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  • Leading raids?

    sorry if this is out of line, but Im really disturbed at the moment... What is the reason Arkamis was told he cant lead anymore? He has lead raids better and more successfully than any other TG'er... From my perspective anyways..
    QUOTE : "Icsist has a little shameless behavior in the past"
    Nice remark guys.

  • #2
    Re: Leading raids?

    I had asked him personally to step back from leading the 40 mans due to general discontent with Arkamis' leading and our lack of progess in BWL.

    People were getting frustrated and taking it to heart, and some were taking it against Arkamis. I thought he needed a break, a chance to cool down, and a chance to let the guild's attitude towards him cool down also. Instead he took it as an insult (as seen in his post).

    This is a perpetual cycle, with which I couldn't see how to spin us out of it. I don't think this is Arkamis' fault, nor do I think he didn't do enough.

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    • #3
      Re: Leading raids?

      Honestly? I think Ark was one of the people who was doing the best at leading the BWL raids and making progress, and i've been discontent with some of the raid leadership of others.

      Perhaps this is a mistake of ignoring a silent majority? If you hear nothing but discontent, maybe it's because the people who are content aren't seeing the need to speak up, which is obviously going to skew the information you're recieving. That's part of the problems i was posting on the other day. This decision was made without most of the guild having a say in it, or even speaking their opinions. I was fine with ark's leadership. I know there are others too. If maybe, a topic had been formed, asking everyone in the guild what sort of leadership style they preferred, then something could have been done. But I think this was greatly mishandled.

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      • #4
        Re: Leading raids?

        Originally posted by Icsist View Post
        sorry if this is out of line, but Im really disturbed at the moment... What is the reason Arkamis was told he cant lead anymore? He has lead raids better and more successfully than any other TG'er... From my perspective anyways..
        I too am disturbed by this.

        Originally posted by orion808 View Post
        People were getting frustrated and taking it to heart, and some were taking it against Arkamis. I thought he needed a break, a chance to cool down, and a chance to let the guild's attitude towards him cool down also. Instead he took it as an insult (as seen in his post).
        I too have been frustrated by a lack of progress in BWL, but this is much more frustrating to me than any number of wipes, screw-ups etc..

        How about we give the complainers and whining bitches a break from raiding next time??
        Uglyduck - Spec varies - Currently Prot
        MMORPG = Many Men Online Role-Playing as Girls

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Leading raids?

          Originally posted by duck View Post
          I too am disturbed by this.


          How about we give the complainers and whining bitches a break from raiding next time??
          well said, but that still isnt gonna make Arkamis lead us ever again..

          Im not saying anything bad about others leading us, but it just seemed to work when Arkamis lead us... If people got mad at him, then something needed to be done about those people... They need to realize that it is very hard to lead a raid... Im sure Arkamis ( and other raid leaders ) have spent many HOURS outside of game figuring out strategies and what not to get us to where we are today...

          It is very easy for people to complain about something, but if they were leading the raid, we would still be on Luci right now...

          I have missed out on alot of RL stuff to come to raids that Arkamis lead just because i knew we were gonna accomplish stuff.

          I dont even know what to say. Im just .... flustured.
          QUOTE : "Icsist has a little shameless behavior in the past"
          Nice remark guys.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Leading raids?

            My very first raid I ran with TG was in BWL, Arkamis was leading that raid. We made it all the way to Broodlord, 23%. I did not see a problem with his leading.
            "As Above, So Below"

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            • #7
              Re: Leading raids?

              Originally posted by Lepmesiah View Post
              My very first raid I ran with TG was in BWL, Arkamis was leading that raid. We made it all the way to Broodlord, 23%. I did not see a problem with his leading.
              yes, outstanding... Arkamis is the only person to take us that far...
              QUOTE : "Icsist has a little shameless behavior in the past"
              Nice remark guys.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Leading raids?

                Please... this attitude will not get the guild anywhere.

                Manny is a more than capable leader. Now is time for you all to listen to him, and for those who haven't felt the need to step up in the past to do so.

                No one person is so important that TG cannot survive and thrive without them. I am not the exception to that.

                Kill Broodlord this week. Do it to prove that I was not needed. Do it to prove that TG has what it takes, because I know it does. All I added to a raid was some paltry DPS... yet we succeeded. That can be replaced easily.

                I know TG has in it what it takes to be wherever it wants to be. Let me leave you all with some words from my favorite poem, words I've memorized and often recited to myself when I needed guidance:

                "Push off, and sitting well in order smite
                The sounding furrows; for my purpose holds
                To sail beyond the sunset, and the baths
                Of all the western stars, until I die.
                It may be that the gulfs will wash us down:
                It may be we shall touch the Happy Isles,
                And see the great Achilles, whom we knew.

                Tho' much is taken, much abides; and tho'
                We are not now that strength which in the old days
                Moved earth and heaven; that which we are, we are;
                One equal-temper of heroic hearts,
                Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will
                To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield."

                from "Ulysses" by Tennyson.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Leading raids?

                  Originally posted by ZariusZer0 View Post
                  Honestly? I think Ark was one of the people who was doing the best at leading the BWL raids and making progress, and i've been discontent with some of the raid leadership of others.

                  Perhaps this is a mistake of ignoring a silent majority? If you hear nothing but discontent, maybe it's because the people who are content aren't seeing the need to speak up, which is obviously going to skew the information you're recieving. That's part of the problems i was posting on the other day. This decision was made without most of the guild having a say in it, or even speaking their opinions. I was fine with ark's leadership. I know there are others too. If maybe, a topic had been formed, asking everyone in the guild what sort of leadership style they preferred, then something could have been done. But I think this was greatly mishandled.
                  in all honesty... ark lead raids that killed razorgore 2 times... the attempts on vael under his lead were insta-wipes... the only time we have ever (ever) killed vael is under manny's lead ( id say co-me but i just set grps up n'stuff)
                  powered by Windows 7

                  . . . .

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Leading raids?

                    Originally posted by Icsist View Post
                    . If people got mad at him, then something needed to be done about those people...
                    dont fix the problem? take away the people that see the problem? backwords thinking

                    icsist... i respect you.. but w.t.h.
                    powered by Windows 7

                    . . . .

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Leading raids?

                      If I recall correctly, the night we took Broodlord down to 23% was one of the very first (if not the actual first) nights we began COOPERATIVE LEADING with Arkamis and Manny working together. It was them working together that got us to that point that evening.

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                      • #12
                        Re: Leading raids?

                        Just to add my two cents, I'm very disappointed as well that Ark will not be leading for a while. I really felt that his raid leadership was excellent and the effort he put into it for our progression was very much appreciated on my end.

                        All of that said, I don't quite understand the animosity directed at the other raid leaders. Luna is spot on when she points out that Manny's co-leadership helped us over the Vael hump and through the suppression room. I have the utmost confidence that he knows what we need to get through BWL. My only other real experiences in 40-mans have been with Chair and Crebis, both of whom are able to keep things moving quickly and efficiently. Now that I think about it, Sajier also took us through half of MC once and did a bang-up job as well (for a priest... :p)

                        Point is, we have effective raid leadership out there. I think Ark gave us a great shot at progressing the way I want our raids to go, but I also believe that Manny gives us an equally good shot.

                        I, for one, hope to see Ark back at the reins of our raids in the near future...
                        70 Priest

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Leading raids?

                          Originally posted by Chair View Post
                          in all honesty... ark lead raids that killed razorgore 2 times... the attempts on vael under his lead were insta-wipes... the only time we have ever (ever) killed vael is under manny's lead ( id say co-me but i just set grps up n'stuff)
                          Actually, all but one of our razorgore takedowns was under my lead. And I was never given the chance to lead an honest vael attempt. We started vael with manny and I co-leading from day one. Well, except the infamous kitty first death.

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                          • #14
                            Re: Leading raids?

                            Chair...you missed tonight's Guild Meeting...yes, Guild meeting...We spoke of alot of this...but in less of a confrontational manner.

                            Arkamis, I'd like to speak with you whenever you might be available.

                            For those readin, I did this here instead of PMs so you wouldn't drag this thread on until it's been beaten to death. Let's talk on TS instead of the forums and put voice to concerns instead of text which could be construed to be full of anger and only esculate.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Leading raids?

                              I have no interest in debate, just setting the record straight. Truth for the sake of truth. I'll pop onto the TS server momentarily.

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