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Using nanites..

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  • Using nanites..

    I know one of the key TG team rules is to not pull resources unless asked to do so.


    Sometimes I find myself in a hot situation where there is a target of opportunity with a small time window and I want to pull a burster max or a AV max with enemy tanks rolling over a hill that I am stuck asking for permission.

    In other platoons, they would say if you are not using your nanites to pull sunderers/maxes/vehicles then you aren't playing the game right or even supporting your team well.

    I get that TG is trying for a more mil-sim approach using tactics instead of magical power ups, but resources (nanites) is pretty core to the game and adds alot of power to a soldier.

    Could there be some discretion?

    Could it be up to the SL's discretion to say ask players in his/her squad to always have 450 nanites available to pull anything and the top 300 nanites are usable by the soldier to do what he/needs to?

    If a soldier needs a throw away Flash ATV to speed over to the squad mark or to scout for an enemy sundy, does he have to ask SL?

    Maybe pull a throw away valkyrie to scout / drop onto enemy sunderers near the squad?)

    If the resource is in service of the Squad objectives, couldn't the individual soldier use his/her initiative to support the team?

    Can the SL decide how tight they are gonna run things without breaking TG rules?

  • #2
    Re: Using nanites..

    The simple answer is to ask the Squad Lead if you can pull something, but also remember that if the squad is readying to move out, you may loose that resource.

    One reasons not to pull:

    This is a scenario from the past, the details escape me, but involved at lease 3 other outfit/platoons and was laid out from the start and planned for the whole 2 hour alert with a common goal, to lock the continent by a small margin. The following 'Reason' is a small extract of that plan near to the end of the alert.

    You and your TG squad are set at Weapons YELLOW on Air, GREEN on AV and AI and are looking to take out a group of Main Battle Tanks which are sieging and supporting spawns at a base another outfit it trying to capture.

    Your SL/PL has coordinated with two other outfits to make this happen.

    Squad one (you) tasked above

    Squad two a RUSE squad to setup an AA nest DESTRACTION, to focus all the enemy air in the area AWAY for the base that need to be taken

    Platoon (squad three and four) to hold for green light from YOUR SL/PL to take the base in question.

    At which point squad one and two would mobilize, and join the platoon to fortify the base.

    Now in this situation, as a Squad Member, you may know very little about the play of action, apart form the current active orders. Most of the communication will be done behind closed doors (Command Comms, Team Speak, Private Channels)

    If a squad member was to engage a 'targets of opportunity' for example a smoking GAL from another organised enemy outfit. they would investigate it very fast and would stay in the area.

    This would mean that each enemy outfits would know something is ABOUT to happen in this area AND its a key base so would draw units off the another faction and non critical bases to push it.

    In turn would brake the strategic plans of locking the continent.

    Ok the above is a remote case, but the process is the same:

    Your SL knows the plan, its their job to work with it and adjust it when needed.
    Your SL may Ask for input/advice/opinion but again its up to the SL what they take on-board.

    'Could there be some discretion?'
    Its your squad leads discretion to allow/Deny or repeat and make up orders.

    - Some SL's will set kits for each player (what is NEEDED NOW)

    - Other SL's will work around each players attributes.

    - Few SL's will directly give player(s) multi jobs IE; AV MAX while air is minimum then Burster MAX when needed(As price has already been paid)

    A Max rush is nothing if only 2 players have the recourses to pull a MAX

    You requested a Kit change and get ignored?

    Ask yourself first:
    * Was the SL under heavy Comms (PL, COMMD, TS, main map)?

    * Did they feel the request was less urgent?

    * Did they Hear you?

    * Did you open comms when comms were clear?

    * Have you already been Given orders?

    Have a read of the Planetside 2 Official Rules and Announcements with aal our Statdard Opperating Procedues.

    Also. [MENTION=136091]Ricterr[/MENTION] welcome to Tactical Gamer

    EDIT(New Link Principles of Being a Good Squad Member):

    (6..~)Z Z z z....


    • #3
      Re: Using nanites..

      The rationale actually has nothing to do with a mil-sim style or not wanting to use powerups; it doesn't even have to do with preserving nanites! It has everything to do with keeping the squad effective.

      If I'm running a squad, I want everyone to know their jobs and be where they should be, and I want the squad close together and focused on the same job. If you, say, grab a tank that I didn't allow you to, or go running off after a target of opportunity you spotted, all of a sudden my squad is undermanned; one more person isn't able to do the job I wanted them to (and if it was a critical job, I'm now hooped) and the squad is one person weaker, which could be the difference between a push failing or succeeding. Essentially, you're prioritizing your own effectiveness over that of the squad, and that's expressly counter to TG's principles.

      This is without going into the consequences for the rest of the squad's cohesion; if you go off on your own without asking, you implicitly send the signal to everyone else in the squad that the behaviour is okay, degrading discipline and undermining the leadership unless the SL drags you back into line. If we made something like you're describing official policy, it would be even worse; now our SLs would have enormous difficulty reigning in players going off an doing their own thing, and it almost certainly wouldn't be just one player at a time! Even if the degree of control was up to SL discretion, we would be building a culture in which that kind of lack of discipline was allowed. Keeping our squads cohesive under that scenario would be a nightmare.

      By restricting ourselves in this way, we lose a lot of fluidity and individual effectiveness, but we hope to make up the difference through our coordination and combined effort. Sometimes that means opportunities are missed, but other opportunities can be seized because we have the force, discipline, and cohesion to execute on things we couldn't as individuals. Besides, there are already plenty of lone wolf players at almost every fight; let THEM run around and take those opportunities, while we do what we do best.

      Under most circumstances, just ask your SL. It won't take long, and you'll often get the go ahead. If not, the SL may have objectives or plans that are incompatible with it, and they almost certainly have a broader view of the fight. Taking initiative isn't the problem, the problem comes from not having the SL in the loop so that you don't accidentally undercut the squad's purpose or leave the SL wondering where the hell you've gotten off to.


      • #4
        Re: Using nanites..

        Fair enough.

        yes my assumptions were weapons green. and in my scenario the SL was over burdened with COMMs and activities going on (i'e getting overrun.

        But I get the discipline by example and cohesion by sacrificing individual initiative, I get the lack of big picture due to not knowing command or platoon level strategies.

        I just feel like we are tactically at a disadvantage not using all the resources given in the game. When all of the squad is walking by foot with 750 nanites in their pockets I make a sad face inside :)

        Or bringing up 3 sundies instead of just one for redundancy sake. that kind of thing.

        Maybe its just a style thing.


        • #5
          Re: Using nanites..

          I think functionally its a style thing. Leaders bring with them what they are comfortable with and many of our group are mil-sim players or are focused on experience (not XP farming experience) driven engagements than what this game glorifies. It might seem ineffective in direct proportion to the alert or VP of the faction, but those goals might not be on the radar of concern for the SL/PL.

          From a feedback stance I agree that putting all of our eggs in one Sunderer seems a bit shoddy, especially during direct point attacks. I also think restricting Maxes a bit of an odd choice (especially during point holds) - but I'm a terrible Maxer and always am wanting more opportunities at it. Finally, I think lightnings can be seen as a quick one man disposable anti-tank effort, but this is more tactics than specifically rule based.

          I think the rule isn't about resources (we don't ask permission to throw down mines or grenades) I think its vehicle based. Its all in an effort to keep people in line with the CoC. Basically what StarStriker said.

          Where I think it can be harmful is when people aren't willing to ask to do XYZ because the SL/PL didn't ask for it. Just speak up in a proactive way!
          No person can simply just be; they are what they do.


          • #6
            Re: Using nanites..

            Heres the other thing i'll say in regards to this SL'ing is tough really really tough, and often times we have a plan that most do not. When I was SL'ing the other day for instance I had someone repeatedly ask to pull an infil. Normally I dont mind this, and I even value a good infil but on this occassion our goal was dropping on to enemy deployments and hitting them with high alpha damage. I also had explained this to the squad, prior to the infiltrator request. this ultimatly took away extra brain power for the moment and caused me to lose track for a moment. My ultimate advice would be think of what the squad needs and if it involves switching from a needed roll or pulling assets then ask the SL before hand. In the case mentioned prior it was easy to figure out what to pull, so infil should have been out of the question, nonetheless i was happy that they decided to ask instead of going right ahead. That being said I myself do tend to give relative freedom with class choice provided we have 2-3 medics


            • #7
              Re: Using nanites..

              If you want to do whatever you want, just go soloing, or join a pubbie squad where you can do whatever you want. :)

              Some SLs (late night crew comes to mind) tend to run a little more loose. Also if you have ever been in what I call an all star squad (most/all high BR players, sometimes from multiple outfits) those also tend to run more loose and depend on individual skill and initiative.

              But kind of the entire point of your typical TG squad, our "brand" if you will, is to be stronger as a single, whole, cohesive unit, working together, than we are as a collection of strong individuals.

              Just different playstyles. Personally I like variety, so sometimes I jump into different squads (including sometimes non TG) depending on my mood.
              "The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it." - George Bernard Shaw




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