT handkerchief?

                            snooggums' density principal: "The more dense a population, the more dense a population."

                            Iliana: "You're a great friend but if we're ever chased by zombies I'm tripping you."

                            Comment

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