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State of ArmA Address - Discussion

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  • State of ArmA Address - Discussion

    Thank you Mimir for outlining the road ahead. I'm excited for the future of ARMA at Tactical Gamer.
    sigpic
    |TG-1st|Grunt
    ARMA Admin (retired)
    Pathfinder-Spartan 5

  • #2
    Re: State of ArmA Address

    Hey count me in any change that can make this community more tight night is okay on my books

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    • #3
      Re: State of ArmA Address

      Nice, when's the next seagull action? :)

      TGU Instructor · TG Pathfinder

      Former TGU Dean · Former ARMA Admin · Former Irregulars Officer

      "Do not seek death. Death will find you. But seek the road which makes death a fulfillment." - Dag Hammarskjold

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      • #4
        Re: State of ArmA Address

        Great post, I like the direction this is going :)

        When there's no one around to do the mentoring, can I be one of those cool, laid-back substitute teachers who just puts on a film for the class?

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        • #5
          Re: State of ArmA Address

          Excellent stuff. Really excited for A3 and where the TG community takes it.
          sigpic

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          • #6
            Re: State of ArmA Address

            Good read. I like hearing “hardcore sim”, lets see where it takes TG and the Arma tittle!






            "TG was created to cater to a VERY specific type of gamer rather than trying to appeal to the greater gaming population....Tactical Gamer is not mainstream. We are not trying to attract mainstream gamers" ~ Apophis

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            • #7
              Re: State of ArmA Address

              Originally posted by Mimir View Post
              Over the past 7 years we have explored various different gameplays and styles that seem to have evolved over time. Some of it was based off necessity, some of it was based of the interest of the community. With ArmA III, we will be stripping away some of the things that we offer and making the servers vanilla for the immediate future. We will not host MODs or persistent play on the servers.
              My primary concern, is there seems to be a resistance towards mods. I totally get the idea of running on vanilla for a while at first (showcasing what vanilla has to offer, make it easier for new people to join, etc.). But this, to me, seems like a contradiction to "hardcore sim". If the idea is to be as realistic as possible while still being fun, then why would we want to (for example) use the default voip system over ACRE? not to mention the medic/wounds system as it is in it's current state. With the exclusive Steam game, it seams that adding mods will be very easy, so even for new people there shouldn't be a problem. So I guess I would just like to know why there is no plans for using mods? Along with that, does this include server-side mods/plugins?

              It appears, that you'll also be ..."stripping away some of the things that we offer," is this for server stability or what is the idea behind simplifying what we do?


              Originally posted by Mimir View Post
              Another aspect we will be instituting will be strict penalties for dying, i.e. you’re a seagull. In simulation/real life there is no such thing as respawns, this is not a FPS and it will not be run as such. This will be a change from the some people’s mentality, but in time it will create a much closer team that is very deliberate and disciplined in the way it executes its missions. We understand there are the times where you get the lucky stray bullet from the AI, so we are looking into those solutions. We also want to control the JIP (Join In Progress). Someone spawning in the middle of a mission can be a distractor, however we also have to cater to the people that are not simply waiting around for a game to start. Through the use of AI slots only, will JIP be possible. Otherwise you will have to wait a few minutes or jump on the second server.
              My two cents on this: I agree with you 90% on no respawning. Again however, in it's current state, the AI are crackshots and it's incredibly easy to die (even when you're using proper cover). Maybe I'm getting too specific about things here, but it does concern me that there will probably be a lot of DC's if people play 10 minutes get shot, then wait around 50 minutes to play a game again. I for one will not set aside my time to watch my screen for 50 minutes just to see if the mission ends of if I get revived.

              Originally posted by Mimir View Post
              Hopefully some of what I addressed is not a shock to anyone, it falls directly incline with the TG Primer. The title has and continues to evolve, as does TG. The intentions with ArmA III is to showcase the teamwork and maturity to the gaming world with what we have here at TG. I look forward to seeing everyone in game…
              Overall, I am excited to see this big push for hard-core game-play and higher lever of teamwork. And other than my personal opinions I find A3 in it's vanilla state, still very enjoyable. My comments above are just my 2 primary concerns. I know that you have already put a lot of thought into this, so please don't take my thoughts as criticism, but rather as concerned consumer input. We all want to see A3 succeed here, and I would like to thank you again for all the work you admin folks are willing to put into this to make it work well for the most people possible.

              Thank you,
              Shoom

              ribbons_volunteer-class1.jpg
              "WARNING: Don't let me throw frags!"

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              • #8
                Re: State of ArmA Address

                100% agree with Shoomfie! Also strange for me to see marks on teammates in "simulation/real life".

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                • #9
                  Re: State of ArmA Address

                  Just to add something about realism, remember the term we use here is "...utilizing real-world combat strategy and tactics...". Mods don't make realism in tactics....tactics do. I know it maybe seems like a dumb way of saying it but let me try another way. To one way of thinking, putting all these flowery models on top of our game, adding a couple more keyboards worth of controls, communications protocols that can sometimes get in the way of the message...these things aren't tactics. In some respects they can sometimes put another layer between the players and getting straight to the tactics and playing the game.

                  So while everybody loves extra content, think of it this way as well, Arma 3 isn't even released yet. We don't have a firm date when it will be. When it is released, we will be looking to play it as it is for a good long time. If we decide that something isn't working for TG then we will address it. But we are a long way off from presuming what we need to tweak of a game that is not even out.

                  I know it's difficult for those who have gotten so used to the mod content for A2. However, TG administration will take the title forward the way our core values direct us....based on the actual facts of the game. It's just frankly foolish for the admin team to speculate how this will unfold. The one thing we know is, that stripping back to the core means the only thing left is our core values & behaviors. This will get dealt with first and we build from there on a solid foundation.

                  Now who knows what the long term future will hold? We may decide one day that we need some flowery models, another set of alt-shift controls...we may need a knife mod...maybe a warp gate mod. Dunno. This player hopes that we won't need anything and can enjoy the even level community of a vanilla game again for a while. That is the place to start anywho.
                  |TG-189th| Unkl
                  ArmA 3 Game Officer
                  Dean of Tactical Gamer University
                  189th Infantry Brigade Member
                  SUBMIT A RIBBON NOMINATION OR CONTACT AN ARMA ADMIN
                  "We quickly advance in the opposite direction and take cover in a house on the SW side of town." - BadStache

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                  • #10
                    Re: State of ArmA Address

                    .maybe a warp gate mod.
                    Chalenge Accepted




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                    • #11
                      Re: State of ArmA Address

                      One of my most favorite places in TG to play was the Arma 2 alpha server, that has now been replaced (for me) by the Arma 3 vanilla server. I was brought up on the small Spec Ops missions made by Black Dog 1 when I was with the TG-22nd RRR, teamwork and tactics on vanilla Arma, fast and fun. I like what I hear and read about the direction for Arma 3 here at TG, my thanks to the GO and admins.

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                      • #12
                        Re: State of ArmA Address

                        One of my favorite places at TG was and is TG arma2 Bravo server.

                        Why not just do as you did with Arma2 ?

                        Once the game is out of beta, run two servers one Vanilla.
                        One running no 3rd, no markers and with @ACRE and @ACE. (if they are both available at that time)


                        That way you cater for both styles and preferences.
                        The path of my life is strewn with cowpats from the devil's own satanic herd.

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                        • #13
                          Re: State of ArmA Address

                          Many great points brought up here. The one point that is a little concerning has to do with the no respawn option. I was playing with some TG guys yesterday on the server and one of the missions had a 5 minute respawn timer after you die. I know 5 minutes doesn't seem like a long time, but when you are sitting there staring at the screen as the timer counts down it is frustrating. Yes, I understand the TG way. I played Arma at TG when if first came out, as well as BF2.

                          I realize Arma 3 is in its infancy, but I don't want possible players to become disinterested in the game here at TG and go elsewhere because of the no respawn option. Right now TG is the BEST place to play ARMA 3, let's work together to keep it that way.

                          Chappie

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                          • #14
                            Re: State of ArmA Address

                            For the concerns about waiting and staring at a screen to know when to play again....I believe it was stated that there is a "waiting room" to move into to sit and idle until a mission is over. ALT-TAB out and surf internet and wait to here that a new mission is being selected....seems straight forward to me and an easy solution.

                            I can handle a "no ACRE" and vanilla server to begin, but I also would like to state that people make a bigger deal out of mods than really needs to be. Currently with A2, we have 6updater that is that one-click solution some have been looking for, if a mod is a different color, update, if not join. This game is so different than any other that TG hosts in what it can offer the player base. Admins have done a good job in the past with balancing what the community wants to what is good for server stability. Shiny toys are nice, but just that toys. I would love to see us get back to hardcore no respawn stuff like what the 22nd offered in some of their missions.






                            "TG was created to cater to a VERY specific type of gamer rather than trying to appeal to the greater gaming population....Tactical Gamer is not mainstream. We are not trying to attract mainstream gamers" ~ Apophis

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                            • #15
                              Re: State of ArmA Address

                              I agree with what BL1P is saying about having both a Vanilla and modded server on full release or soon after. I really enjoy playing with the mods on the Bravo server in A2. Take ACE for example, because of ACE wounds when you are shot your down but not out and a team mate can revive you and get you back in the game. Its the same in A3 but with ACE there is a whole different process that takes longer. This means you must get the casualty to a safe place and revive him there while your teammates hold security. Or if you cant heal the casualty fully he will have to be MEDEVACed out to be fully healed at base. This allows people to learn and practice new tactics of that using Vanilla would not be used as often. Other things ACE adds is new things to do (as you would expect from a mod but here me out) Take artillery for example. I very much so enjoy doing it. Preping shells, setting up, handling coms I love it. And it takes skill as you have to aim it, range your target, use your range tables and make accurate adjustments from a forward observer. But in A3 its as simple as click and shoot which is disappointing.

                              Another mod I really like and miss in A3 is ACRE. First the actual advantages it gives 1( more layers of communication e.g. more radio channels 2( What I feel is better direct communication. These are things we can live without, But the reason I really like it is the button you use to speak on the radio. It has a distinguished noise when you start and end transmissions and when someone speaks it has a crackle to it.( now I know what your thinking "wow noises, because we cant live without noises) With ACRE I wont have conversation with the person next to me over the short ranged radio (which in a infantry squad would be the same as talking in group chat.) I've seen it countless times before when on vanilla I'm hearing half a conversation over side channel because someone doesn't realize there using it and the other is using direct chat. With ACRE that noise reminds people that your talking to everyone on that radio net not just the people in earshot. And the crackle over someones voice tells you if there talking over the radio or if there right beside you.

                              Thats what I think about mods and why I think they add to the overall experience of Arma. When A3 is fully released I hope there is a modded server and a vanilla server like we have now for A2 to cater for people who like mods and people who prefer vanilla But that aside I'm looking forward to the future of TG Arma here.
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