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Punish majority for minority stupidity !

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  • Punish majority for minority stupidity !

    The rate of alcohol permitted by law in Quebec is .08 per 100 milliliter of blood. Our government will now reduce the limit at a rate of .05 for so-called reducing the number of automobile accidents caused by alcohol. The fact is that all of the people and the society paying for the stupidity of a small group of individuals. Is not this something common? In my opinion this is purely useless since those who cause accidents while intoxicated are generally well above the current limit of .08

    How does this work where you live ? Do you indicated that the majority pay for the misconduct of a small group of idiot? Do you have any example of this principle you want to share ?

  • #2
    Re: Punish majority for minority stupidity !

    This is how laws are made:

    One person with political connections has something happens, they press for legislation and it happens because friends scratch each other's backs.
    Something happens to a child that is bad, someone suggests a ridiculous law on their behalf and it passes because politicians are afraid of looking like they don't care about children.
    Someone has something rare happen that is really graphic, let's say 9/11 terrorist attacks. Instead of taking the appropriate action to stop it from happening again (strengthening the cockpit, not negotiating with terrorists on the plane) they instead make rules that punish regular people (the gate security theater) because it looks like they are doing something, no one votes against it because they don't want to look bad if something happens in the future.

    In all cases most people are punished by having rights removed or being punished when they don't actually affect anyone else. This is the worst part about a government that has to answer to the people, having to enact stupid stuff because people can't judge the appropriate level of response to something.
    |TG-6th|Snooggums

    Just because everyone does something does not mean that it is right to do.

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    • #3
      Re: Punish majority for minority stupidity !

      I have to drive the speed limit of 55 (or whatever it is) because of all the poor drivers on the road who cannot safely drive at speeds above that.

      Practically everything in this world seems reduced to the lowest common denominator.

      3) Support game play in a near-simulation environment. Where the focus of play would not be solely on doing what it takes to win, but doing so utilizing real-world combat strategy and tactics rather than leveraging exploits provided to players by the design of the game engine.

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      • #4
        Re: Punish majority for minority stupidity !

        Originally posted by Tempus View Post
        Practically everything in this world seems reduced to the lowest common denominator.
        Is there a alternative when it comes to the use of public resources?
        Iím not racists, I have republican friends. Radio show host.
        - "The essence of tyranny is the denial of complexity". -Jacob Burkhardt
        - "A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds" - Emerson
        - "People should not be afraid of it's government, government should be afraid of it's People." - Line from V for Vendetta
        - If software were as unreliable as economic theory, there wouldn't be a plane made of anything other than paper that could get off the ground. Jim Fawcette
        - "Let me now state what seems to me the decisive objection to any conservatism which deserves to be called such. It is that by its very nature it cannot offer an alternative to the direction in which we are moving." -Friedrich Hayek
        - "Don't waist your time on me your already the voice inside my head." Blink 182 to my wife

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        • #5
          Re: Punish majority for minority stupidity !

          What's the average alcohol limit in the US ? Here they're about to force us to wear a football equipment to take a walk outside ... !

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          • #6
            Re: Punish majority for minority stupidity !

            Blood Alcohol Calculator
            http://www.bloodalcoholcalculator.org/

            In the US BAL is 0.08 . That means a 200lb male can have 4.7 beers in an hours time and be just under the limit. That's a lot of beers IMO. .05 is more reasonable. I have no sympathy for drunk drivers, they should have their licenses immediately confiscated.

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            • #7
              Re: Punish majority for minority stupidity !

              This is how laws are made:

              One person with political connections has something happens, they press for legislation and it happens because friends scratch each other's backs.
              Something happens to a child that is bad, someone suggests a ridiculous law on their behalf and it passes because politicians are afraid of looking like they don't care about children.
              Someone has something rare happen that is really graphic, let's say 9/11 terrorist attacks. Instead of taking the appropriate action to stop it from happening again (strengthening the cockpit, not negotiating with terrorists on the plane) they instead make rules that punish regular people (the gate security theater) because it looks like they are doing something, no one votes against it because they don't want to look bad if something happens in the future.

              In all cases most people are punished by having rights removed or being punished when they don't actually affect anyone else. This is the worst part about a government that has to answer to the people, having to enact stupid stuff because people can't judge the appropriate level of response to something.
              This is pretty accurate. Now multiply this effect thousands of times, and we've all gradually lost our liberties under the tangled mess of laws designed to protect us from everything. While I do agree drunk driving is a problem, I also understand there is only so much the law can do to protect us, and often the solution becomes worse than the original problem. Why not just dictate to car makers that they have to install breathalyzers in all their new cars, and all citizens are required to use them before driving? Why not just ban bars from letting people drink any alcohol at all and drive? Why not make alcohol illegal because it causes so many problems?

              Using the coercion of law will always have unintended consequences, so it needs to be used sparingly. This doesn't seem to be the mentality that is prominent with career lawmakers in western countries, whereas government becomes a power upon itself creating law after law for the "benefit" of the majority.
              Last edited by aeroripper; 02-17-2010, 08:35 PM.
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              • #8
                Re: Punish majority for minority stupidity !

                Originally posted by Hambergler View Post
                Blood Alcohol Calculator
                http://www.bloodalcoholcalculator.org/

                In the US BAL is 0.08 . That means a 200lb male can have 4.7 beers in an hours time and be just under the limit. That's a lot of beers IMO. .05 is more reasonable. I have no sympathy for drunk drivers, they should have their licenses immediately confiscated.
                .08 is ridiculously low as it is, and 4 or 5 beers in an hour is really not very much. A DUI is serious business, and can really have a negative impact on one's life. Meanwhile, you have morons talking on the phone, or texting, or eating, or putting on makeup, or whatever else, who drive way worse than a .08 driver, but if they get pulled over, it's just a call to the Ticket Clinic and all is ok.

                3) Support game play in a near-simulation environment. Where the focus of play would not be solely on doing what it takes to win, but doing so utilizing real-world combat strategy and tactics rather than leveraging exploits provided to players by the design of the game engine.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Punish majority for minority stupidity !

                  Originally posted by Hambergler View Post
                  I tried a 200lbs 4 beers in 15 min and it gave me .077 .. I'm not sure what kind of beer you got there but no one here would absorbs 4 beers 5.% Alcohol in 15 minutes and not break the limit. I'm pretty sure of that one. So.. I'm not sure of that calculator.. and just for example .05 of alohol make it hard for a women to have a diner and drink a cupple of wine or two.

                  My point is more that most of the alcohol recidivist or driver that cause accident are usualy way over the limit of .08. And we got here 4 times more drivers licence in circulation and 4 times more cars than 30 years ago, and 4 times less accidents cause by alcohol... so what's wrong ? I agree with Snoog about the politics process and I feel like this is what's going on here ... They would be better to stop infantile the whole people and make em responsible. Utopia ?

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                  • #10
                    Re: Punish majority for minority stupidity !

                    Sweet, I can have 2 rum and cokes, a white russian, and a beer within 3 hours and still be under the limit! *goes to bar*
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                    • #11
                      Re: Punish majority for minority stupidity !

                      I also don't agree with phone, or texting, or eating, or putting on makeup, or whatever else. There should be steep fines for that too as is in Europe. Driving should be taken much more seriously. Since the whole idea behind drinking is to impair oneself, there should be an even steeper penalty since the drinker is causing themselves to be impaired and are fully aware of their intention. Many times the person who is impaired is too impaired to evaluate the extent of their impermanent.

                      No one has a right to have a few drinks for dinner if it's going to put me or my family in danger. I think any amount of alcohol is too much, but I will settle for .05 or .08 as a compromise. If you want to drink, let someone else drive or do it at home.

                      The fact that there are less drunk driving fatalities in the last 30 years means the laws are doing their job and are being enforced. We also have safer cars and education/awareness. What the statistics don't show is all the people who are paralyzed or in chronic pain or go bankrupt from hospital bills or have some other irreversible plight because of drunk driving. Bottom line is if you drink and drive your a scumbag.

                      After driving in Germany a few months ago. I fully subscribe to their driving system. No speed limit most of the time. BAL .04, passing only on the left, and you will be heavily fined for any kind of distraction. The roads there are 10x smoother and better built. It is just much more serious business over there.

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                      • #12
                        Re: Punish majority for minority stupidity !

                        Originally posted by Tempus View Post
                        .08 is ridiculously low as it is, and 4 or 5 beers in an hour is really not very much. A DUI is serious business, and can really have a negative impact on one's life. Meanwhile, you have morons talking on the phone, or texting, or eating, or putting on makeup, or whatever else, who drive way worse than a .08 driver, but if they get pulled over, it's just a call to the Ticket Clinic and all is ok.
                        Minors (ie 20 year olds and younger...) are held in most, if not all, states to a .02 limit for DUI so one beer is pretty much it.

                        Hambergler: As far as having a couple drinks with dinner, having food with the alcohol and the time it takes to eat means they BAC is likely well under .08 and not going to have an effect on driving. I think that instead of focusing on BAC (which does not have a consistent effect on reaction time from person to person) they should test reaction times and punish drivers under the influence of over the counter medications and distracted drivers just as harshly.

                        Focusing on the alcohol instead of the effect on driving is a problem. Sure, they got in a wreck because they weren't paying attention but at least they weren't drinking is how the law is applied.
                        |TG-6th|Snooggums

                        Just because everyone does something does not mean that it is right to do.

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                        • #13
                          Re: Punish majority for minority stupidity !

                          A petite women can take a couple drinks over a 30 minute dinner and be over the limit.

                          If there is no law for BAC. I will be an unwilling participant in a game with every idiot that thinks he's OK to drive. No thanks. Reaction time tests for everything except for alcohol is a very good idea, but will never happen. The majority of the voteing public are old and many of them would fail. BTW I want everyone to have to take some kind of driving test every three years starting at age 70. About half of all accidents are alcohol related. I wonder how many of the remaining 50% were caused by other mind altering substances; legal or prescribed. And how many are caused by deteriorated driving skills because of aging.

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                          • #14
                            Re: Punish majority for minority stupidity !

                            Originally posted by snooggums View Post
                            Focusing on the alcohol instead of the effect on driving is a problem.
                            That's exactly the problem. The law is used as a morality-enforcement bludgeon instead of a way to get a particular safety result. The same thing happens with illegal drugs. Outlaw the undesirable effect, not the questionable cause.
                            Dude, seriously, WHAT handkerchief?

                            snooggums' density principal: "The more dense a population, the more dense a population."

                            Iliana: "You're a great friend but if we're ever chased by zombies I'm tripping you."

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                            • #15
                              Re: Punish majority for minority stupidity !

                              What about a bigger sanction for those who go over .08 ? I really don't think those who cause accident are between .05 and .08...

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