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  • CCP Screwing things up...

    http://myeve.eve-online.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=533

    Basically:
    -10% EM on Armour.
    -10% EXP on Shields.

    Meant to boost Amarr... just nerfs tanking for everyone.

    If you use therm, exp and kin active tank mods on armour you end up with a huge EM hole (not to mention the near 0% you have on shields and equal resistances for everyone on structure).

    Instead of changing the balance of active hardeners / EANM they've decided to make EANM omni tanking the only real option for t1 ships. Lets not even get into t2 ships where EM will be lowest or 2nd lowest on all tanks except minmatar.

    Talk about a screw up. Some people actually believe its a true Amarr boost... its far from it, if anything you'll see more OMNI tanking t1 ships and/or people having to fit a EM specific (probably rig) and end up with higher EM res than before.

    Get that Zulupark guy out of there CCP, he's already screwed up Dictors needlessly, now he's completely screwing tanking for every ship in the game because "we shot each other on the test server".

    p.s. already looking at POTBS before CCP thought about screwing with every ship balance in EVE with these changes, if they go through with it then i'll probably go try POTBS.

  • #2
    Re: CCP Screwing things up...

    Tell me how POTBS is, might join you. They need to stop screwing up the game and just make it work better, what a novel idea.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: CCP Screwing things up...

      I haven't tried it yet to busy, i'm hoping theres some trial thing will appear eventually, its to soon since Beta testing I think for them to of thought about trials. I'm not paying for the game and then subscription when I might not even like. Looks good though, first patch is comming soon so still early days into balancing... its sony though that makes me shiver.

      CCP - Complicating balancing since 2003.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: CCP Screwing things up...

        the changes don't mess with too much. and what they do fix is something for amarr. The idea is that EM becomes a realistic dmg type again. If you say that fitting 3 actives apart from an EM gives you a big EM hole, well ****, that almost sounds like an idea and logical. Sorry but the fact most ships have such a large amount of EM resistance to armour was unbalanced.
        As for the explosive change to shields, well his logic on the reasoning is right, don't see what the big difference will be though apart from a few %

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        • #5
          Re: CCP Screwing things up...

          sweet so my caldari ships might as well stay in the hanger cause that nice EM hole just grew
          that sounds like a good idea trooper.
          -Vulcan

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: CCP Screwing things up...

            Originally posted by Ithaca View Post
            the changes don't mess with too much. and what they do fix is something for amarr. The idea is that EM becomes a realistic dmg type again. If you say that fitting 3 actives apart from an EM gives you a big EM hole, well ****, that almost sounds like an idea and logical. Sorry but the fact most ships have such a large amount of EM resistance to armour was unbalanced.
            As for the explosive change to shields, well his logic on the reasoning is right, don't see what the big difference will be though apart from a few %
            They don't fix amarr, they just nerf tanking generally. The change does NOTHING but screw with things needlessely. The problems are with:
            strength of armour tanking vs shield tanking (due to tackling ect mids).
            strength of EANM vs active hards.

            The problem is not the starting em resistance, fitting 3 actives on a t1 ship already makes EM lowest except on minmatar. This change will make it so low you'll probably have to fit a EM res rig if you don't want <60% em resistance which is around what EXP is on a 2xEANM+DC tank. Hence won't help amarr at all because EM with be higher than before after a res rig, while that rig slot that might of been used for HP/Rep amount that is missing reduces the performance of therm/kin/exp. This is ONLY for t1 ships.

            T2 tanks usually have 1 hole to fill (minny has 2 with exp and kin), now with EM being reduced from 60% to 50% after filling say a EXP hole on gallente or thermal on Amarr that EM hole is quite far behind the other 3 resistances. Where previously people would of fit EANM in that situation they will have to fit EM or accept that large hole. Remember that at high % resistance levels that t2 ship get 1% can be a big difference.

            Simply put:
            - Active tanking nerfed. With 3 actives on a none minny T1 ship EM is lower than EXP with 2x EANM+DC.
            - I seriously doubt people will undock with <10% EM in shield and <60% EM in armour (both lowest of each HP level).
            - T2 ships have a second resistance hole that will need to be filled.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: CCP Screwing things up...

              I'm almost SURE the entire CCP balance staff has been replaced by those manatees from the family guy south park episodes. Shuffling random idea balls around in a giant tank.

              That makes, from my count, the 5 most recent devblogs being utter s**t. Please god let POTBS get a trial or make WAR really really good.
              _____________________



              ---

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: CCP Screwing things up...

                I don't see it being as bad as you all say but I would have preferred they perhaps boost damage-specific armour mods instead.

                This is almot a boost for T2 minmatar amour tanks since they laugh at EM damage anyways. They aren't really affected but everyone else is. You could also say it helps amarr shield tankers but there aren't too many of those.

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                • #9
                  Re: CCP Screwing things up...

                  I can't believe they are nerfing Caldari again.
                  sigpic

                  In the end we are all dead men. Sadly we can not chose how, but ... we can decide how we meet that end in order that we are remembered as men.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: CCP Screwing things up...

                    Originally posted by Miezu View Post
                    I can't believe they are nerfing Caldari again.
                    They're nerfing everyones tank and boosting everyones damage, not just one race.


                    Originally posted by RandomGuy View Post
                    I don't see it being as bad as you all say but I would have preferred they perhaps boost damage-specific armour mods instead.

                    This is almot a boost for T2 minmatar amour tanks since they laugh at EM damage anyways. They aren't really affected but everyone else is. You could also say it helps amarr shield tankers but there aren't too many of those.
                    How is it a boost to minny armour tanks? They gain nothing, if anything they get the biggest effective reduction as well as there two big holes on armour being exposed even more with EXP and KIN on shields being so low now (and the minny t2 shield tankers not really having slots to fill both).

                    This change is going down the "lets make everything the same to be balanced" hence why I hate it to much, it doesn't even solve any problems, it does change every ship in the game when they didn't need changing.

                    How can they possibly go from "EM resistance on t1 ships using EANMs are to high" to "lets nerf all EM resistances on everything", then do the same for EXP on shields... its just madness changing the game completely and doesn't even address the problem yet potentially creates more.


                    ------------------------

                    My changes would of been to actually fix the broken Amarr ships (maller/omen/proph/apoc). Any other ships are minor balancing like any ship in EVE (typhoons hp balance for example), Abaddon/Geddon/Harb/Abso don't need any fixing, what they need is armour v shield tanking balance addressed and EANM v active addressing hence :
                    - Reduce Active Hardeners to 26 cpu. Hence 3x actives = 78 cpu. 2x EANM = 72 cpu. So with the saved slot on EANM unless you use a 6 cpu or less mod (DC is 17 to 30) your using more CPU than actives, where currently 3x actives use more than 2x EANM + DC.
                    - Make the specific passive resistance different to make them useful, such as giving them an addition bonus to armour hp, something small like 2%-5% but makes them different to actives. Reduce there CPU to below actives.
                    - Make DC less "must fit" by reducing structure resistance bonus by 10%. To not make this a tanking nerf add the lost effective structure back onto the raw values of structure HP. Hence only reducing the value of a DC yet they are still a great mod for getting most EHP out of a ship.

                    My changes = more diversity, fixing real problems without completely changing the balance of everything through 3 module catagories being changed (plus the ship fixes for the ships that desperately need them). They don't however address shield v armour tanking but CCP's changes doesn't address that either.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: CCP Screwing things up...

                      Preston your now yourself suggesting changes that don't need to be done. Nothing is wrong with Actives or DCU's or the way people are fitting them. The main problem this fix is addressing is the fact the high base EM armor resistance on ships coupled with the compensation skills on EANS has made EM pretty much always the highest resist on a typically omni tanked ship. I really cant see the point of your argument about fitting 3 active hardeners that then leaves you with a big EM hole. This just addresses the whole point of the problem, you shouldn't be able to completely tank a ship with just 3 actives anyway, apart from the T2 ships.

                      Also this is the first a few changes aimed at Amarr and still only on the test server. It is somewhat disheartening that EvE has suddenly become a whine fest whenever a change is announced. But when you look at it, the core game changes very little. We still shoot each other, we still die, we still play the game.

                      Adapt or die.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: CCP Screwing things up...

                        [QUOTE=Preston85;901343
                        p.s. already looking at POTBS before CCP thought about screwing with every ship balance in EVE with these changes, if they go through with it then i'll probably go try POTBS.[/QUOTE]

                        I've got POTBS arriving today, But I won't get much time with it until next week.. maybe see you there.
                        sigpic


                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: CCP Screwing things up...

                          Originally posted by Ithaca View Post
                          Preston your now yourself suggesting changes that don't need to be done. Nothing is wrong with Actives or DCU's or the way people are fitting them. The main problem this fix is addressing is the fact the high base EM armor resistance on ships coupled with the compensation skills on EANS has made EM pretty much always the highest resist on a typically omni tanked ship. I really cant see the point of your argument about fitting 3 active hardeners that then leaves you with a big EM hole. This just addresses the whole point of the problem, you shouldn't be able to completely tank a ship with just 3 actives anyway, apart from the T2 ships.

                          Also this is the first a few changes aimed at Amarr and still only on the test server. It is somewhat disheartening that EvE has suddenly become a whine fest whenever a change is announced. But when you look at it, the core game changes very little. We still shoot each other, we still die, we still play the game.

                          Adapt or die.
                          arghhhhh you just said the problem, EM resistance when using EANMs+comp skills. so why are you agreeing with nerfing active hardener tanking to which doesn't need nerfing. if EM resistance is a problem, make fitting active hardenres better than EANM, EM will then be lowest or 2nd lowest (t1 minmatar). This also creates a second hole for all t2 ships, and if you fill that hole EM will actually become HIGHER than before. Previously with EM at 60% it would be close to the bottom when gallente fit a active exp and amarr fit a therm hard, now it will be clearly bottom so where people will of used a EANM to raise everything many will fit a EM res rig/hard.

                          Why should I be able to tank a ship completely with 3 active hardeners? They take more fitting, use cap and don't add to structure like 2x EANM + DC. Theres a reason 2xEANM+DC is more popular than 3x actives. Actives typically arn't used unless your fitting 4 or 5 resistance mods, and thats only due to EANM suffering to hard from stacking penalty at that point.

                          This doesn't help amarr, it nerfs tank of everyone and boosts damage of everyone. Its a pointless nerf to tanking, its completely shifting the balance of all ships and the fittable setups, and achieves nothing.

                          Originally posted by P8riot View Post
                          I've got POTBS arriving today, But I won't get much time with it until next week.. maybe see you there.
                          It will be a lot longer than that till I can play it, might of died (its sony, so probably) or be thriving. Hopefully the balance and bugs will be sorted by then, i've heard good things though.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: CCP Screwing things up...

                            Hi guys - long time no see!

                            I've found that a lot of changes that CCP have brought in lately have left me a bit non-plussed. Things just seem to get more complicated/specialized so that you need a spreadsheet to work out what's best or just get out-and-out nerfed so that they're useless. I do like the new graphics and the ships - I can sit for ages in a station, just spin them around while chatting to some corpies and its fantastic! That's not really why I subscribe though.

                            Suppose what I'm getting at is that it seems to have been a long time since anything has been introduced that makes me want to get out in space and try something new. I've had to adapt how I fit ships and how I use certain tactics but going through with the extra effort to do something that I've always done anyway has stopped being interesting and I find myself playing less and less.

                            The resistances and hardeners thing is a good example. People will change their setups, a different hole will exist, the damage that people will use will change and things will go on as before. I know Amarr players that can kick me aroundno problem with the way things are right now. Sure it takes a few more skill points but making broken or unusable ships and modules effective is the way to fix this and make a difference to new players immediately. Making changes like this one that affects virtually everyone in the game, might boost Amarr if everyone follows CCP's plan and there are no unintended consequences (good luck with that) doesn't really do it for me.

                            I'd be interested to know what you guys think because I know that I'm not the most active or skilled player in the game and I might have missed some of the more recent stuff.

                            At the risk of completely de-railing the thread I've got POTBS too. It's massive fun at the moment because Eve players are completely owning it :D I'm not sure if it will keep me interested for the same amount of time as Eve but it is definitely worth trying if you have the time.
                            --
                            Eve Online: Ashimos/Tenekes
                            Steam: Ashimos

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: CCP Screwing things up...

                              Ya the new stuff in eve is fun but the way battles are fought now have completely changed. It seems to me that their are ships that out perform others with little you can actually do to counter them. I remember back when I first started playing in 2005 and I dont remember it being that way. I could be remember it wrong though. They need to look at the game mechanics a little more and fix holes in it before adding new ships and new mods imo. I honestly still love the game because of it's openness. I will continue to play eve till something else comes along that has the same type of world.

                              My wife plays WOW and I have tried it but the world was boring to me. I was going to potbs till they introduced avatar combat. I dont think potbs would hold my interest. It isn't that I like spaceships it is the world that makes eve great.

                              Darkfall hopefully will deliver this plus more once it is released and refined.

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