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  • Will 1.05 address ram use and HD thrashing?

    I have been reading several different forums and threads about Arma2 performance issues and it seems it comes down to 1 or 2 basic problems.

    1. The game does not fully utilize ram resources--hence the suggestion to create a ram drive with unused ram

    2. As a result of not fully exploiting ram resources, the game is forced to excessively thrash the HD which is slow by default--hence the suggestion to move the game on to a SDD.

    According to my understanding then, does anyone know if BIS plans to fix ARMA2 so that it can more fully utilize available ram?

    I would hate to invest $$ in an SSD just for one game, only to find that the patch correct some underlying design flaws.

    Besides I have my eye on a series 5000 ATI card.

    My current rig:

    i7 core Oc'd to 3.4
    6gb ram
    ATI 4870 1 gb ddr5
    Raid 0 1 tb.

  • #2
    Re: Will 1.05 address ram use and HD thrashing?

    You can make sure that arma2 uses all the ram with the -maxmem=2047 command, but unless BI releases a 64 bit exe it's impossible to make use of more then those 2 Gb.
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    • #3
      Re: Will 1.05 address ram use and HD thrashing?

      I think what he's saying, and he is correct to say, is that Arma2 doesn't even fully use those 2GB. It usually only uses 700MB. Even when it holds the 2GB it doesn't really utilize it all. Really poor.

      Because it does a poor job of "remembering" things (caching to RAM) it needs to hit the hard drive way too often, which is why the hard drive ends up being such a limitation. If Arma2 properly used more RAM, possibly even doing "look aheads" when it has idle read time and caching it to RAM, then it wouldn't stutter when it tries to load large textures on the fly... well, in theory.

      Are they patching it? Who knows. There is a bug open at dev-heaven with lots of votes to make it priority, but it has been open for a long time and is stuck at "50% complete" with no release "target version" set. I wouldn't hold my breath.

      http://dev-heaven.net/issues/show/1745

      That ATI 5000 won't help your Arma2 game much if your HDD is gimping you.

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      • #4
        Re: Will 1.05 address ram use and HD thrashing?

        Originally posted by 1longtime View Post
        I think what he's saying, and he is correct to say, is that Arma2 doesn't even fully use those 2GB. It usually only uses 700MB. Even when it holds the 2GB it doesn't really utilize it all. Really poor.

        Because it does a poor job of "remembering" things (caching to RAM) it needs to hit the hard drive way too often, which is why the hard drive ends up being such a limitation. If Arma2 properly used more RAM, possibly even doing "look aheads" when it has idle read time and caching it to RAM, then it wouldn't stutter when it tries to load large textures on the fly... well, in theory.

        Are they patching it? Who knows. There is a bug open at dev-heaven with lots of votes to make it priority, but it has been open for a long time and is stuck at "50% complete" with no release "target version" set. I wouldn't hold my breath.

        http://dev-heaven.net/issues/show/1745

        That ATI 5000 won't help your Arma2 game much if your HDD is gimping you.
        Yes longtime, you understood me correctly except I didn't realize that Arma's ram utilization was that poor. I thought it could actively use 2gb, but only 700!

        Wouldn't this be any easy fix either by improving ram caching as you say, or by including a sub program that converts available ram into a flash drive ala the ramdisk fix that has been used with success.

        One thing that I have noticed is that when I turn down the graphics settings, the game runs smoother, but the texture draws also really slow down. And so it is trade off between smooth movement (better FPS basically) versus quick texture initialization.

        I think I will wait for 1.05 and then reassess my SSD options. Anyone know if they have the same issue for VSB2?

        On a side note, doesn't it bug you that you spend $$$ for a top notch machine, only to have Barney Rubble coding the games. :)

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        • #5
          Re: Will 1.05 address ram use and HD thrashing?

          I think VBS2 runs on Arma1, and it doesn't have the same problems because it isn't challenging hardware in the same way. On one hand, I have to respect a dev team that can stretch modern hardware to its limit... and on the other hand, it bothered me for weeks trying to get the game to play correctly until I spent $300 on an SSD. But I will say this: the SSD did fix my issue, and my otherwise strong machine can now really use its muscle. It should just say in the recommended system requirements: "a ridiculous video card, a nuclear powered CPU, and an SSD."

          The RAM disk is actually an option. If you have LOTS of extra RAM you can put the entire Arma2 directory into RAM and it will be unbelievably fast. If you just have a few extra gigs, you can just put the most commonly used PBOs on a RAM disk (and re-copy it every time you turn off the computer). Check the BIS forums, there are people doing it. I never tried it, but I've heard it works.

          I really don't think the lookahead cache is as easy as it seems or surely they would have done it by now...

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          • #6
            Re: Will 1.05 address ram use and HD thrashing?

            Ive got an Intel core 2 6700 at 2.66GHZ
            4GB Ram
            1 GB GeForce 8800 GTX

            I cant play single player. Multiplayer is fine except for a few issues here and there but single player is like a slide show.
            Seeing as i couldnt sleep last night (its now 07:56...early for the unemployed :p ) i just rolled out there a min ago and am finally getting around to burning my Win7 64bit ISO.
            Fingers crossed for performance boost :D
            Nihility

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Will 1.05 address ram use and HD thrashing?

              Originally posted by Tobruk View Post
              I have been reading several different forums and threads about Arma2 performance issues and it seems it comes down to 1 or 2 basic problems.

              1. The game does not fully utilize ram resources--hence the suggestion to create a ram drive with unused ram

              2. As a result of not fully exploiting ram resources, the game is forced to excessively thrash the HD which is slow by default--hence the suggestion to move the game on to a SDD.

              According to my understanding then, does anyone know if BIS plans to fix ARMA2 so that it can more fully utilize available ram?

              I would hate to invest $$ in an SSD just for one game, only to find that the patch correct some underlying design flaws.

              Besides I have my eye on a series 5000 ATI card.

              My current rig:

              i7 core Oc'd to 3.4
              6gb ram
              ATI 4870 1 gb ddr5
              Raid 0 1 tb.
              Dunno...we'll apparently SOON FIND OUT *)
              games.tiscali.cz got information from BIS !
              ArmA 2 patch 1.05 will come at 15:00.
              "It doesn't take a hero to order men into battle. It takes a hero to be one of those men who goes into battle."
              "To show you what a difference retirement makes. Last year when I gave an order, 541,000 men and women jumped," he explained. "Now I can't even get the plumber to come over."
              Norman Schwarzkopf

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              • #8
                Re: Will 1.05 address ram use and HD thrashing?

                How would you go about putting Arma2 on RAM? I have A LOT of RAM. At least I think I do. I have 9GB on my system.
                |TG-X|Turkish

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                • #9
                  Re: Will 1.05 address ram use and HD thrashing?

                  Originally posted by TurkishDelight View Post
                  How would you go about putting Arma2 on RAM? I have A LOT of RAM. At least I think I do. I have 9GB on my system.
                  Check out the BIS forums or armaholics.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Will 1.05 address ram use and HD thrashing?

                    Link would be helpful. Also for those using 1.05 is the apparent performance boost noticable?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Will 1.05 address ram use and HD thrashing?

                      Originally posted by Soupy_Norman View Post
                      Ive got an Intel core 2 6700 at 2.66GHZ
                      4GB Ram
                      1 GB GeForce 8800 GTX

                      I cant play single player. Multiplayer is fine except for a few issues here and there but single player is like a slide show.
                      Seeing as i couldnt sleep last night (its now 07:56...early for the unemployed :p ) i just rolled out there a min ago and am finally getting around to burning my Win7 64bit ISO.
                      Fingers crossed for performance boost :D
                      Yea, I have a quad core 6600 2.4ghz
                      6gb Ram
                      and a 756mb 8800 card.

                      Single player is unplayable for me too, 5 fps.

                      Multiplayer is amazing, and perfect, and the editor gives me well over 100fps anywhere.

                      So it clearly is the AI routines being calculated for ALL AI on the entire island all at once in singleplayer mode.

                      The Only way I can see around that, is if BI was to add code that only calculates AI functions within a set radius around the player. Say any AI within 1km will do its job like normal. Any AI outside of that gets its routine updated once every minute or so.

                      That would cut down on the calculations in single player GREATLY and make the game playable.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Will 1.05 address ram use and HD thrashing?

                        Originally posted by TurkishDelight View Post
                        How would you go about putting Arma2 on RAM? I have A LOT of RAM. At least I think I do. I have 9GB on my system.
                        Not sure if this is what they are talking about:

                        Gigabyte's i-RAM storage device



                        .

                        LINKS

                        * *


                        Stoop and you'll be stepped on; stand tall and you'll be shot at.

                        -Carlos A. Urbizo-

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Will 1.05 address ram use and HD thrashing?

                          Originally posted by Jeepo_SAS View Post
                          Link would be helpful. Also for those using 1.05 is the apparent performance boost noticable?
                          Sorry, I was too excited about down loading 1.05 to search for the linke.

                          Here is a link that explains the Ram Disk approach:

                          http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?t=88388

                          After some testing with 1.05, I can attest that my HD is still thrashing enormously during the benchmark scenarios.

                          Any recommendations on an SSD?
                          Last edited by Tobruk; 12-22-2009, 10:15 PM. Reason: Post 1.05 update

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Will 1.05 address ram use and HD thrashing?

                            I have the 64 Gb OCZ Agility. It's pretty fast and you can usually find it for around $200. If you really watch the deals you can get it for like $170 like I did.


                            TG-18th 18th SF Operational Detachment Delta

                            If you're playing the game, be in the correct TeamSpeak Channel.

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                            • #15
                              Re: Will 1.05 address ram use and HD thrashing?

                              Originally posted by Tobruk View Post
                              Sorry, I was too excited about down loading 1.05 to search for the linke.

                              Here is a link that explains the Ram Disk approach:

                              http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?t=88388

                              After some testing with 1.05, I can attest that my HD is still thrashing enormously during the benchmark scenarios.

                              Any recommendations on an SSD?
                              Just make sure it has a cache. 64MB preferred.

                              Comment

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