Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Platoon Organization - TeamSpeak?

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Platoon Organization - TeamSpeak?

    I think we need to figure out a better way to organize our platoon operations rather than "discussing" the options in platoon chat.

    I'd like to suggest that we use TeamSpeak to help organize our Platoon operations and to help cut down on the in-game cross-squad chatter.

    Over the past few nights we spread out the TG regulars and had 3 and 4 squads running at the same time, I opened up my squads to the public. There were some TG regulars in each squad with a bunch of non-TG players. It's a great way to expose those players to TG and our play style and a great way to build exposure for TG within Planetside 2. Now there will always been some players that go off and do their own thing and eventually they'll need to be removed but the vast majority of players will follow their squad - even if they don't have direct verbal communication.

    Another issue I've noticed... When we have 36 or 48 players we need to use that resource or we'll loose it. Not everyone has 3+ hours to play Planetside 2 and not everyone wants to wait 60 minutes outside a Bio Lab so the enemy get's bored and leaves the continent. We don't need to continually throw ourselves into the grind but if we don't keep the action up folks won't care to run with us and it's becoming clear that in a game of this scale we need those players to affect the outcome.
    |TG-88th| DaddyOfThree

  • #2
    Re: Platoon Organization - TeamSpeak?

    Originally, the VOIP system was supposed to run where the squad uses squad voip only to relay orders down, and squad leaders use Platoon chat to work between themselves. The idea of utilizing TS was thrown around, but then if we just used TS, that would alienate the non-TG that don't/wont use TS. If you say squadleaders should all be in the "command channel" that still won't solve the problem since they will have crossflow/radio chatter with ingame voip vs. TS. The hardest part really comes down to being disciplined in these efforts. If you have random pubbies just utilizing whatever they want, we come off as hardnosed elitists, but then again, if they don't want to play ball, find another team.

    We have the SOP's, yet I haven't seen anyone actually use them. I still find if I'm platoon leading its easier to get a verbal response from a squad/person I just ordered to a specific objective than anything else. What else did you have in mind with TS? I know there are whisper functions between people that can be set up, and I have no knowledge on doing it, but could be one option.


    These Things We Do... That Other's May Live

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Platoon Organization - TeamSpeak?

      There's also the fact that some of our leaders prefer to be in the NC Coalition's Teamspeak channel in order to facilitate higher-level coordination.

      That's really where it's at. Most of the time that we successfully capture a continent, it's because we have multiple outfits working together. For an outfit that prides itself on teamwork, I'd sure like to see more TG leaders giving it a try.

      I believe you can be in two teamspeak channels at the same time, but I believe it involves macros and I am not sure how it is done.
      Teamwork and Tactics are OP


      Strait /strāt/ (Noun) A narrow passage of water connecting two seas or two large areas of water: "the Northumberland Strait".

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Platoon Organization - TeamSpeak?

        Originally posted by Strait Raider View Post
        There's also the fact that some of our leaders prefer to be in the NC Coalition's Teamspeak channel in order to facilitate higher-level coordination.

        That's really where it's at. Most of the time that we successfully capture a continent, it's because we have multiple outfits working together. For an outfit that prides itself on teamwork, I'd sure like to see more TG leaders giving it a try.

        I believe you can be in two teamspeak channels at the same time, but I believe it involves macros and I am not sure how it is done.
        You can connect to multiple TeamSpeak servers simultaneously without any macros or anything special.

        As for the closing statement, I understand the value of the coalition; but I think some of the concern is with getting OUR people communicating effectively. Personally; I would put that as a more important first step vs. communication with the outside. I'm not saying that Coalition comms are not important, but when you throw the "For an outfit that prides itself on teamwork" bit in there it comes across as relatively aggressive....
        Diplomacy is the art of saying "good doggie" while looking for a bigger stick.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Platoon Organization - TeamSpeak?

          Setting it up to where you can be in both channels at once is fairly simple. Set up both the TG and Coalition servers as "bookmarks", connect to one, then right click on the other and choose the option to open it in another tab. Then bind a key to switch between tabs, and you're golden! You will then be able to stay in the TG channel as normal, but you can still hear the coalition channel, and once you do you can just press that button and you will be transmitting in the Coalition.
          May you be covered in the dust of your Rabbi.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Platoon Organization - TeamSpeak?

            Originally posted by Serjikal View Post
            ...squad leaders use Platoon chat to work between themselves.
            My complaint with the current system is that in-game Platoon chat VOIP is not really "between themselves". As a squad leader, I'd like the ability to have a discussion with my Platoon leader and other SL's that didn't have 30 other soldiers listening in. How can the Command team have a healthy discussion (insert "disagreement" here if you need to), come to closure on our next steps, and then execute those plans in full alignment, without 30-40 folks listening in? I respect all of our Platoon and Squad Leaders too much to have a "disagreement" on tactics or options on an open channel. I will always follow (and rarely question) direct orders. But there are times when I'd like to quickly give the PL my thoughts in private. Right now I do that via a text-whisper in game.

            I'd also like the Platoon Leader to be able to call ME on the carpet if my Squad is doing something he disagrees with. Then let me have the chance (and time) to fix it. If the PL simply gives the gripe/command/instruction on Platoon Chat...I don't get that chance to interface with my squad and fix the problem.

            I'm looking for a "permission to speak freely" button. Really need a Command Channel button.

            Snarlin


            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Platoon Organization - TeamSpeak?

              Originally posted by Snarlin View Post
              My complaint with the current system is that in-game Platoon chat VOIP is not really "between themselves". As a squad leader, I'd like the ability to have a discussion with my Platoon leader and other SL's that didn't have 30 other soldiers listening in. How can the Command team have a healthy discussion (insert "disagreement" here if you need to), come to closure on our next steps, and then execute those plans in full alignment, without 30-40 folks listening in? I respect all of our Platoon and Squad Leaders too much to have a "disagreement" on tactics or options on an open channel. I will always follow (and rarely question) direct orders. But there are times when I'd like to quickly give the PL my thoughts in private. Right now I do that via a text-whisper in game.

              I'd also like the Platoon Leader to be able to call ME on the carpet if my Squad is doing something he disagrees with. Then let me have the chance (and time) to fix it. If the PL simply gives the gripe/command/instruction on Platoon Chat...I don't get that chance to interface with my squad and fix the problem.

              I'm looking for a "permission to speak freely" button. Really need a Command Channel button.

              Snarlin
              and what you described is where the use of the TS command channel (all SL's in the TS channel) would come into play, since thats outside the game, and then those SL's can then relay orders via ingame VOIP


              These Things We Do... That Other's May Live

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Platoon Organization - TeamSpeak?

                SL channel in TS. It worked for years in PR.
                Viking

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Platoon Organization - TeamSpeak?

                  Its a simple bloody concept.

                  Reserve platoon chat for trans-squad communications. In game voip is easy to use and its REALLY EASY to mute platoon chat.

                  Why use Platoon Chat? That nice little pop-up that shows up saying PLATOON tells everyone in the platoon to hold unnecessary comms as the squad leaders are talking. Teamspeak is just another button that I don't need to use. If we want to accommodate Multiple Platoon efforts we need to understand that we can't just have one open 'LEADERS COMMS' in teamspeak.

                  I will never hassle with a TS 'Command Channel'. If I'm a platoon leader I will give orders through platoon.

                  Also. Discussing orders is a waste of time. If you are running 48 people, even if only 10% are TG, one TG guy needs to be considered the CO and he should have enough resolve to make a decision and stick to it. If he wants to discuss his options with the SLs you can use one to three minutes for prep time. If you don't want to bug the 'non-outfit players' ask to see if you can reserve outfit chat for discussion. Otherwise tell people to follow the SOP of Platoon Chat is for higher ups and mute at your own discretion.

                  Communications
                  Use in-game when possible, as this helps with non TG players.
                  Some pointers on how to decide if you should use the VoiP. With 12 people per squad, and multiple squads running together, this is crucial to ensure good comms.
                  Does everyone in the platoon have to hear it? No -> use squadchat
                  Is the person you are talking to close to you? Yes -> use proxy
                  Private conversation? Yes -> Get a seperate channel on TS
                  Nobody needs to hear it? Yes -> If it is not relevant, please don't use comms - have courtesy and respect for the other players who have to hear it.
                  Debating orders, back-seat Sling? Yes -> Don't. Instead create an AAR and use that for positive feedback and idea generation. Spurring debate is what increases every bodies ability.
                  Need to interrupt someone for a crucial message? -> Say "Hold Comms". That is the universal sign for everyone in that channel to be quiet and listen.
                  ============

                  Originally posted by SoloDaNINJA View Post
                  Setting it up to where you can be in both channels at once is fairly simple. Set up both the TG and Coalition servers as "bookmarks", connect to one, then right click on the other and choose the option to open it in another tab. Then bind a key to switch between tabs, and you're golden! You will then be able to stay in the TG channel as normal, but you can still hear the coalition channel, and once you do you can just press that button and you will be transmitting in the Coalition.
                  What happens if TG is running multiple Platoons? How do you communicate on a inter-platoon manner and an trans-platoon manner and still cooperate on the Coalition level?

                  I don't see why everyone thinks they need to hear Platoon Chat. There is almost never any real use for platoon chat other than giving direct orders as a Platoon Leader. There are added layers of complexity because we all assume we all have the right to use/listen to platoon chat which then gets us in the pickle to never us platoon chat because its worthless and spammy.

                  ==============

                  Originally posted by apophis
                  As for the closing statement, I understand the value of the coalition; but I think some of the concern is with getting OUR people communicating effectively. Personally; I would put that as a more important first step vs. communication with the outside. I'm not saying that Coalition comms are not important, but when you throw the "For an outfit that prides itself on teamwork" bit in there it comes across as relatively aggressive....
                  Certainly we need to exercise better comms procedure however I have no idea how that at all effects how one of our members communicates with the Coalition. The Coalition is simply the 'Team'. Platoon chat/Squad Chat/whatever Chat is so inherently isolated and minor when trying to operate on a continental scale that Strait Raider is simply suggesting that if you want to be part of something that is collectively working towards one common goal (IE teamwork) you should be organizing with the Coalition. Its like going onto a PR server and seeing a bunch of people working together but not in TG and saying 'pffft, we don't need to work with them to win'.

                  Again I think you are just misunderstanding what he meant.
                  Last edited by Ytman; 01-22-2013, 06:32 PM.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Platoon Organization - TeamSpeak?

                    As regards the last paragraph of your post Ytman, I don't think Apophis has misunderstood, at all.

                    You are overlooking the key point he is making because in your opinion the Coalition and working with it is primary, ergo all Comms issues and the like are about how we work towards that level of coordination.

                    Personally I don't interpret Apophis's response as directly addressing how Strait Raider chooses to communicate with the coalition. I think he is pointing out a simple fact that people need to be able to walk before they can run. That we need to iron out how 'we' communicate internally before we build a process for how we communicate with other outfits.

                    You use a PR analogy, so will I. Ran PR squads for a long time, going back years, before you, usually with new players in my squad and new players and squad leaders on my team. First thing I did, got my squads stuff squared away, our internal Comms sorted, our basics down. Why, because all the long game pontifaction, all the 'meta game' misnomer planning, all the strategising and grand scale planning in the world didn't count for much if 'you as a squad' weren't functioning optimally.

                    Working with others is important but these things have an optimal order. First you police yourself, then your squad, then your platoon.

                    Just a general note, can we be a bit less patronising towards people that have been doing this a lot longer than many of you, its really starting to get my back up. I don't discount other people's experience or insight so when presented with an opinion from someone who has demonstrably more experience than you it might be worth considering the merits of their opinion a little more fully.


                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Platoon Organization - TeamSpeak?

                      Originally posted by Wicks View Post
                      Just a general note, can we be a bit less patronising towards people that have been doing this a lot longer than many of you, its really starting to get my back up. I don't discount other people's experience or insight so when presented with an opinion from someone who has demonstrably more experience than you it might be worth considering the merits of their opinion a little more fully.
                      I was not being patronizing. I was only suggesting that what Strait Raider brought up was completely divergent from the issue at hand and that, on the last bit that Apophis brought attention to, was probably misinterpretation. What Strait Raider was suggesting was that 'Coalition Comms' should be considered as a near 'base line' level of teamwork with the whole team and that other leaders should attempt to work with those comms more frequently. That was an entirely divergent point and was only brought up by Strait Raider because he had no idea if he could work with two Teamspeaks at once.

                      My point in addressing Apo directly was only to make it clear that the part that Apo quoted;

                      "For an outfit that prides itself on teamwork..."

                      was not an implication that TG must work with the Coalition but was a vouching for the level of teamwork afforded by such structure.

                      Why would I do that? Because the very last words Apo used gave me the impression that he thought Strait Raider was being actively and aggressively critical for leaders who do not participate with the greater Coalition. Something I definitely did not think Strait was doing.

                      Originally posted by Apophis
                      I'm not saying that Coalition comms are not important, but when you throw the "For an outfit that prides itself on teamwork" bit in there it comes across as relatively aggressive....
                      There appeared to be a perception of aggression but really was a misunderstanding. You are taking issue with no issue.

                      =====================

                      On the greater subject matter of our overall COMMS we have no standardized SOP for intra/extra squad communication. Our SOP, which I quoted, focuses on minimizing COMMS traffic but sets no standard for in game CoC Comm procedure. Considering this, and furthermore considering that many people when they join the game do not think "Oh I'm going to volunteer and be a squad leader today" nor do all people have the ability to use a second monitor and set up impromptu bindings/whispers and go to a new "Special People Channel" you are effectively creating a barrier for effective communication and impromptu leadership changes.

                      The benefits of utilizing Platoon Chat for leadership orders, or even discussion and briefings, are numerous over a TeamSpeak centralized concept.
                      • Non-Outfit-Members can squadlead in our platoons effectively.
                      • All Platoon Members can see when the 'Leadership' is talking.
                      • Those who are privy to information can access it; Those who want nothing to do with it can mute/decrease its volume.
                      • Leadership is spontaneously promoted by the game to the proper channels.
                      • Use of Platoon Chat adds a psychological "WOW THATS AWESOME" factor to Non-Outfit-Members who can see, if they wish, our higher levels of coordination and tactics.


                      I've been in other outfit's large platoons and while CML is a great outfit they put a high level of obstruction to regular players by utilizing ONLY teamspeak. Furthermore by them utilizing ONLY teamspeak their COMMs can be quite messy when compared to our own.

                      My points on other things that I was more aggressive about; (1) Debating Orders, (2) Improper CoC, (3) Lack of Resolve of Platoon Leaders, are all issues I feel strongly about tackling in this community. Most of it is just idle banter or 'me too-ing', its not serious, but some of it really impacts our greater experiences. This game, currently, is a sandbox battlefield. Its bounds are what we put on it and nothing, again currently, lasts long. This all in mind the only thing we have from this game is the ability to do truly massive operations or at the very least impact a massive battle with superior well coordinated use of tactics and strategy.

                      When simple things like debating our COMMS SOP, something that I thought we certainly already did with you yourself agreeing with my greater points, come up, we are confronted with a huge barrier that prohibits the 'well coordinated use of tactics and strategy' from occurring frequently in our community. When, worse of all, the very tenuous 'unwritten' SOP gets changed mid-way and is changed to a level that is unnecessary you uproot the foundation and methodology of the people who already figured out how to operate in the manner the 'unwritten SOP' suggest.

                      And this is potentially where I might have an incongruent (which is apparently not a word O_o) view of our outfit, an outfit leadership, and the purpose of SOPs in this greater virtual sandbox. I feel that the point for all of these things is to grow a sort of doctrine of battle so that we organize ourselves through consistent high level display of virtual war-fighting professionalism so as to compound all of the individuals of the group into one cooperative force greater than the sum of its parts and greater than any other comparably sized/equivalent force. Without enforcing SOPs, without figuring out what we want our SOPs to even do or accomplish, we can't expect to do this. We have a community of people who would love to explain how things work and why they work and we have TGU to teach the SOPs to our new recruits or those who really want to get a firm handle on what our outfit demands of its 'Platoon leaders/squad leaders/and squad members'.

                      If we want to go back to the method that hasn't been employed for over two months time then sure lets do it, but make it FINAL and make it the darn status quo and justify it as our outfit leadership. Right now, and for many weeks prior, I've operated many platoons and squads utilizing ONLY ingame voip and its worked, so take that as you will.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Platoon Organization - TeamSpeak?

                        Again it is my interpretation that Apophis was making the point, which I couldn't agree more with, that a key issue is sorting out our comms, internally, and in fact that is the baseline we should address first. Pretty straightforward, particularly as we are in effect still discussing them.

                        The comment directly referred to, 'for an outfit that prides itself on teamwork' could very easily be interpreted as being a little bit of a dig. As it happens I have spoken to Strait many times however text is a cold medium. Do you see where I am going with that.

                        Which leads me on to this,
                        My points on other things that I was more aggressive about
                        . That may be a simple turn of phrase to you but it comes across in some of the other posts. I am going to give a piece of advice here that everyone would do well to take note of. If you have a point to make or something you wish to raise, don't be aggressive. Don't be aggressive full stop on the forums. Don't be 'aggressive' when you are in effect talking to or about people who get a lot less game time than you because they are working on stuff for the community. It isn't right, it's counter productive, it creates yet more friction, it won't be tolerated. It's going to stop.

                        Getting back to comms in general, the OP raised a concern about current comms, hence the debate. From that debate and previous ones the SOP's may well evolve, that will be up to the Outfit Leaders and members to work out.


                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Platoon Organization - TeamSpeak?

                          InGame VoiP COMM Diagram
                          IN-GAME COMMS SOP.jpg


                          InGame Chain of Command Diagram
                          COC-COM SOPs.jpg

                          Please do not have us use Teamspeak.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Platoon Organization - TeamSpeak?

                            It won't be me deciding lol, we are just talking here, nicely:row__523:


                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Platoon Organization - TeamSpeak?

                              Calm down, YT.

                              As far as I'm aware, there are no plans by the outfit officers to require a TS command channel.

                              sigpic


                              Comment

                              Connect

                              Collapse

                              TeamSpeak 3 Server

                              Collapse

                              Advertisement

                              Collapse

                              Twitter Feed

                              Collapse

                              Working...
                              X