Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

How to make players soldiers.

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • How to make players soldiers.

    How To Make Players Soldiers.
    By: |TG-Irr|Ghost02 –PF-


    The biggest problem plaguing realistic games is by and far, the “un-experienced pubbie,” the “new guy,” the “greifer,” and “immaturity.” That is what I hear most of the time, but I have a different perspective. What do all of these players have in common? The lack of value for their virtual life. The pubbie just wants fun, the new guy is just that, new, the greifer doesn’t care, and the immature ones just want to kill. What solves this? Not only an objective that can only be completed through teamwork, not only forced “realistic” restrictions, but value of life. Any game can be realistic, BF2 is even realistic. All that is needed for realism is the realization that, hey my character means something! I am not cannon fodder! I am a loving breathing virtual human being! How can we put this mindset into players? There lies the hardest issue. This cannot be forced, like in the heavy handed ways of PR. This cannot be pushed like the ‘simulation’ of Arma. It can only happen within the individual player. When the player fears virtual death. The easiest way I can explain this is to think of it like this: we, in Arma 2, play as Marines. Imagine that each of us while playing signifies one Marine. If we get killed virtually, Imagine that the Marine you where playing as vanished. That living breathing persona will never breathe again. This way of viewing a ‘game’ has given new insight for me. A very good friend of mine, who unfortunately just had a stroke, was a Special Forces Sniper/Spotter. I asked him what he thought of realistic video games and his response was simple, “I cannot play those games, it reminds me of my friends who got killed.” Taking that feeling, that the persona we play as is someone’s friend, someone’s dad/brother/son/ect. Will take us to the next level of gaming. We will care if someone is hit, care about the briefing, and most importantly, care about getting back to base. But as many say, players are hardcoded. It all starts with you.
    |TG|Ghost02
    TG Pathfinder



    "I travel alone through the valley of the shadow of death, yet in my heart I carry no fear, for Gods hands will guide me to Truth and Honor."

  • #2
    Re: How to make players soldiers.

    Great post, Ghost :)

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: How to make players soldiers.

      I don't want to sound like I'm selling it (maybe I am!)...

      If people actually read the TGs SOP, and more importantly understood and makes a note to ahere to it. We need not worry.

      I realized that, I have lost vast amount of patience when it comes to players that Ghost have mentioned on previous post. I am constantly reminded not to "pull the pin" or "ND" due to the TG SOPs that I have agreed to abide by.

      I'm not talking about the players that are "new" to the game mind you.
      We were all "green" at some point.
      Having a helpful & experienced band of player base is very limited, which I'd like to believe that TGs full of.

      Now where is my next imaginary ND boy...
      Maybe I'll accidentally blame it on desync and crash into him/her...yeah that's not in the scope of the SOP...mohahahaah....or is it...crap.

      TGU Instructor · TG Pathfinder

      Former TGU Dean · Former ARMA Admin · Former Irregulars Officer

      "Do not seek death. Death will find you. But seek the road which makes death a fulfillment." - Dag Hammarskjold

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: How to make players soldiers.

        I feel like I can play tactically and maturely without having to imagine my character is a real person. I think it really comes down to the understanding of tactics and teamwork. I wouldn't want to play a game and get good at it by "fearing" myself into not dying. I play with tactics and teamwork because the feeling of accomplishment you get when a group of people from all over the world can bring their skills together and complete a mission whilst being thousands of miles away from each other is a great feeling.


        Comment


        • #5
          Re: How to make players soldiers.

          I have to say personally as an Admin this is excellent to see from a person. For me, all i like to see in players is that they take a second to think about what they are doing. You should be asking...

          1. How can i help out the team?
          2. Will my selfish actions ruin the game for others?
          3. Is it best that i shoot first or notify my team of the threat?

          Simple things like this should be asked by everyone who comes to TG to play ArmA and any other game. All that any of us admins and of course regular players ask of anyone is that you just take the time to think about your next move. Ultimately, working together for a common objective and completing it is the best feeling one can get from a game. yeah its just a game, but why waste all that money to just goof off and ruin it for others.

          We hate to see that TK's occur and that irresponsible players show up and thats what the admins are here for... to provide you a home to enjoy some time playing a game you like. Are we always going to make everyone happy, probably not and thats why people leave to go join other clans and what not. But, its those that stay even after the hard times that really make this a good community. We worked really hard to prepare ArmA2 for TG and the community and it makes us feel good that your enjoying your time and willing to put your time into making TG great.

          Look out for each other and make sure your having fun and not ruining it for others because if a single person has a good time they will tell 5 of their friends. If 1 person has a horrible time they will tell 20 of their friends. That's just how it goes and we want people with a good head on their shoulders to come to TG and learn how we play and also to make friends with those who enjoy the game as well.
          FORMER 22ND RRR/FORMER 1ST JTOC/ ALWAYS A TACTICALGAMER


          Spartan 4

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: How to make players soldiers.

            Thank you.
            |TG|Ghost02
            TG Pathfinder



            "I travel alone through the valley of the shadow of death, yet in my heart I carry no fear, for Gods hands will guide me to Truth and Honor."

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: How to make players soldiers.

              I totally agree! I am New to ARMA2, don't even have the game yet just the demo.
              But, when I played BF2 and COD4 I always looked at my KDR ratio.
              I prided myself at being like 12 and 2 or 37 and 7 instead of 57 and 51 with the highest score! THats the best player?
              What about the fact that I defended and kept control over are main base where the only vehicles SPAWN? Thats worth nothing.....
              Most games, HECK ALL games do not even consider this. The MOST kills get highest score or XP! Just spawn throw nades, suicide c4, run quickly in to a crowd and plant claymore, etc... Then Rinse and repeat. The games themselves breed this behavior.
              AA is the ONLY game that actually Values Life.
              But, I have grown bored with that series because even though there are a multitude of great maps. The most popular ones are Bridge and Pipeline which is more about BLIND shooting and Rocket Launcher are nade throws. They now they can spawn run to given point and shoot in the air at this angle and hit someone. I waited forever for AA3 and its here. With NO Vehecles! Just better Graphics and the same old nade spamming...YAWN!
              I should have Arma 2 in about a week and half or so and am so looking forward to it.
              After I figure out how to play the game a little I want to look for Team based Tactical Clan to be a part of. I am 42 and too old to be jacking with run and gunner Dime a Dozen games.

              I have always wanted something in between BF2 and AA. Arma 2 looks to be that and much much more....

              QuestBLACK
              Please add me to XFIRE guys... brucealmightyy

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: How to make players soldiers.

                QuestBlack, you're in the right place and Arma2 will fill that gap nicely.

                TGU Instructor · TG Pathfinder

                Former TGU Dean · Former ARMA Admin · Former Irregulars Officer

                "Do not seek death. Death will find you. But seek the road which makes death a fulfillment." - Dag Hammarskjold

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: How to make players soldiers.

                  I do actually think that one of the best ways to shape people into valuing their virtual life is to completely remove or at least strictily limit the ability to respawn.

                  TacticalGamer overall is good at that. Hour-long maps without respawning means it is a high price to pay to die early, and people that want to run&gun like if they play Quake Arena will find themselves bored after five minutes.

                  Add to that missions specifically designed to make it highly dangerous to even attempt to solo and people that aren't there to teamplay in a structured manner will be long gone.



                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: How to make players soldiers.

                    Great post, ghost! And excellent feedbacks! With that said, how about we give 0800 AM-1000 AM another try and not screw up this time? :P


                    IN GAME ARMA: |TG-Irr| Lq.Snake

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: How to make players soldiers.

                      Originally posted by QuestBlack View Post
                      I totally agree! I am New to ARMA2, don't even have the game yet just the demo.
                      But, when I played BF2 and COD4 I always looked at my KDR ratio.
                      I prided myself at being like 12 and 2 or 37 and 7 instead of 57 and 51 with the highest score! THats the best player?
                      What about the fact that I defended and kept control over are main base where the only vehicles SPAWN? Thats worth nothing.....
                      Most games, HECK ALL games do not even consider this. The MOST kills get highest score or XP! Just spawn throw nades, suicide c4, run quickly in to a crowd and plant claymore, etc... Then Rinse and repeat. The games themselves breed this behavior.
                      AA is the ONLY game that actually Values Life.
                      But, I have grown bored with that series because even though there are a multitude of great maps. The most popular ones are Bridge and Pipeline which is more about BLIND shooting and Rocket Launcher are nade throws. They now they can spawn run to given point and shoot in the air at this angle and hit someone. I waited forever for AA3 and its here. With NO Vehecles! Just better Graphics and the same old nade spamming...YAWN!
                      I should have Arma 2 in about a week and half or so and am so looking forward to it.
                      After I figure out how to play the game a little I want to look for Team based Tactical Clan to be a part of. I am 42 and too old to be jacking with run and gunner Dime a Dozen games.

                      I have always wanted something in between BF2 and AA. Arma 2 looks to be that and much much more....

                      QuestBLACK
                      Please add me to XFIRE guys... brucealmightyy
                      Welcome to TG Quest. you'll never look back.
                      sigpic
                      |TG-1st|Grunt
                      ARMA Admin (retired)
                      Pathfinder-Spartan 5

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: How to make players soldiers.

                        Originally posted by nthamma View Post
                        Great post, ghost! And excellent feedbacks! With that said, how about we give 0800 AM-1000 AM another try and not screw up this time? :P

                        Has there been a third attempt yet? I think I know how we can knock this one over...

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: How to make players soldiers.

                          The biggest issue gamers have versus RL soldiers is understanding of threat and spacial/situational awareness.

                          In days of old, the military doctrine would be to throw as many bodies as possible forward and the "sacrifice" of the many would advance the line and gain all important ground.

                          It soon became clear and apparent, along the similar time that is was discovered that when fighting in a predominantly green environment, wearing bright red jackets was probably a bad idea , that simply throwing numbers forward is a useless waste of life.

                          Some embraced this new found respect for life faster than others. For example the smaller number of US forces in the battle for independence, realised that green uniforms and hit and run tactics were better than solid rifle line formations in bright RED! Unfortunately it took over a century later for British Aristocracy idiots to realise that "throwing men over the top" in World War 1, was even more incredibly stupid than their call of "cowardice" for anyone with half a brain that said "hang on a minute, there are 10 machine guns lined up over this trench we are going to lose everyone if we go over the top, I dont think I want to go!"

                          Fast forwad to modern day and to the ideas of RL versus Gamers in terms of perception, approach and thought process and while there are similarities, there are also huge differences.

                          The biggest thing, as has been pointed out....when in the RL... make a stupid or noob battlefield mistake and you die, its that simple. The only thing worse is to make such a decision and be in charge of other people who also end up dead as a result of your actions. This alone sharpens the senses to spacial and situational awareness.

                          The 6 P's... Prior Planning Prevents P... Poor Performance!


                          There is no point charging into a situation only to run into a village and go "holy crap there are 3 T90's in this village and two brigades of nasty peeps!" just as your body falls in a crumpled heap! DEAD!

                          ArmA2 has provided a great deal of RL equipment that makes "recon" a great deal more realistic and every commander or squad leader should gain as much intel as possible, before throwing his men into the AO. This slow down gameplay but then this is what makes ArmA "ArmA" as opposed to PR or COD, etc, where the mentality is a little more towards "lets get into a firefight".

                          If the gamer, wants to try and simulate the RL, they must start thinking as proposed, like a soldier. That means, consider everyone an enemy until sure otherwise, consider all obstacles, buildings or objects as a threat until proven otherwise. Always ALWAYS secure your perimeter...never bunch up and cover your sectors. LISTEN....!! It may just save your life!

                          Use appropriate radio procedure "Enemy over there" is about as useful as a fart in a space suit! Whereas, "Contact, bearing 210, 4 man patrol, heading toward us, unaware" Gives the squad leader all the information he needs to make a swift decision and keep more players alive.

                          COVER - So many times I see incredibly poor positions taken up from which to engage the enemy, mainly due to focus on shooting rather than "where do I go if this all goes wrong?" An open field is a very BAD area to get involve in a firefight! This brings the player back to situational awareness...."which position gives us a field of fire, while also offering cover for escape and evasion if need be" is a much better way to consider where you open fire from.

                          Gear......
                          Do I have the right kit? This does not just include ammo, but flares, smoke, basic medical supplies, reserve weapon and loadout.... i.e. "If my task is to take out a radio tower, I should probably be carrying a satchel" dont assume your colleagues all have one. Ask first or carry....never ignore!

                          In short the best way to ensure that you begin to act like a soldier in a game situation is the simplest and most basic piece of advice which is; "IS THIS SENSIBLE?"....

                          A 4 man patrol suddenly faced with a T90 and no AT, should not "try to shoot the tracks to get the crew to bail" the 4 man patrol should move away quietly and slowly, mark the position of the enemy for friendly units and call for support....end result....."LIFE" rather than "DEATH"...

                          Accept that common sense is your greatest friend and you have a much higher chance of never needing a respawn or medical assistance in ArmA2..... ignore this and it will be your peer's that will deem you a liability and then you will begin to realise why no one wants to be in your squad, next to you in combat or in the same vehicle as you when you play the game....

                          My two cents...for what its worth!

                          BD1
                          BlackDog1




                          "What we do in life... echoes in eternity!"

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: How to make players soldiers.

                            I'm leaning towards what Blackdog and Kevlar said on this one. I don't think a player needs to believe his in-game persona is an actual person to be an effective team player. I believe all you need is a bit of common sense and knowledge of the game, although common sense a bit of a subjective term. This is just my opinion though and I do not mean to offend anyone with a differing opinion.
                            Last edited by Jaman; 07-06-2009, 08:31 PM. Reason: sentence error
                            "Today's public figures can no longer write their own speeches or books, and there is some evidence that they can't read them either." -- Gore Vidal

                            |TG| Jaman

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: How to make players soldiers.

                              Thank you for your post BD. TG should make a guide on how to be a good arma teamplayer/
                              |TG|Ghost02
                              TG Pathfinder



                              "I travel alone through the valley of the shadow of death, yet in my heart I carry no fear, for Gods hands will guide me to Truth and Honor."

                              Comment

                              Connect

                              Collapse

                              TeamSpeak 3 Server

                              Collapse

                              Advertisement

                              Collapse

                              Twitter Feed

                              Collapse

                              Working...
                              X