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  • Official TG vs. 9th AAR thread.

    Post your thoughts, comments, highlights, videos, war stories, and other random things. Keep it clean, keep it civil.

  • #2
    Re: Official TG vs. 9th AAR thread.

    I'd like to thank all of you for participating in todays event, especially those that stuck it out to the bitter end.

    By the end we had a technical loss with a flag 9BLUFOR:2OPFOR, but those of you that scouted the map know that we were fighting an uphill battle from the very start, and I think everyone did a great job. We really won by not allowing them to capture all the flags despite our disadvantage. Also, we lost several people to stability. By the last 45 min we were fighting 20-30 and still holding.

    There's been alot of discussion about how unbalanced this map is, and most of you are right. Yes, they had the advantage on almost every aspect of the battle, most importantly proximity to the flags. Lets leave it at that and not fret over the disparity. We did the best we could in a bad situation. If thats not a battle simulation, I don't know what is.

    Squad leaders, thank you for your help commanding.
    Squad members, thank you for holding fast despite the disorganization and fog of war.
    Air, your transport was vital and your AA/AT assistance kept them from completely overwhelming bagango as they should have.

    I'm beat and not up for creating a detailed AAR at the moment. Don't let that stop you from sharing your battle stories. Highs, lows, anything. If it got your heart racing, lets hear about it. Sls, let us know what happened to your squad throughout the battle.

    Well done everyone and thanks again for your participation.

    On the 3rd Wed of November there will be a replay of this battle, with us on the BLUFOR side. I'll have a new post up within a few days as we organize that event. This was an excellent practice for our upcoming victory as the US. I'm sure you're all eager to let them know how huge our disadvantage was. We'll do this by completely sweeping them.
    |TG|Switch

    Better known as:
    That noob who crashed the chopper.
    That noob who ran over the mine.
    That noob who TK'd me with a sniper rifle.
    That noob who hit that APC at 300m with light AT! Our APC...

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Official TG vs. 9th AAR thread.

      i had alot of fun participating, however having experienced the battle from the armor role i noticed a big problem. AIR! armor has no chance against air. plain and simple anytime the armor rolled out we just got whored by an A10 or a cobra. I know we tried moving through tree cover and hill cover and to no avail missle's still rained down on us. I think that to make that map fair you need alot more stingers and strela's. i saw that one A-10 pilot go to about 50 points inside of 5 minuites into the game. that tells you something right there.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Official TG vs. 9th AAR thread.

        Despite the strong and much appreciated efforts of Switch and others, this event had numerous issues, beginning with a nasty server capacity glitch. I can't blame anyone or anything on servers bending, or having to wait for teams to sort out and get into positions, but I can say that it doesn't help to have 90 minutes of delay on an event like this. Once started, the gameplay was air-dominated. It became difficult to do much. I had a single kill, as I was holed up in a burned out building some poor soul happened to come by. Other than that, all I saw was bombings.

        My other major dislike here is veteran mode in TVT. I've spoken out against veteran mode before (or whatever is preventing us from viewing friendly tags, locataions and markers), but I simply can't enjoy the game when my situational awareness of my own team is nil. Yes, it is challenging to try to memorize the faces of your squad and remember who is who, but in the limited time I have for gaming every week, I can't say I feel as though I have time for this, and I honestly don't enjoy it. At this point I am not really interested in participating in events that don't employ friendly tags and markers at least in some capacity.

        Lastly, I was discouraged to see the lack of discipline among the TG ranks - team killing during the pre-game and far too much unecessary chat (not to mention slurs and language offenses). Immature behavior cheapens the game for other players.

        +rep for Switch and my squad leader Grunt, who put up with tons of radio chatter and still managed to run the show.
        It's great to see so many people trying to make this happen, though. Armed Assault is truly an amazing game, but unfortunately has a long way to go before seamless, functional TVT becomes a reality.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Official TG vs. 9th AAR thread.

          Air Superiority is where Sim vs. Game comes into play. Most modern military action follows a period of establishing Air Superiority. This allows the exact situation to happen as described. While in a true game like BF2 air can be negated, the sim nature of ArmA leaves air power at full strength with is just stifling. Unlike games where ground based AA is usually enough, ArmA would need actual air craft to provide thorough anti-air capabilities. It would be interesting to take this AAR and map and try to add some assets to equal out the air power.
          |TG-12th| tHa_KhAn

          XBL GT: Khan58

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Official TG vs. 9th AAR thread.

            it isnt really air superiority, its more like not having the effective tools to combat the air assets in the game. and with the very simple point and click lock on targeting of all the aircraft its really not that hard to just whore a whole column of armor. with no types of countermeasures it really becomes a battle of who can lock on first , land, and repeat the process.

            *edit* and it also becomes a battle of who can jack up their view distance to get the longest range lock.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Official TG vs. 9th AAR thread.

              Well heres a run down of what I experienced in the armor squad.
              Our squad leader was HM3 Wilson, from the 31MEU
              Squad members to start were Insanitrix, myself, HR Gates (also from 31MEU) and Angel of Death.

              Our resources were two T72's, two shilkas and two BRDM-ATGM. There was also one strela with one missile in a Ural for us to use.

              Our first goal was to set up the one of the AA and both tanks in between Mercalilo and Obregan in a hull down position near an intersecting road for a possible ambush. But the wide open ground to get there made us easy targets for the jet, A10 and cobra.

              Not too far into the match HR Gates was having computer issues and had to leave. Putting us down to four. To his credit Angel of Death was having some success with a shilka against air mid game. And we did manage as a squad to down the a-10, and jet several times as they came in on runs. The cobra would come in high and at range for its guided missiles and proved hard to engage.

              We did what we could to support squad two on it's attacks on Mercalilo. Although we lacked a decent route to it, having to climb hills to reach it left us slow and in the open, the longer route forced us to cover too much open ground. The Forward Base being fair game left us lined up for missile runs and what not and we were neutralized for the majority of the round pretty effectively. So props to the 9th air for that. I'm sure we'd do the same to make sure the armor played a minimal role.

              Near the end of the match I was able to get a tank into Mercalilo and capture it several times shortly but, we lacked troops to occupy and clear the area to hold it for very long. They were also able to their get hands on one of the T72's and use it for a bit to defend Mercalilo towards the end of the match.

              As far as I saw they did not bring up any of their vehicles, tanks or other wise. At least in the limited area I dealt with.

              I can't say I was surprised by what happened. Without superior air power, armor is not going to fare well. Thanks to HM3 Wilson for leading the armor squad, and the 31MEU in general for providing good people, hopefully some of them come over and visit us on our servers. And thanks to Angel of Death for sticking it out with me to the bitter end;)
              Last edited by Squinty; 10-18-2007, 01:19 PM. Reason: fixed typo.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Official TG vs. 9th AAR thread.

                From Grunt:

                I had a lot of fun last night and I'd like to thank Switch for doing his best to command and for doing his best herding the cats to get this event up and running. The start time was late for some and I lost several squad numbers due to the late hour. ( I wonder if we could get it done earlier in the future?

                I was charged with operating 1st squad. As the biggest squad we were assigned initially to defend Obregan. To coin a cliche I'd say our initial deployment was a prime example how the best laid plans can lay waste to both mice and men. It was a classic example of careful and precise planning went all for naught. Nothing happened as we sripted it. We paradropped NE of Obregan to find a sizable enemy force had arrived and was defending the city vigorously. The paradrop scattered us to hell and gone and we arrived at the rally point in pieces . Quite honestly this destroyed our combat efficiency as a unit. (my fault) Several members held out to the last but the enemy finally overwhelmed all of us and we reassembled in Pita for redeployment.

                1st Squad boarded a transport (transport was jonny on the spot, by the way, thoughout the battle--kudos to the 31st MEU pilots) and began making our way back to Obregan. I believe the enemy took Mercalillo while we were enroute and Switch immediately reassigned us to defend Bagango.

                The fighting intesified in Mercalillo with the flag seesawing back and forth between east and west. Meanwhile we took up excellent defensive positions in the buildings in and around the city. Hawkeye made good use of his Strella launcher while the rest of the team fought off isolated probing attacks. At one point we were surrounded and fought off the enemy as they attempted to root us out of the second floor of a building right next to the flag. This was very exciting as we had terrific room by room combat . It was pretty hairy but we held for a long time and we piled up a bunch of enemy dead.

                With 20 minutes or so left on the game timer we received orders to assemble up N of Bagango for transport to reinforce Mercalillo. As we assembled the enemy made a push again for Bagango from the North and East. Fighting tilted both ways but we contined to beat them off until the very last 3 or 4 minutes. They must've made a team wide push for Bagango because enemy strength increased markedly. By this time we were down to 4 members in 1st Squad and though we had been reinfoced a little bit earlier we were basically plugging our holes in the dike...eventually succumbing to the enemy and losing flag for good just before the round ended.

                The most memorable part of the battle for me was the close quarter combat in the houses of Bagango. Grenades and M203's were flying around everywhere and there seemed to be an enemy around every corner or in every stairway. 1st squad took out ~ 10 enemies during this action and I think we prevented the US from steamrolling over Bagango and taking the rest of the map. I spent most of my time directing the men and communicating with command and other elements. I ended up with only 2 or 3 kills but had a most satisfying and immersive experience.

                My most memorable kill is amusing: In the waning moments of the battle, as the enemy was increasing their attack on Bagango, I spotted Switch (dressed in the officer suit) run by about 50 meters in front of me. I confirmed his location by radio and followed him in from the N side of the City. he disappeared around the corner and shots rang out as he was ambushed by an enemy trooper. I popped around the corner, sighted the enemy rifling his body, went into a crouch and delivered a fatal headshot to Switch's killer about 30 meters away. Sweet revenge. From there I moved to the flag and while suppressing the enemy in the flag compound I was ambushed myself. The enemy held on to the flag and the round ended shortly after. Very, very fun.

                Organization was much better than the last time. Were were late getting started but only by 20 minutes or so. The TG server couldn't handle the load and shortly after starting we were delayed even when we had to switch en mass to the 9th's server. If it hadn't been for that I don't think we would've lost so many people during the late stages of the battle.

                T Vs T is exciting. Fighting is dynamic and unpredicatable. I froze on our initial deployement into Obregan--didn't know what to do as we were all scattered and the enemy was overrunning us. I should've ordered a withdrawal but lesson learned on my end. In the future if we stick with this format I'll practice squad level paradrops to make our deployment more effective.

                All in all I had a blast. Thanks again to everyone involved and especially the 9th and the 31st...Great teaming up with other like minded communities

                Anyway, I'd also like to thank Mosely, Ivan, Curt, Hawkeye, Protoman, Agnew and Nikolai. They all did a fine job following orders to the best of their ability and in the end I'd say we performed well as a squad. Some of the members were pining to go on the offensive and help out at Mercalillo but in the end held their defensive positions admirably, even though it was slow at times.

                Good games guys.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Official TG vs. 9th AAR thread.

                  Originally posted by AMosely View Post
                  Despite the strong and much appreciated efforts of Switch and others, this event had numerous issues, beginning with a nasty server capacity glitch. I can't blame anyone or anything on servers bending, or having to wait for teams to sort out and get into positions, but I can say that it doesn't help to have 90 minutes of delay on an event like this. Once started, the gameplay was air-dominated. It became difficult to do much. I had a single kill, as I was holed up in a burned out building some poor soul happened to come by. Other than that, all I saw was bombings.

                  My other major dislike here is veteran mode in TVT. I've spoken out against veteran mode before (or whatever is preventing us from viewing friendly tags, locataions and markers), but I simply can't enjoy the game when my situational awareness of my own team is nil. Yes, it is challenging to try to memorize the faces of your squad and remember who is who, but in the limited time I have for gaming every week, I can't say I feel as though I have time for this, and I honestly don't enjoy it. At this point I am not really interested in participating in events that don't employ friendly tags and markers at least in some capacity.

                  Lastly, I was discouraged to see the lack of discipline among the TG ranks - team killing during the pre-game and far too much unecessary chat (not to mention slurs and language offenses). Immature behavior cheapens the game for other players.

                  +rep for Switch and my squad leader Grunt, who put up with tons of radio chatter and still managed to run the show.
                  It's great to see so many people trying to make this happen, though. Armed Assault is truly an amazing game, but unfortunately has a long way to go before seamless, functional TVT becomes a reality.

                  Mose--we missed your MG after you had to go. After many minutes of unexciting defense the action finally picked up--right after you had to go unfortunately. Suddenly we went from watching the air power duke it out to exciting cqb.


                  Mose makes a good point on vet mode. What's driving the necessity for this and can we amend it or atleast switch off every other time.

                  Mose also makes a good point on pregame tom foolery and on the discipline on radio comms. These are supposed to be TG SOP's guys.
                  sigpic
                  |TG-1st|Grunt
                  ARMA Admin (retired)
                  Pathfinder-Spartan 5

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Official TG vs. 9th AAR thread.

                    Perhaps I can illuminate a bit of the overarching picture of the battle, given I spent most of the match listening to radio communications and having a view of what the enemy's strategy.

                    I was tasked with the Scout position, which Switch had defined as existing to provide spot reports on outgoing air assets from the enemy airbase and troop/armor movements through Corazol.

                    When the missions began, I collected an SVD Dragunov and a Streya launcher from the ammo boxes/truck and then set off in my MH-6 towards my pre-selected overwatch position (the hills west of Corazol, which is the central "chokepoint" city separating North and South Sahrani). It took my a good 5 - 7 minutes to travel from the eastern side of the map to the western side as I had to both avoid an A-10 that began snooping in my direction and travel far south of the Western controlled cities on the beaches of South Sahrani.

                    I headed inland, cutting in between the airfield and the first of their controlled cities while flying as close to nap-of-the-earth as possible to avoid any possible detection. I landed hastily at the eastern-most outskirts of Paraiso and made my way up into the hills to my overwatch position. During my short movement I recieved an opportunity to fire on a Harrier leaving the airfield, which I took. To be honest, I had never fired upon an enemy aircraft in TvT, so I after firing I was unsure if I had shot the plane down as I recieved no "Gillespie killed Whoever" message. However, I saw a "Harrier down" message in team chat shortly after the missile was away, and Switch informed me that you usually don't get a kill message because infantry-borne anti-air assets rarely one-shot enemy aircraft. So, Harrier down... however, that was my one and only Streya missile, so no more shooting down aircraft; a resupply would have been impractical and dangerous, given how far behind the frontline I was. Taking that into account, I never even bothered requesting such a thing.

                    For the 50 minutes or so, I sun-bathed in the prone on my little overwatch hill, sending up spot reports to Command for any enemy assets I witnessed traveling to the frontline. I kept my eyes peeled to the south for any armored columns, but the enemy seemed to be relying on an air-mobile strategy. The front was simply too far away for armor to be a feasible and/or sensible option for BLUFOR. I was also having trouble giving precise spot reports since the map had a hardcoded visibility of approximately 2000 meters, which left the air lane that the enemy used (to my north) obscured in a fog line. I proceeded to change my position multiple times to achieve a better eyes on, but needing to have a line of sight to the south limited my options. As such, the best I could do was send up half-assed "Command, Scout, currently hearing audio on an enemy aircraft leaving their airbase... headed northeasterly or thereabouts" reports.

                    After lying around for a while, listening to all the other guys getting hammered, I recieved a FRAGO from Command. Switch confessed that I wasn't really doing a whole lot of good there now because it didn't seem like our team would ever be able to push that far west. As such, he ordered me to provide recon on their forward base to check and see any possible activity there. After a 5 - 10 minute movement overland (my damn Little Bird respawned on me, leaving me effectively standed behind enemy lines), I achieved eyes on the forward base; it was, as I suspected, completely deserted. Switch ordered me to satchel/mine everything. After helping myself to their Stinger launchers, I proceeded to place satchel charges on all the vehicles in the base (Ammo/repair/fuel truck, 2 Abrams, 1 ATGM Stryker, 1 M2 Stryker, 2 M113 Vulcans, and 3 transport 5 tons). Leaving all the satchel charges on 30 minute timers, I headed towards Obregan as per Switch's command.

                    It was going to be a LONG walk. Luckily, as I passed Dolores (the city with the waterways, I believe) I spotted a Humvee headed south on the road. Diving into cover, the driver passed me without noticeable detection. After this, Command informed me that the cities DID have civilian vehicles. Moving back south to get a civvie vehicle, I noticed an Abrams speeding up the road. I was far off in the hills, so he passed without noticing me at all (seconds later he was destroyed by our anti-tank SU-34. That constituted the ONE and ONLY time the enemy ever attempted to bring armor to the front). Somehow that Abrams driver left his Humvee in the city, so now I had wheels. I jumped in, gave the Air Element a warning that the Scout had appropriated an enemy vehicle and not to frag me, and sped off towards Hill 181 (located just south of Obregan).

                    After a short movement, I planted myself on top of Hill 181 and began sending new spot reports on enemy activity in Obregan (seemed to be a small infantry squad with UH-60 Blackhawk support). I noticed the UH-60 headed off to the east and paid no further attention to it - until, seconds later, it came up over the top of Hill 181, nearly level with me and stared me in the face! I took the opportunity to take shots into the cockpit, attempting to kill the pilot. *Just* as the pilot realized the danger and turned to head away, I landed a shot in the side of his head, killing him and sending the Blackhawk spinning downhill. I informed Command of my actions and immediately left my position; the infantry squad down in the city spotted me as I began my displacement and began taking well-aimed shots. I started juking left and right in hopes of avoiding their rifle fire (shots were popping all around my feet!) and luckily I escaped. I continued downhill on the south side, jumped into my Humvee and headed about 300m west.

                    About 60 seconds later, the Blackhawk shows back up with an AH-1Z Cobra in tow. I proceed to watch the Cobra blanket the top of Hill 181 with intense rocket fire. After expending its ammunition, the Cobra turned and headed west towards the airfield to rearm; I already had my Stinger out and fired a missile up its butt. The Blackhawk was still around so I immediately dashed downhill into a small villa to avoid detection.

                    After the Blackhawk broke orbit and headed north, Command ordered me to see if I could harass the enemy at Obregan and perhaps divert their attention to me. I moved into a better position to help Air plant some airstrikes on Obregan, most of which fizzled out. The laser designator seems to have limited use in Veteran mode, given that it doesn't let pilots lock onto whatever is being illuminated.

                    I spent the final minutes of the match searching for targets of opportunity within Obregan.

                    Wonderful job by everyone. Thanks to the 9th for the match, and thanks to the 31st for helping our lost cause.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Official TG vs. 9th AAR thread.

                      Ok, Thanks to Grunt for the AAR ! I don't have the time now cause of a hard work day after the event but I'd like to make a few points. Initially when we were on the map before the restart for the actual event,someone (flying one of the SU34's) I guess decided to strafe the friendly airfield. This caused someone to write in chat good job Curt. I hadn't even taken off yet (vet mode!)! As I heard the server would be restarted I quickly took off and headed for the enemy base tapping tab and locked on some targets. 2 rockets and I believe 4 enemy kills before the server restarted. Hey I felt good for the psychological blow but this is a example of how the Airpower was extremely over powering in the actual event!. This is great fun to be a part of an event like this but I have to say that 1000 pm start is much to late for me! Also Vet mode again added not more realism but I felt it only causes more confusion than it's worth.I mean this is a computer sim where we're looking through a monitor using keyboard etc. to interface and all the visual and audio cues of real life are missing in Arma! When Nicolai and I were assigned to the little bird and I thought it was him next to me but in actuality it was another caused me to cut out early and miss the excitement Grunt relayed in his AAR! Oh well. Thanks to Switch and all for organizing and since I have some friends that regularly host large events like this with no lag /server crash issues I'll find out whats needful in a server for this kind of event! It is a shame the TG server coudn't handle it this time as this would be a extremly effective way to bring the Arma community together. Thanks

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Official TG vs. 9th AAR thread.

                        Thanks for the write ups guys, very good reading. Sounds very exciting, wish I could sign up for TvT events like these. Looking forward to reading more of these AARs

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Official TG vs. 9th AAR thread.

                          Originally posted by AMosely View Post
                          My other major dislike here is veteran mode in TVT.
                          Heh, welcome to my first few days at IC-ArmA.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Official TG vs. 9th AAR thread.

                            Sounds like you guys had an exciting and frustrating time. It seems as though air power needs definitely addressing. I know that aircraft can have their weapons limited to just FFAR's and Cannon and perhaps this would help out. Whilst Arma is fairly realistic, the aircraft are anything but and I certainly feel the frustration of dominant air power having been on the receiving end of it myself.

                            Gillespie seems to have had a pretty hectic time getting back to the front lines and I think that should be used again. A small team operating behind enemy forces can cause havok. Look at what the response was to just one guy, diverting a BH and an AH1 to go find him (and loosing the AH1) meant team mates got a break.
                            Jex.

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                            • #15
                              Re: Official TG vs. 9th AAR thread.

                              I'm hearing rumors of a possible rematch. Any truth to this?

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