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  • Illegal Immigrant Driver's License

    Not sure if anyone's heard of this. Utah is the only other state that issues driver's licenses to illegals. I... seem to not possess the particular brand of warped logic that created this idea.

    http://www.cattlenetwork.com/top40_C...ntentID=319229

    MADISON, Wis. (AP) ó Wisconsin may soon join Utah as the only states to issue illegal immigrants special cards that allow them to drive but not get other rights that traditional licenses hold.

    The plan was included in Wisconsin's state budget approved by a Democratic-controlled committee on Friday. It is subject to approval by the full Legislature and Gov. Jim Doyle, perhaps as soon as next week.

    Utah is the only state with a two-tiered system like what is being proposed in Wisconsin, according to The American Association of Motor Vehicle Administrators. About 40,000 drivers in Utah have the cards, which were created with that state's program in 2005 as an attempt to end voter fraud among illegal immigrants who were receiving regular licenses.

    Tennessee ended a driver certification program after two years in 2006 after federal investigators found that some testing centers were selling driver's licenses and certificates to out-of-state illegal immigrants.

    Washington, Illinois and New Mexico are the only states that allow illegal immigrants to receive driver's licenses. Maryland used to allow it, but a new ban on such licenses took effect Monday.

    In Hawaii, illegal immigrants can get a state ID, but not a driver's license.

    The Wisconsin law was modeled after the one in Utah, which has proved successful, said Christine Neumann-Ortiz, executive director of Voces de la Frontera, a Milwaukee-based group that advocates for immigrants.

    "It makes total sense," Neumann-Ortiz said Monday. "First and foremost it's really a public safety issue because it will ensure that more people driving are tested, licensed and insured."

    But Republican critics argue issuing the cards will open the door to illegal immigrants voting and obtaining other rights.

    That's nonsense, Neumann-Ortiz said.

    "It's not in the self interest of people who don't have legal status to vote," she said. "If you do that, it's a felony and you can never adjust your status in the future."

    A coalition of about 20 groups, including the Wisconsin State Troopers Association and the police chiefs of Milwaukee and Madison, formed to advocate for the driving cards.

    Allowing immigrants to legally drive would also be a boon to Wisconsin's $20 billion dairy industry, a group that advocates for producers said.

    Dairy farms are having a hard time finding workers and relying more and more on immigrants who must be able to drive, according to a letter of support from the 700-member Dairy Business Association.

    The state estimates that about 60,000 people will apply for the cards. Many of them are immigrants who are trying to obtain legal status but are caught somewhere in the system, Neumann-Ortiz said.

    States like Wisconsin are looking at the issue in light of the federal 2005 REAL ID law that required a person's immigration status to be checked before they are issued a driver's license. Only those drivers who are citizens or have legal status can receive a driver's license.

    Under the new proposal, the driver cards would offer much more limited rights than a license. While they could be used to drive, the cards could not be used as official identification to vote, board an airplane or enter a federal building.

    Police would be barred from checking on someone's immigration status simply because they possess the identification. And insurance companies could not cancel or refuse coverage to someone simply for holding one of the cards.

    Doyle didn't propose the idea even though the Democratic-controlled budget committee approved it. The governor has said he believes it may have merit, but he's not saying whether he would support it.

    Senate Majority Leader Russ Decker, D-Weston, and Assembly Speaker Mike Sheridan, D-Janesville, both said they were reviewing the proposal.

    "I don't think the system that's in place is working, so we've got to do something," Sheridan said.

  • #2
    Re: Illegal Immigrant Driver's License

    This is one of those bizarre solutions that makes it easier to live with a situation that really shouldn't exist in the first place, but since it does exist and we can't seem to figure out how to fix it, living with it seems like the next best option. I am not opposed to this, even though I am opposed to illegal immigration in general.

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    • #3
      Re: Illegal Immigrant Driver's License

      Although my parents came to this country as immigrants from South America, Ecuador they worked very hard and became citizens of the United States. I'm grateful they did and I had the opportunity to be born here. I can understand how the immigrants want to escape their country for a better life but the reality is that US is having a very hard time with dealing with a overwhelming amount of immigrants. This plan seems very confusing to me and I feel something other than what's being done now need to be done.
      |TG-8th| LATINA


      [conduct][medic]


      :icon14: :icon1: :icon_bigg

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      • #4
        Re: Illegal Immigrant Driver's License

        Originally posted by Kerostasis View Post
        This is one of those bizarre solutions that makes it easier to live with a situation that really shouldn't exist in the first place, but since it does exist and we can't seem to figure out how to fix it, living with it seems like the next best option. I am not opposed to this, even though I am opposed to illegal immigration in general.
        I'm in the same boat: In principal, I find this is a bad idea because it's giving legitimacy to people who are breaking the law. In practice, I guess a duct-tape solution is better than no solution at all.

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        • #5
          Re: Illegal Immigrant Driver's License

          How many illegals are actually going to go down to a government building and say. Hi, this is my address, my picture and I'm breaking the law.

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          • #6
            Re: Illegal Immigrant Driver's License

            I think the real problem is that licenses provide rights, benefits and legitimacy beyond their intended purpose.

            A drivers license should be proof that you have shown you posses the requirements to drive on public streets. Absolutely nothing more. It doesn't prove who you are, what you are allowed to do (outside driving).
            Iím not racists, I have republican friends. Radio show host.
            - "The essence of tyranny is the denial of complexity". -Jacob Burkhardt
            - "A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds" - Emerson
            - "People should not be afraid of it's government, government should be afraid of it's People." - Line from V for Vendetta
            - If software were as unreliable as economic theory, there wouldn't be a plane made of anything other than paper that could get off the ground. Jim Fawcette
            - "Let me now state what seems to me the decisive objection to any conservatism which deserves to be called such. It is that by its very nature it cannot offer an alternative to the direction in which we are moving." -Friedrich Hayek
            - "Don't waist your time on me your already the voice inside my head." Blink 182 to my wife

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            • #7
              Re: Illegal Immigrant Driver's License

              Originally posted by Hambergler View Post
              How many illegals are actually going to go down to a government building and say. Hi, this is my address, my picture and I'm breaking the law.
              Those wanting to be Deported.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Illegal Immigrant Driver's License

                Originally posted by El_Gringo_Grande View Post
                I think the real problem is that licenses provide rights, benefits and legitimacy beyond their intended purpose.

                A drivers license should be proof that you have shown you posses the requirements to drive on public streets. Absolutely nothing more. It doesn't prove who you are, what you are allowed to do (outside driving).
                Thats the intention behind this special non-citizens license. Since the normal driver's license winds up being used for all sorts of authentication purposes besides driving, the citizen-optional license is intended to fill exactly the gap you describe -- it proves you can drive on public streets, and nothing more.

                Or at least, that's what they say in the promotional materials. I couldn't say if that's how it will actually be used in practice. Perhaps a look at Utah's program would be educational there?

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                • #9
                  Re: Illegal Immigrant Driver's License

                  Can they make it any easier for them to get rights, healthcare, and all sorts of benefits that they don't deserve?
                  |TG-X|Turkish

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                  • #10
                    Re: Illegal Immigrant Driver's License

                    My desire is for all Americans to have to go through the same process as immigrants seeking citizenship before they get "rights" like free health care and schooling. And stand in the same multi-year-long lines. (I guarantee those lines would get a lot shorter and the process a lot more streamlined if locals had to suffer them!)

                    If locally-born people had to go through the same process, then this kind of system would make a lot of sense, so that you could function (eg. drive, board a plane, pass bank checks) while awaiting admission to status as a full citizen.
                    Dude, seriously, WHAT handkerchief?

                    snooggums' density principal: "The more dense a population, the more dense a population."

                    Iliana: "You're a great friend but if we're ever chased by zombies I'm tripping you."

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                    • #11
                      Re: Illegal Immigrant Driver's License

                      ILLEGAL Immigrants. No discussion needed, so why is it a topic of debate? Deport 'em.
                      |TG-Irr| JWG

                      Battlefield 2 - Project Reality

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                      • #12
                        Re: Illegal Immigrant Driver's License

                        Originally posted by ScratchMonkey View Post
                        My desire is for all Americans to have to go through the same process as immigrants seeking citizenship before they get "rights" like free health care and schooling. And stand in the same multi-year-long lines. (I guarantee those lines would get a lot shorter and the process a lot more streamlined if locals had to suffer them!)

                        If locally-born people had to go through the same process, then this kind of system would make a lot of sense, so that you could function (eg. drive, board a plane, pass bank checks) while awaiting admission to status as a full citizen.
                        Wouldn't make a whole lot of sense to do that to people born here. Sounds like an anti-nationalism argument. I think more civics needs to be mandatory in public schools. But there's no reason to make natural born citizens go through the same hoops as immigrants.
                        "No bastard ever won a war by dying for his country.
                        He won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country."

                        - Attributed to General George Patton, Jr.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Illegal Immigrant Driver's License

                          Originally posted by Gillespie View Post
                          Police would be barred from checking on someone's immigration status simply because they possess the identification. And insurance companies could not cancel or refuse coverage to someone simply for holding one of the cards.
                          I find this part particularly funny, which is why I suppose its bold in the original. Sure, the cops may not beable to check immigration status, but hey, if its a SPECIAL drivers license just for illegals, I dont think it will take much for a cop to figure it out.

                          As for the insurance, sure, the company may not be able to turn them down based on their illegal immigrant drivers license, but the conversation will probably come to an abrupt halt when the sales agent says "may I please have your social security number?"

                          Rubbish.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Illegal Immigrant Driver's License

                            Originally posted by JWG View Post
                            ILLEGAL Immigrants. No discussion needed, so why is it a topic of debate? Deport 'em.
                            Probably easier and better for the economy to just swear them in as citizens. God knows most of my school couldn't have hoped to pass the citizenry test.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Illegal Immigrant Driver's License

                              Originally posted by Evo<^|SiNz|^> View Post
                              Wouldn't make a whole lot of sense to do that to people born here. Sounds like an anti-nationalism argument. I think more civics needs to be mandatory in public schools. But there's no reason to make natural born citizens go through the same hoops as immigrants.
                              Why does it make sense to let people have rights just because of the patch of ground they were born on? Why is someone who happened to be born in Tennessee, but has no awareness of or interest in national policy and politics inherently able to vote, when someone who does know these things, and cares about them, and actively pursues knowledge regarding political and social matters so that they can make informed decisions not able to vote?

                              It's just cheap voodoo. It's magic. Born on this rock, you can make good decisions, born on that rock, you can't.

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