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  • [AAR] Moments of incredible tactical depth in PS2.

    Here are some of the best moments I have experienced so far in PS2.


    What makes these great moments for me, is best described by the well known quote by Hannibal from the A-team: "I love it when a plan comes together". These moments are when the mind wins over pure force (usually = zerg). Some of you may have been with me while these things happened. I invite you to share your experience of the events described, or to add your own moments where you really enjoyed the tactical aspects of the game. I had to use a written form. If my pc could handle it, I would have video for you now. So this thread is only for the more patient :p.




    1. Assault to re-retake The Palisades


      We took Palisades back from the TR after foraging in their side of the map for a bit. We iirc being an near full platoon. When we just about had it capped, suddenly the resistance swelled... and swelled... until the whole flag became a bloody onslaught between our platoon, our blue guys, and their huge surge. They pushed us off the flag ever so slowly in a battle lasting dozens of minutes as we defended with our spawn on the west side. At the end we found ourselves without spawn and had to go back to the drawing-board at crossroads tower.

      We came back in from the east. And again iirc we were wiped off after some minutes as our sundy died. I went back to get my Sunderer, put it under the bridge east of the flag (great place to hind a Sundy/ tip). As I saw our infantry which -must have been about 60ppl strong including blue guys- trying to get into the structures of Palisades getting massacred over and over again. I thought: this isn't going to work.

      So instead of just abandoning the fight against this even or larger defensive force. I figured to try something else first: I would try to ask my platoon to perform a coordinated tactic. I know laughable no?

      So I address them in the following words (rephrased). Guys. Stop running into the buildings. It is not working. We're not going to get this flag this way. Let's change it up. No-one go into the buildings please. Split left and right, surround the base where there is high ground, and kill them. Just stay there. Don't go in, don't cap, don't do anything but get surrounding position, and kill, until we get the base or until the enemy get's tired of being raped (very exhausting I hear)

      Now it is a bit hard to describe what happened next, because I got very busy getting a 10 to 15 inf kill-streak on, shortly after the infantry started to execute the plan. I watched it on the map a bit. A friendly circle had formed around the whole base in a very few minutes and it was looking good. The enemy was still doing the same. But the fight did not consist any longer of two bulls charging at each other straight on over and over. No, now it was a bull fighting a net.


      Ten to 15 minutes after changing the plan, the NC took Palisades, and shamed whoever that blob was defending it. Afterwards I realized that me getting a once-in-a-month kill-streak at 20 fps ;). Might NOT have been pure coincidence. I told my squad about my streak and asked if they had done well. As I hoped, indeed several members of our Platoon reported killing similar amounts of enemies in the same span of a few minutes.

      To me this was the most excitement I can find in a game. The underdog winning trough the mind, the huge amount of people working together to execute a large maneuver. The role of morale in the battle (=psychological tactics). Our morale and teamwork got a huuuuge boost after this fight, while the enemy that we outplayed, and then outkilled, was surely frustrated at the loss of the flag, the loss of all those lives, and most of all the loss of their dignity :D.


      This was the first time in this game that I realized... yeah the Zerg is very powerful, it is the most prevalent and easy tactic. But by no means is it the most powerful tactic. This made me indulge in the occasional experimentation leading to some other superb gaming moments.





    2. Defense of the canyon east of our tech lab (north of Split-peak Pass; forgot sector-name)


      This is a sector that has only one control point, the spawn is above a very narrow canyon connecting two important bigger sectors. The only control point is down in the canyon, 50m from the road. We had been fighting infantry on and off for this flag. We had about two full squads (+-14ppl).

      Suddenly I get reports about armor coming in. i go take a look and see a platoon or more worth of armor rolling our way, outnumbering us by a factor of two it seemed. I felt in the "....ooh crap..." reactions of the Platoon that they were ready to give up. We had been having more than enough trouble with just infantry attacking us. And tanks sitting back shelling us.

      I hadn't lost hope though, as I figured that blob of armor did what I would never make my Platoon do in that canyon; drive into while the enemy has high ground over you. Still the sheer amount of tanks was so intimidating. Disguising my own doubts, I said to the squad: Don't worry guys don't give up. They drove their tanks into the choke, it's a big mistake and they are going to pay for it. Just keep fighting, get lots of rockets and take em out one at a time.

      Busy minutes ensued with dying and re-spawning. After five minutes. Things went quiet. The whole blob slaughtered in under 5 minutes. A Massacre. And a freakin' great proof that tactics do matter in this game, a lot. A killing-an-army-twice-as-big-as-yours-lot. I just couldn't believe my common sense hunch was right, as I was standing looking down into the smokey canyon with nothing but wreckage. *pats platoon on back*





    3. Blitzkrieg tactics on the big mountain in the center.


      On Amerish we (little less than 1 squad) rolled armor from The Ascent on the big mountain in the center southward to the next sector (river's crossing?) to assist in the defense of that point. Just before getting to it we run into heaps and heaps of infantry sitting behind the lower edge of the road. They finish us off easy.

      A minute later we realized that the group that killed us, had been fighting to get to our destination flag for ages; locked into a head to head on the bridge leading to the point. We had flanked this platoon that was in this multiple platoon battle, and they had had no trouble at all taking us out even though they were locked in this battle. We realized this group was some serious business. We tried a galaxy bombing run, a liberator run. We got some kills, but of course died rather very quickly.

      After that I said well let's go back to armor. While I was developing the strategy, turns out we only got three tanks together. Slightly disappointed at my squad, I decide to proceed anyway with what I announced to my squad was a blitzkrieg tactic.

      The reasoning was as follows. That huge group is sitting below the ridge fighting that other platoon on the bridge. You cannot win with armor against heavy assaults that have a ridge on you, with nothing behind them for your shells to hit. You can especially not win if the enemy outnumbers you by a very very large margin.


      So here's the plan:

      We charge trough the front-line full-speed. I go first (expecting to die immediately of course). I will break right after crossing the ridge, second tank breaks left, third splits off too. So th eidea is to punch trough the front-line, get over the ridge, and get behind them where we CAN shoot them. So me and the first rate squad-members set off.


      The execution:

      The infantry spots us some 70 m from the ridge. I take considerable damage, not expecting to make it over the ridge. But I do. I fly over it, jumping several meters. Then in the first glimpse of the area behind the ridge I get an aneurism. Me and the other two tanks who have followed the plan to perfection, are finding us in a football-field-sized area literally crawling with infantry, and a sunderer or two. I estimate about a hundred TR were in that football field. I think they noticed us.

      I commence firing and maneuvering to the best of my ability, shooting at a sunderer surrounded closely by some 20 infantry. I think every shell I fired (mostly at the Sundy), must have hit at least 5 to 10 people. I have no idea how many I killed, or how many my squad killed. We certainly did an incredible amount of damage for 3 people attacking a hundred ;). From the reports I gathered, the other tanks with me -who executed the plan to perfection- were able to inflict considerably more damage than I was. I was only able to fire about ten shots, still way more then ever hoped for.

      It was all over in a minute. We were all dead. But I was shrieking with victorious joy. We immediately tried to get the squad back in place to do the same again, but now with full squad strength. 5 minutes later when we arrive with the full squad in armor, the fight is gone, the enemy has abandoned the attack on the bridge.


      We'll never know what exactly broke the stalemate on that bridge. But there is a damned good change we had more than a little to do with it. Just three vehicles, and a plan. That, my friends is sweet sweet victory...........



    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Plz add your experience if you were there for any of these, or post your own.

    I made the thread to share the fun experience, but also to entice people that are on the fence about this game. There is no tactical experience like it in any other game (in a player versus player environment) this year, and probably for a few years to come. There really is none.
    Last edited by BigGaayAl; 11-06-2012, 04:23 AM.

  • #2
    Re: Moments of incredible tactical depth in PS2.

    Awesome write ups. Tactical Gamer can do something great with PS2.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Moments of incredible tactical depth in PS2.

      Booh why can I not edit anymore. I made screenshots to visualize my stories. I've edited my original post in the quote. If possible, moderators, could you replace my first post with this edit that includes pictures?



      Edited quote:

      Originally posted by BigGaayAl View Post
      Here are some of the best moments I have experienced so far in PS2.


      What makes these great moments for me, is best described by the well known quote by Hannibal from the A-team: "I love it when a plan comes together". These moments are when the mind wins over pure force (usually = zerg). Some of you may have been with me while these things happened. I invite you to share your experience of the events described, or to add your own moments where you really enjoyed the tactical aspects of the game. I had to use a written form. If my pc could handle it, I would have video for you now. So this thread is only for the more patient :p.





      1. Assault to re-retake The Palisades


        We took Palisades back from the TR after foraging in their side of the map for a bit. We iirc being an near full platoon. When we just about had it capped, suddenly the resistance swelled... and swelled... until the whole flag became a bloody onslaught between our platoon, our blue guys, and their huge surge. They pushed us off the flag ever so slowly in a battle lasting dozens of minutes as we defended with our spawn on the west side. At the end we found ourselves without spawn and had to go back to the drawing-board at crossroads tower.

        We came back in from the east. And again iirc we were wiped off after some minutes as our sundy died. I went back to get my Sunderer, put it under the bridge east of the flag (great place to hind a Sundy/ tip). As I saw our infantry which -must have been about 60ppl strong including blue guys- trying to get into the structures of Palisades getting massacred over and over again. I thought: this isn't going to work.

        So instead of just abandoning the fight against this even or larger defensive force. I figured to try something else first: I would try to ask my platoon to perform a coordinated tactic. I know laughable no?

        So I address them in the following words (rephrased). Guys. Stop running into the buildings. It is not working. We're not going to get this flag this way. Let's change it up. No-one go into the buildings please. Split left and right, surround the base where there is high ground, and kill them. Just stay there. Don't go in, don't cap, don't do anything but get surrounding position, and kill, until we get the base or until the enemy get's tired of being raped (very exhausting I hear)

        Now it is a bit hard to describe what happened next, because I got very busy getting a 10 to 15 inf kill-streak on, shortly after the infantry started to execute the plan. I watched it on the map a bit. A friendly circle had formed around the whole base in a very few minutes and it was looking good. The enemy was still doing the same. But the fight did not consist any longer of two bulls charging at each other straight on over and over. No, now it was a bull fighting a net.


        Ten to 15 minutes after changing the plan, the NC took Palisades, and shamed whoever that blob was defending it. Afterwards I realized that me getting a once-in-a-month kill-streak at 20 fps ;). Might NOT have been pure coincidence. I told my squad about my streak and asked if they had done well. As I hoped, indeed several members of our Platoon reported killing similar amounts of enemies in the same span of a few minutes.

        To me this was the most excitement I can find in a game. The underdog winning trough the mind, the huge amount of people working together to execute a large maneuver. The role of morale in the battle (=psychological tactics). Our morale and teamwork got a huuuuge boost after this fight, while the enemy that we outplayed, and then outkilled, was surely frustrated at the loss of the flag, the loss of all those lives, and most of all the loss of their dignity :D.


        This was the first time in this game that I realized... yeah the Zerg is very powerful, it is the most prevalent and easy tactic. But by no means is it the most powerful tactic. This made me indulge in the occasional experimentation leading to some other superb gaming moments.







      2. Defense of the canyon east of our tech lab (north of Split-peak Pass; forgot sector-name)


        This is a sector that has only one control point, the spawn is above a very narrow canyon connecting two important bigger sectors. The only control point is down in the canyon, 50m from the road. We had been fighting infantry on and off for this flag. We had about two full squads (+-14ppl).

        Suddenly I get reports about armor coming in. i go take a look and see a platoon or more worth of armor rolling our way, outnumbering us by a factor of two it seemed. I felt in the "....ooh crap..." reactions of the Platoon that they were ready to give up. We had been having more than enough trouble with just infantry attacking us. And tanks sitting back shelling us.

        I hadn't lost hope though, as I figured that blob of armor did what I would never make my Platoon do in that canyon; drive into while the enemy has high ground over you. Still the sheer amount of tanks was so intimidating. Disguising my own doubts, I said to the squad: Don't worry guys don't give up. They drove their tanks into the choke, it's a big mistake and they are going to pay for it. Just keep fighting, get lots of rockets and take em out one at a time.

        Busy minutes ensued with dying and re-spawning. After five minutes. Things went quiet. The whole blob slaughtered in under 5 minutes. A Massacre. And a freakin' great proof that tactics do matter in this game, a lot. A killing-an-army-twice-as-big-as-yours-lot. I just couldn't believe my common sense hunch was right, as I was standing looking down into the smokey canyon with nothing but wreckage. *pats platoon on back*







      3. Blitzkrieg tactics on the big mountain in the center.


        On Amerish we (little less than 1 squad) rolled armor from The Ascent on the big mountain in the center southward to the next sector (river's crossing?) to assist in the defense of that point. Just before getting to it we run into heaps and heaps of infantry sitting behind the lower edge of the road. They finish us off easy.

        A minute later we realized that the group that killed us, had been fighting to get to our destination flag for ages; locked into a head to head on the bridge leading to the point. We had flanked this platoon that was in this multiple platoon battle, and they had had no trouble at all taking us out even though they were locked in this battle. We realized this group was some serious business. We tried a galaxy bombing run, a liberator run. We got some kills, but of course died rather very quickly.

        After that I said well let's go back to armor. While I was developing the strategy, turns out we only got three tanks together. Slightly disappointed at my squad, I decide to proceed anyway with what I announced to my squad was a blitzkrieg tactic.

        The reasoning was as follows. That huge group is sitting below the ridge fighting that other platoon on the bridge. You cannot win with armor against heavy assaults that have a ridge on you, with nothing behind them for your shells to hit. You can especially not win if the enemy outnumbers you by a very very large margin.


        So here's the plan:

        We charge trough the front-line full-speed. I go first (expecting to die immediately of course). I will break right after crossing the ridge, second tank breaks left, third splits off too. So th eidea is to punch trough the front-line, get over the ridge, and get behind them where we CAN shoot them. So me and the first rate squad-members set off.


        The execution:

        The infantry spots us some 70 m from the ridge. I take considerable damage, not expecting to make it over the ridge. But I do. I fly over it, jumping several meters. Then in the first glimpse of the area behind the ridge I get an aneurism. Me and the other two tanks who have followed the plan to perfection, are finding us in a football-field-sized area literally crawling with infantry, and a sunderer or two. I estimate about a hundred TR were in that football field. I think they noticed us.

        I commence firing and maneuvering to the best of my ability, shooting at a sunderer surrounded closely by some 20 infantry. I think every shell I fired (mostly at the Sundy), must have hit at least 5 to 10 people. I have no idea how many I killed, or how many my squad killed. We certainly did an incredible amount of damage for 3 people attacking a hundred ;). From the reports I gathered, the other tanks with me -who executed the plan to perfection- were able to inflict considerably more damage than I was. I was only able to fire about ten shots, still way more then ever hoped for.

        It was all over in a minute. We were all dead. But I was shrieking with victorious joy. We immediately tried to get the squad back in place to do the same again, but now with full squad strength. 5 minutes later when we arrive with the full squad in armor, the fight is gone, the enemy has abandoned the attack on the bridge.

        We'll never know what exactly broke the stalemate on that bridge. But there is a damned good change we had more than a little to do with it. Just three vehicles, and a plan. That, my friends is sweet sweet victory...........









      -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

      Plz add your experience if you were there for any of these, or post your own.

      I made the thread to share the fun experience, but also to entice people that are on the fence about this game. There is no tactical experience like it in any other game (in a player versus player environment) this year, and probably for a few years to come. There really is none.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Moments of incredible tactical depth in PS2.

        Awesome ARRs!

        Great use of images as well.

        The nice thing about PS2 is that it has far more tactical complexity and potential than did the Battlefield series.

        There is much more to this game than just a clash of Zerg forces.

        I have also found that the actions of a few, and sometimes even one, can turn the tide of a battle.
        sigpic

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Moments of incredible tactical depth in PS2.

          Exactly!

          For a while I was lead astray thinking that all this game is about is who has the biggest zerg group.

          That is the decisive factor most of the time, and especially when no tactics are used (random blob army). These groups are so powerful, but as a collective, they are as dumb as a school of fish. They are very predictable. They never stay on a sector for more then five minutes, they always ALWAYS move to attack a next point. I learnt this from running such platoons. It is immensely difficult to keep them from attacking all the time, and if you don't, you will have many deserters.


          There is another thing I want to touch upon: Perfect Scalability This is an idea I learnt from The Wickens. He would always be on about his idea that all tactics are perfectly the same, perfectly scalable from the level of two soldiers engaging an enemy, to 10 or 20 (context here: PR bf2). At first I didn't agree with this idea. Then gradually over theorycrafting with him, I came to see the idea had some value.

          But now... Having run full a full platoon, seeing how battles develop on even much larger scales than in BF2... It has become abundantly clear to me that Wickens is right, that there absolutely no difference tactically between running a 6 man squad and a 48 man platoon. Hear this, people who are afraid to SL in this game, but have done so many times in other games. You don't need to learn anything new except how the UI works.

          This Idea of perfect scalability, I thought can be also called, the fractal nature of tactics.

          In a fractal, however much you zoom in or out, similar patterns (although not exactly the same) arise. Even within one battle. Where the main battle may be team A trying to flank team B, this flanking force (Af) of A can then run into a flanking force (Bf) of B. When these meet, the same scenario repeats in a nested smaller scale level. The exact same patter repeats though. (Af) will split of units to flank, and so will (Bf) probably. Then you have (Aff) and (Bff) (flanking˛ :p). They meet, and again the same process repeats, until you end up with at the atomic level; the smallest possible unit of combat. And in a way even in a one on one fight the same mechanics repeat. Just think of when you engage a guy in a window on the first floor, you go in the house. He goes out the window to chase you, you go out the window to chase him, etc etc.



          /Theorycrafting :D


          @ Emale. Did you notice since the server wipe that Auraxis has gone missing! As soon as you return from your self-imposed exile, I hope can can mount a big platoon to organize a search party on behalf of our Mother Goddess Incarnate.
          Last edited by BigGaayAl; 11-07-2012, 12:56 AM.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Moments of incredible tactical depth in PS2.

            I was there for Split-peak pass and the tank charge, it was awesome.

            I most remember the stalemate at the bridge.

            The first time we came down the road and ran into a ton of infantry fighting at the bridge. I was sitting in the gunners seat of BGA's Sunderer and was just stunned by how many there were. I jumped into the mortar seat and started firing at the ridge line. The main issue was the drop off on the back of the ridge line was to much and I couldn't put any effective fire down on the TR's position. I registered hits from the mortar for the troops coming up to reinforce the ridge line, but couldn't clear the embankment and we where overwhelmed but the amount of HA firing at us from that cover.


            Then we go for an air strike. 2 Libs fly into the fight one at a time to try and clear the roadway. But the shear amount of enemy aircraft and ground fire make short work of us. Then Al pulls a Galaxy and we make one more run at the ridge. An ungodly amount of fire meets us as we fly over the bridge, we are talking some serious heavy fire here. I think we barely made it to the hairpin in the road before we were blown up, but here's the fun part. I decide to bail at the last moment to do some minor damage before I'm sent back to the spawn tubes ( I was in the number 1 gunner position with the AA gun, so I wasn't contributing much to the attack). Alas I was to slow and died in the fiery blast that consumed the Galaxy, but I glitched out and was able to fall with the flaming carcass of our and what I saw made me laugh with joy. As the flaming hulk hit the ground it wiped out a platoon worth of TR troops. I believe we did more damage in death the we inflicted in life, oh the irony...


            Al now calls for tanks and a blitz style attack on the dug in infantry position of the TR. I'm thinking now that he's going to run a line breaker and force his way in behind them and disrupt their attack. Al lays out what he want's done and how we are going to achieve total victory with the 3 tanks we could muster. We line up with Al in the lead slot, I'm running in the second position and (I forget who was running the third tank) in the third slot and move out. BGA says he will break right when he clears the ridge, I figure I'll go left and the other tank will take the middle, but as luck would have it a target of opportunity presented itself to us at the long bridge just before the hairpin. Seems the TR had decided to try and place another Sundy on the hill at the bridge. I stop my tank and level my gun and open fire. The Sunderer either runs off or is destroyed by the withering fire brought to bare on it's exposed posterior and we clear a threat that could have caused us problems later.


            Now Al is yelling at us to form back up and stop dicking around and get this party started. During the engagement our positions get shuffled some and I'm now in the third slot following AL across the bridge to our certain destruction and subsequent respawn. I watch as BGA makes it to the ridge and drops over the edge to the right and then I see our other tanker take the left hand route and drop over. I shot for the middle and train my gun low to allow me to fire a round as I tilt over the edge. I slam into the ridge at full speed and go airborne for a short distance and land in a slide turning sideways as I move down the hill. That's when I see the TR Sunderer about 70m away from me and I now have my primary target in my sights. I fire into the packed masses of troops around the spawn point as I maneuver to get to the rear armor and try to deliver a killing blow. I get another solid hit into the rear armor of the Sunderer, but things are get way hot now and I know I have only moments to live. I need to make this count and I need to make it happen now! I fire again , and as luck would have it, my shell impacts a fresh spawned TR trooper and does little to now damage to the Sundy. I move closer to the Sunderer, surprised that I'm still alive at this point, and unleash another round which again hits all the troopers around but does little damage to the primary target. I now see the Sunderer getting reps from some engineers who have for some unknown reason moved to the rear of the machine to repair, right in my gun sights no less. I figure in the hectic fighting I must be invisible for a brief time, as Al and the other tanker are taking the brunt of the enemy fire and drawing attention away from me. I fire again and hit the Sunderer killing the engineers but failing to deliver the killing blow we need so badly. My invisibility shield has worn off, my shield is depleted, I have a sliver of armor left and I'm waiting on a reload. Things are very tense at this point, they know another shell will destroy their spawn, I know another rocket will destroy my tank. It's a race to the finish, will I get the shoot off and connect or will I eat a rocket and know the bitterness of absolute failure. I hear my round seat in the barrel and depress the trigger and proceed to explode in a fiery conflagration of twisted metal and cooked off rounds.


            Al is saying lets do it again and I couldn't agree more with him. We have more troops and more power to bring to bear on the enemy. I respawn and run down the stiars to try and get another tank. I can't get a Vanguard, but I can pull a Lightening and do so. I figure if I can't pull a heavy hitter I can pull an annoyance and run around like a chicken with it's head cut off and draw fire in hopes someone else will get the Sundy. We roll out, I'm running around in my Lightening like a hyper child off his meds on the night before Christmas with a sugar high. It's not a pretty sight, to say the least. I know the TR will be better prepared for this next assault, will be expecting it. But, we are coming in even heavier then before and even though the odds aren't in our favor, we know we can pull this off. We start across the bridge and I start charging to the fore, I want to be the 1st over the edge. I want to get a tactical view of the are and possibly relay some info before I get set back to the spawn room. I hit the hairpin at full speed and find... Nothing... No troops, no tanks, no spawn. Just a vast expanse of rocky hillside devoid of any enemy. Al thinks for a few seconds and sets on another course. Time to go pick a fight...

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Moments of incredible tactical depth in PS2.

              Good stuff Al.

              M u s t i n s t a l l P S 2 !!
              sigpic
              |TG-1st|Grunt
              ARMA Admin (retired)
              Pathfinder-Spartan 5

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Moments of incredible tactical depth in PS2.

                Originally posted by Grunt 70 View Post
                Good stuff Al.

                M u s t i n s t a l l P S 2 !!
                Please do! I wa unfortunate to have to mis John C's foray into PS2, never got to hear his thoughts about it.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Moments of incredible tactical depth in PS2.

                  I was there for the pallisades, i was one of two tanks, it was epic. Moving around the edge of camp with one other tank i soon run out of shells and figure hey, I can be a road block, I park my tank on the road exiting the camp on the far side of pur point of attack so they cant slip out, pop in the gunners seat and start scaring infantry as they run across the street, that was certainly a blast
                  |TG-Irr| di1lweed1212

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Moments of incredible tactical depth in PS2.

                    I would like to draw everyone's attention to by far the most interesting and important part of this thread....


                    Originally posted by BigGaayAl View Post

                    For a while I was lead astray....
                    Then it dawned on him.....

                    Originally posted by BigGaayAl View Post
                    It has become abundantly clear to me that Wickens is right
                    ......and don't you forget it mate!


                    That is all:row__536:


                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Moments of incredible tactical depth in PS2.

                      ...









                      :row__734:



                      ...

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