Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Questions on the 25-man raid roster

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Questions on the 25-man raid roster

    Has the platoon roster been established or are people outside Defiant/Illidan still eligible to try out as long as they meet the gear and "experience" requirements?

    Are weekday (Mon-Thur) raids planned?
    Saxen | 70 Protection Warrior
    Belize | 70 Enhancement Shaman
    Rilke | 64 Mutilation Rogue
    Noye | 62 Shadow Priest

  • #2
    Re: Questions on the 25-man raid roster

    The 25 man platoon roster is still in a bit of flux, but we are mostly looking to fill specific class/role combinations and looking for those who best meet those.

    Gaviin and I are contacting people as we figure out what we need to track their interest and availability, after we have made evaluations on gear and skill.

    Monday through Thursday raids are not currently planned as we have 4 squads working on Karazhan in that time frame.
    Sajaman/|TG-Irr|Sajier - WoW Resto Shaman, BF2/BF2142 Assault/Medic

    | | |

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Questions on the 25-man raid roster

      I'm not a complainer, and if you've raided with me, you know I'm as easygoing as they come. But I wouldn't feel right if I didn't say something here: am I the only person who thinks this whole process has been a going-through-the-motions exercise in self-selection?

      So, to get on the roster, you needed to meet gear requirements that were based on wearing a fair number of KZ-quality drops (totally reasonable). If you weren't initially eligible, you had about a week to gear up before the first Gruul's run. And if you weren't on the that first raid, you were out of luck well before Sajier's post today. Oh, and Gaviin and Sajier had to know your raid experience personally, just in case you slipped by on gear.

      Put it another way, if during a two-week period in the middle of summer you weren't completely focused on WoW, you just lost out on doing any 25-man content with your guild.

      In the spirit of open government, who not on Defiant or Illidan was involved in determining this process?

      Since there was no public discussion, I assume the officers debated a more inclusive approach and decided against it in favor of the current exclusive system. What was the argument against inclusion?
      Saxen | 70 Protection Warrior
      Belize | 70 Enhancement Shaman
      Rilke | 64 Mutilation Rogue
      Noye | 62 Shadow Priest

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Questions on the 25-man raid roster

        Not just Gaviin and Sajier were involved in setting up requirements for the 25 man content. All officers were asked to give input and suggestions on individual class reqs. If I'm understanding correctly Sajier and Gaviin were the first to volunteer to be the raid leaders for Gruuls. When I put up the druids reqs I tried to make the stats as easily attainable as possible (ili doesn't even meet them FYI) , assuming that raiding experience > gear. That very reason is why the raid leaders wanted the chance to group with everyone in either 10 or 5 man instances.
        Last edited by Iliana; 08-06-2007, 07:57 PM. Reason: ili can't spell

        |TG-Defiant| - It's you and me against the world. We attack at dawn.

        You're a great friend but if we're ever chased by zombies I'm tripping you.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Questions on the 25-man raid roster

          The issues surrounding structure and eligibility for the 25 man raid group were debated at length among all officers...including all squad leaders. The criteria for stats and experience were based on input from raiding guilds and are designed to create a minimum standard for success. The judgments around experience and "heads up" play are common sense, and are left up the RLs to debate and decide.

          The timing of forming the group and moving ahead was to keep TG moving toward game progression, with the goal of establishing a raiding platoon and getting into the 25 man raiding instances as quickly as we could.

          We know that there will be players who, for whatever reason, did not make the initial list (which is not final) but who meet the gear requirements later. We have had three of the initial list who have left the guild. We have another who changed class (rogue to healing druid) to fill a gap in our class needs. We have had two raids cancelled for either lack of signup or lack of showup.
          This suggests to me that the raiding platoon roster is not closed yet, but will start to firm up in the not so distant future. Even once "set", there will still be opportunities to fill a spot from time to time and to replace players who move on or who are unable to raid regularly. For now, we are being quite "firm" about the gear requirements (to produce the stats you need) to be considered for the group. You get to that stage by running Karazhan...a lot.


          As a guild, one of our goals is to foster raiding and progression into end-game content. We are working to make our first 25 man raiding platoon a success, but we are learning and having to make adjustments as we move into it.
          Last edited by beep; 08-07-2007, 01:06 AM.
          Beep


          Those people who think they know everything are a great annoyance to those of us who do. - (Isaac Asimov)

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Questions on the 25-man raid roster

            To my understanding the 25 raid platoon roster isn't a 'You must be on this list to attend' deal but a 'These people can and will go' deal. You are in the platoon if you have the gear and have expressed a desire to go into 25 man content and will do so consistantly.

            For the record we had 5 Gruul raids without the formation of the platoon that were open to the entire guild. Short of having the officers visit homes and force people to go, every attempt was made to inform people of these raids to get some bodies to throw into the meat grinder. This is what happened:

            Raid 1: Exploratory run. Failed to get first boss down, but much fun was had. I was working :(
            Raid 2: Canceled due to lack of interest from guild
            Raid 3: Canceled due to lack of interest from guild
            Raid 4: Canceled due to lack of interest from guild
            Raid 5: Canceled due to lack of interest from guild


            Saying 'there are people not on the list who wish to go but can't' is somewhat silly because people who aren't on the list aren't there because they havn't been in contact with people enough to show enough interest in going. If you want to go, show the committment to go, and express a desire to go then a way will be found for you to go. There is no ifs ands or buts about it. If you want to go, you will get to go. Obviously on our first forays into 25 man content we want to send the best geared and best prepared to clear the way first. Once we get the ball rolling then we can work on bringing in people who didn't previously meet the requirements since as our experience with the content goes up, the safe guards in gear we have in place will become less important.

            Currently TG is in a very dangerous position. We stand on the border between 'serious raiding' and 'casual gamer' and that is causing some difficulties. Serious raiders want to see the 25 man content of Gruul, Mag, SSC, and TE so they get the feeling of 'progression' and 'accomplishment' that follows success in such endeavors. Casual gamers don't care, don't pay attention to guild matters, don't read the boards, and play for the fun of it. Actually, its a bit more difficult than that. Serious raiders want to see that content now while casual gamers want to see it 'eventually'. Thus do we have a problem. The serious raiders want to get going and keep progressing, but the casual gamers don't pay attention enough to join in and don't find such progression as important at the moment, but fully expect to take part later when they feel like it.

            Then we have good dedicated people leaving because they get frustrated about the lack of overall guild interest in going which gives us the end result of more gaps to fill in order to be able to go. More gaps open up as we don't go causing more attempts at getting interest from the casual gamers so we can go fail which in turn causes more gaps to open up as people leave.

            You play a game to have fun. I want to see end game content as part of my enjoyment. Many others wish for the same thing. No matter how great the people in the guild are and how wonderful the community, if you can't have fun with the game then you either quit playing or find another guild that can take you to that content to have fun.
            My sanity is not in question...
            It was a confirmed casualty some time ago.


            Light, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to hide the bodies of the people I had to kill because they ticked me off.



            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Questions on the 25-man raid roster

              Originally posted by Tarenth View Post
              To my understanding the 25 raid platoon roster isn't a 'You must be on this list to attend' deal but a 'These people can and will go' deal. You are in the platoon if you have the gear and have expressed a desire to go into 25 man content and will do so consistantly.

              For the record we had 5 Gruul raids without the formation of the platoon that were open to the entire guild. Short of having the officers visit homes and force people to go, every attempt was made to inform people of these raids to get some bodies to throw into the meat grinder. This is what happened:

              Raid 1: Exploratory run. Failed to get first boss down, but much fun was had. I was working :(
              Raid 2: Canceled due to lack of interest from guild
              Raid 3: Canceled due to lack of interest from guild
              Raid 4: Canceled due to lack of interest from guild
              Raid 5: Canceled due to lack of interest from guild


              Saying 'there are people not on the list who wish to go but can't' is somewhat silly because people who aren't on the list aren't there because they havn't been in contact with people enough to show enough interest in going. If you want to go, show the committment to go, and express a desire to go then a way will be found for you to go. There is no ifs ands or buts about it. If you want to go, you will get to go
              Harumph! That's easy for you to say. Your not on the outside looking in. That's like saying all the rich people in the world are that way because they work harder.
              Last edited by Vondoom; 08-07-2007, 06:43 AM.
              I don't suffer from insanity,
              I enjoy every minute of it!

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Questions on the 25-man raid roster

                I just want to throw my 2 cents in here as far as the "gear problem" is concerned. I see and hear a lot of people complaining that the 25 man requirements are favoring those who are able to get into Kara on a consistent basis and get bosses down. IMO this is not true. I am currently meeting all mage requirements for the 25 man raids and I have only 1 kara drop in all of my gear (and it's a ring lol). The rest of my gear has been collected through arena points, rep grinding, heroic badge grinding and farming mat's for crafted items. (on top of that, i also don't have any of the frozen shadoweave set through my own tailoring and i'm still meeting req's.) Now, I am in the special forces squad and we have had our fair share (and more) of trouble getting into and through kara, there are several reasons, I will not go into detail. I have never been all the way through kara, I have only killed about half the bosses in there. I guess the point I'm trying to make is that I know there are some people that aren't in kara squads, and even some in squads that are having a hard time getting T4 type gear, but it is entirely possible to get geared for the 25 man's without farming kara drops.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Questions on the 25-man raid roster

                  Originally posted by beep View Post
                  Even once "set", there will still be opportunities to fill a spot from time to time and to replace players who move on or who are unable to raid regularly.
                  Beep, I thank you for your thoughtful response. Looking out over the next several months, though, what opportunity does the rest of the guild (meaning, the hundreds of characters not on the initial roster) have to see any 25-man content, excepting, as you say, the rare open slot?

                  Is there a plan, for instance, for the platoon to master Gruul's then pause for everyone else who wants to see the encounter to do so? That seems very much keeping with the spirit of GUILD progression.

                  But if not, my comment
                  you just lost out on doing any 25-man content with your guild
                  is proven correct. Worse, we just witnessed the birth of a guild-within-the-guild far more exclusionary than the squad system is.

                  Beep said:
                  As a guild, one of our goals is to foster raiding and progression into end-game content.
                  I applaud Sajier and Gaviin for stepping up and making this happen. I want to see TG spank Maulgaur and Gruul and move on and on deeper into the end-game. But I don't think we're on the right path for the GUILD to progress. I'm not suggesting stopping the presses here, but am asking for a willingness to consider other systems for fosters GUILD progression.

                  Yes, a core group of raiders is beneficial for faster progression. But I don't agree that "core" means 100% of the raid each week. I wasn't with TG for MC, but didn't you learn and then master that raid with a core based on key figures being there each week -- consistency in class leaders, raid leaders and tanks but with rotation among the ranks? I doubt you had the same 40 people each time. My personal experience as (then) my guild's Priest class leader was that as long as the MT healers came regularly and learned the encounters, the "floaters" could be told what to do. And as long as they were serious about playing their role, they did just fine.

                  So I'll ask again:
                  I assume the officers debated a more inclusive approach and decided against it in favor of the current exclusive system. What was the argument against inclusion?
                  Saxen | 70 Protection Warrior
                  Belize | 70 Enhancement Shaman
                  Rilke | 64 Mutilation Rogue
                  Noye | 62 Shadow Priest

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Questions on the 25-man raid roster

                    Originally posted by Amalie View Post
                    I just want to throw my 2 cents in here as far as the "gear problem" is concerned. I see and hear a lot of people complaining that the 25 man requirements are favoring those who are able to get into Kara on a consistent basis and get bosses down. IMO this is not true. I am currently meeting all mage requirements for the 25 man raids and I have only 1 kara drop in all of my gear (and it's a ring anyway..). The rest of my gear has been collected through arena points, rep grinding, heroic badge grinding and farming mat's for crafted items. I have never been all the way through kara, I have only killed about half the bosses in there. I guess the point I'm trying to make is that I know there are some people that aren't in kara squads, and even some in squads that are having a hard time getting T4 type gear, but it is entirely possible to get geared for the 25 man's w/o running kara. (on top of that, i also don't have any of the frozen shadoweave set through my own tailoring and i'm still meeting req's.)
                    Absolutely agree with Amalie here. For most gear obtainable in Karazhan, there is equal or better gear obtainable elsewhere. Out of my 17 slots, 4 are equipped with Karazhan drops. The rest come from BoE tailored items (I am not a tailor), PvP rewards, reputation rewards, heroic badge turn-ins, and drops from instances. Oh, and a trinket from Blackwing Lair. :)

                    Options for gear are everywhere. It's only when you get into SSC and TK that raiders can really gear up past what anyone else can do. Prior to that, make goals for specific items and work towards them. It takes time, but it's more predictable than waiting for a drop in a raid.

                    You can debate where the bar is set on gear requirements, but you have to have a bar. The fact is that Blizzard has set 25-man raiding up to be a more stringent experience than Molten Core or Onyxia, for example. Gruul with 25 is much more on par with AQ40 with 40. Both Maulgar and Gruul are deliberate gear checks by the developers. They are intended to slow guilds down so they have more time to work on the next expansion.

                    Maulgar is doable with a couple of raid slots filled with undergeared players. Gruul, quite simply, is not. Gruul is an enormous DPS hurdle, and you have to have a full complement of players that can lay down the smack, or it's just the joy of repair bills for everyone.

                    The sad truth is that skill is not enough for these fights. People have to gear up, pot up, and work together. Gruul's Lair is a difficult hurdle.

                    Gnopaine - Level 70 Warlock (Affliction)
                    Scarpia (aka Edbane) - Level 70 Paladin (Holy)
                    Ripoffron - Level 1 Auction House Hustler

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Questions on the 25-man raid roster

                      Originally posted by Tarenth View Post
                      If you want to go, show the committment to go, and express a desire to go then a way will be found for you to go. There is no ifs ands or buts about it. If you want to go, you will get to go.
                      I've purposefully left my own story out of my first posts, but I'd point out that I in fact meet gear requirements, and contacted Sajier and Gaviin about my interest in participating and never heard a word back from either.

                      Thus, Vondoom's post rings the truest in my ears:
                      Harumph! That's easy for you to say. You're not on the outside looking in.
                      Regardless, I'm not questioning gear requirements. I'm questioning the rush to establish a system that will effectually lock most of the guild out of participating in end-game content.
                      Saxen | 70 Protection Warrior
                      Belize | 70 Enhancement Shaman
                      Rilke | 64 Mutilation Rogue
                      Noye | 62 Shadow Priest

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Questions on the 25-man raid roster

                        Unfortunately, comparing MC to 25 man content isn't appropriate. In MC, you could easily have a core of players and a bunch of "filler" and still be reasonably successful. With only 25 spots to a raid now, every single one of those people needs to have the gear and the EXPERIENCE to play their role effectively. Consider this for a moment- back in MC, that "core" of players numbered roughly 25. Blizzard has it set up so as to eliminate the 15 floaters and focus on the "core", as the difficulty of the encounters clearly reflect. There is no room for the revolving door method of doing things if we want to see progress without losing the "core" players. As you can see, our stumbling blocks have already led to losses in that area.

                        We are doing everything we can in our power to keep everyone satisfied in this transitional time. The platoon roster is currently in flux, and will continue to be adapted until we get a solid, reliable group who can spearhead our 25 man progress. We're close but not quite there yet, as demonstrated by this week's cancelled raids.

                        As the initial content is mastered, I foresee one of three things occurring:

                        1. As gear is secured, folks will opt out of mastered content to allow others a chance to get into the instance.

                        2. A second platoon will form, allowing a second round of players to collaborate and master the content at their pace. (Not everyone wants to walk into a raid where everyone knows more than they do. Some enjoy the learning process and the success of earning the kill.)

                        3. Once an instance has been regularly cleared, players will be freed up to teach what the platoon has learned to a second successful group (Combining 1 and 2). They will not need to go into Gruul's anymore (for example) and so will be free to spread the love and use their experience to help the rest of the guild.

                        I do not anticipate a "pause", per say. I expect the progress to continue and the knowledge to be shared, just as squads have done thus far. As the initial squads wrap up KZ, those players can then go and help squads who are still working on it, should they want the help. This tradition will continue to support the progress of everyone wanting to see end game content. This keeps true to our spirit of guild progression in a manner that satisfies the most people.

                        That said, I am not sure why you haven't heard from the platoon leaders yet, Saxon. I am confident it is an oversight. I know Sajier has been on vacation for a week and I'm sure he's received more PMs about all of this than he can count.

                        I think Tarenth's post is right on the money, and worth reading over and over as a mantra.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Questions on the 25-man raid roster

                          Saxen, I'm not sure that any response I could make will be fully satisfactory to you. What I will do is to share my thinking about how we approached the problem of setting up a 25 man raiding platoon.

                          The same arguments that were thrown up against the squad system are being thrown out again, when now the squad system is looked at quite well by most people and its effectiveness is very tough to argue. Just as we said then, if you aren’t ready now, you can form one when enough people are ready.

                          The reason we formed squads in the first place for Karazhan was because we knew that consistency was an essential part of progress through raid zones in the future. Having 30 people locked into the same Karazhan instance wasn't going to help anyone to make good progress to towards the 25 mans. By having a consistent team who you could learn to work with (and how they worked) you would make faster progress through Karazhan. This consistency is required as well for the 25 mans. If we can't have a group that is always there and are swapping out 5-10 people of each raid, and they aren't able to provide the same level of performance, and aren't filling the same roles, then you dramatically hamper the progress of the group, possibly stop it all together. In addition, if you are re-teaching the fight and having to adjust strategy every single time you enter the instance because you have a new group every time, you, again, slow down the progress of the group. Consistency is essential for progress (and that means consistency of time, consistency of skill, and consistency of attitude).

                          It's a dramatic overstatement to say the rest of the guild is locked out of 25 man content by having a 25 man raiding platoon with a predetermined roster. Lets not blow the numbers out of proportion, because of the 100ish actual level 70 primary guild members who you are really talking about is actually more like 35-50 who are consistently on and MIGHT (realize we have a very large volume of 70's who aren't interested in raiding, and thus haven't gotten involved with Karazhan squads or, when they existed, mix it up raids) want to raid. Of those 40-50 guildies or so who might want to raid, about 30-35 of them meet the requirements laid out as far as gear goes. Those numbers are benchmarks that we can use to tell if people are actually working to get themselves in a position to be able to effectively contribute to the raid as their class (not taking skill into account).

                          After that, we have to take role balance and Boss abilities into consideration. Our current 25 man build is 2 Main Tanks, 3 Off Tanks (tanks who fill other roles unless asked to tank), 7-8 Primary Healers, and 12-13 DPS. Of those 12-13 DPS, we try to run no more than 1/3 of them as pure Melee DPS as there are quite a few abilities that require Melee DPS to move in and out of a fight, dramatically reducing their effectiveness.

                          Now, along with all this, let’s take into account skill. This is something that is judged by effectiveness in your role, ability to adapt to a changing strategy, and most importantly situational awareness. This varies dramatically from person to person, and if you aren't on your game in these instances you WILL kill the raid. Every single member is essential and must be on top of their game every time in.

                          As I have said several times, there are class/role considerations that have to be taken into account. Right now, in the platoon, we have 2 warrior tanks, 2 bear tanks (who can DPS as needed), and 1 pali tank (who can heal as needed). 3 of the 5 people who are tanking in the group can very effectively fill other roles when not asked to tank. However, if I asked a prot warrior to DPS, their effectiveness is no where near where what a feral druid would be because the feral druid, through no fault of the warrior, has the flexibility to effectively be both. This creates a situation where it’s more effective for the group to have feral druids, Prot Palis, or DPS warriors as off tanks than prot warriors, because prot warriors don’t have the flexibility to move from one situation to the other as needed.

                          These raids are NOT MC. MC had so much wiggle room, so much room for error, and we regularly had on our runs people who were half AFK, weren’t paying attention, or weren’t doing what they were supposed to, and yet we easily cleared the place. All raids past MC changed the way raids were done, every member of the group counted and every member needed to be on their game for progress to exist. The “floaters”, as you called them, would have to be equally skilled, geared, and attentive for it to work. Proof positive are the Karazhan runs, where 1 person screws up and the entire raid can wipe. I know, personally, I have cost Illidan fights before because I didn’t get a heal off in time, or I didn’t get into Maidens AE far enough to get me out of Repentance and it cost us a tank. How much risk is added by bringing in people who aren’t familiar with the fights, the strats, and how things work? If you bring in people who aren’t equivalent to the people they are replacing, you could be risking the entire raid.

                          So in summary:
                          • Those who aren’t in the current group are not locked out of end game, they just aren’t there yet.
                          • Gear, role/class balance, and skill all play important parts in the success of the group.
                          • Consistency in the group is required to make steady progress.
                          • OWW (old World of Warcraft) raids are not the same as current raids, every single decision and character counts. One person CAN kill a raid, just by not doing their job effectively enough.
                          Sajaman/|TG-Irr|Sajier - WoW Resto Shaman, BF2/BF2142 Assault/Medic

                          | | |

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Questions on the 25-man raid roster

                            I've been trying to write a post the last few days to address the recent departures, cancelled raids, awol's etc. but it just turns into a rambling mess and doesn't really add much to the discussion. Instead, I'd like to thank the guild leadership for devoting the time to addressing the progression issue. I have no doubt it's a tough, often thankless, task; but I think I have to echo Tarenth's well articulated post.

                            It does seem to be a precarious situation at the moment and I think we have to adapt accordingly. I don't think anyone expects the sort of progression seen with the raiding guilds, but other casual guilds are making solid progress into SSC & Eye while we seem to be idle. The squad idea worked well initially to allow us to tackle Karazhan and we have 2 squads capable of clearing the instance. Now we have >20 people ready for 25mans and itching to make progress. Unfortunately, our other 2 squads had difficulty maintaining a solid, balanced roster and are still working through the content. A number of these people already meet the 25man requirements and are queued for Gruul's Lair, while others are approaching the requirements and will be needed for the guild's steady progression in the future as they get the gear & experience.

                            So what is the answer? While I understand that patience is a virtue, I don't think that is the answer at this point. We seem to be losing experienced and geared people primarily due to the lack of progress. I personally feel that we need to hit the 25mans with full force and focus. It seems to me we need 25+ people doing the 25mans ~3 nights a week. We can coordinate a continued Karazhan presence on the nights we lack the numbers for the scheduled 25man event and/or offnights. I'm not sure having 4 squads (40+ people) spending 2+ nights a week in karazhan is an efficient use of our resources at this point if 25man progression is the goal.
                            Last edited by Aeryck; 08-07-2007, 07:14 PM.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Questions on the 25-man raid roster

                              Please note, I'm well aware that I've pulled my main out of the guild (Due to my fluctuating Work schedule.. nothing else.) but I've put mountains of time into the whole 'Guild progression' thing... As luna, Orion, and Beep can tell you, that was my soap box for a long time... I wouldn't say that I was spearheading anything, but I definately worked towards the guild progressing in endgame for a vast majority of the time that I was in the guild.

                              Saying 'there are people not on the list who wish to go but can't' is somewhat silly because people who aren't on the list aren't there because they havn't been in contact with people enough to show enough interest in going.
                              No, it's not easy to say when you're not on the outside looking in... The officers have battled with each other... had hour long debates in teamspeak, and month long conversations in the officer forums about how best to make sure there WAS no outside.

                              That started in BWL. Some of you weren't here for THAT glorious phase of our end game adventure. We went in thinking it was MC. we learned quickly that it wasn't. Rotating rosters and undergeared/underskilled people dragged us down... But we refused to limit who could sign up. (we said we would, but in the end, just... didn't.)

                              But then TBC came along, and we all expected a fresh start. Then it turned out that Karazhan had a lock out, and the 25 man instances were hard.

                              And shortly after we started running Karazhan, we realized that our 'everybody in the pool' theory just wouldn't float. Consistancy became our power word... and after weeks of deliberation, the current Idea became the apparent answer to our problem.

                              Please, PLEASE realize that the officers worked as hard as they could to make this work. PLEASE realize that they had to deal with their real lives, as WELL as a complete lack of assistance from everybody in making this work. (Sajier busted his ass getting this off the ground, both before and after my schedule turned me into a sheep.)
                              And finally, Please realize that the officers are like salmon swimming up waterfalls of disdain and people crying foul because they can't raid. We've asked the guild how they want to raid, and if they'd be willing to put the effort in to hardcore raiding.
                              The astounding response? Silence from all but a few. The people in Defiant and Illidan were full of ideas.

                              The year I turned 18, some form of elections were going on the day after my birthday. I was kinda pumped to finally be able to vote... I'd studied up on the candidates. I knew the issues... I made my choice. When I went to vote, the candidate that I was going to vote for had removed himself from the ballot earler in the day due to some kind of family emergency.
                              I didn't vote, Even though there was another candidate who was a close approximation to my previous choice.
                              When I told my father that I hadn't voted because of that, He looked at me, and he said 'Colin, that's the worst crime against yourself that you can commit, for the simple reason that sometime, in the future, whoever wins this election will do something you don't like, and you won't be able to complain about it, because you'll know you did nothing at all to stop him from winning'

                              Granted, this guild isn't a democracy... But it's officers are all open to suggestions... and believe it or not, they've all got the guilds advancement in mind when they make decisions...

                              We used to avoid making an elite raiding team, because we wanted to be an inclusive guild, and we didn't want to lose the family feeling of the guild... everybody could raid, if they had a level 60.

                              Now, we realize that if we let everybody raid right away, we'll never actually progress.

                              With a core raiding group, (a group of individuals who are dedicated to the guild, and to the guilds progression.) blazing the path, TG will get places in the End Game community... Once it's started downing bosses, more people will want to join us.
                              Once more people join us, we'll be able to field more raids...

                              I wouldn't say that any of you have 'lost your chance to raid with your guild.' You've just been asked to wait while some people go first. If that rings in your ears as being horribly unfair, please, feel free to say so... but the people that are in the platoon right now have devoted HUGE amounts of time to the raiding aspect of this guild. Trust them to guide you through the first few rocky phases of end game raiding... Sajier and Gaviin are more than capable of taking the core group through those instances, (Assuming that people sign up and show up for the raids.)

                              And again... before anybody shoots back saying that I'm not in the guild anymore, so it's easy for me to say this... All I can say is to honestly ask the other officers about my commitment to Guild progression for the last year... I've only left the guild because my schedule essentially stops me from raiding on the weekends, and Legacy's weeday schedule is more in line with my availability. I'll always be a member of the TG community, no matter what my guild tag says.
                              _________________



                              I'm planning on respeccing to Irritation pretty soon. Granted, I'll lose the burst DPS from Pissing People Off Outright, but I'll get DoT's and higher damage through AoE's.

                              Comment

                              Connect

                              Collapse

                              TeamSpeak 3 Server

                              Collapse

                              Advertisement

                              Collapse

                              Twitter Feed

                              Collapse

                              Working...
                              X