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Plz share your thoughts on identifying a proper lz.

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  • Plz share your thoughts on identifying a proper lz.

    I wanted to make a topic about this. Once I had learned to fly the little bird, I soon realized controlling the chopper is the easy part.The hard part is knowing where to land, and how to approach.
    I make many mistakes on this still, and it always kills a full squad + chopper. No doubt you can all see the importance of this.

    I'd like to hear everyone's thoughts on this, here are mine:


    -"land twice as far then you think is needed".

    Reasoning behind this is that the enemy is generally more spread out then you think, and all sane squads would rather walk 50-100 meters more instead of going home in a body bag. Another point is the squad will want to place a good rallypoint.


    -"Never land in line of sight of the flag/enemy position"!

    Speaks for itself, yet too often neglected. Protects you against the easy at shot.


    -"If possible, never approach in line of sight of the flag/enemy position".

    Often it is best to fly all across the map through relatively safe areas, to be able to approach the LZ from the best side.


    -"Do not land unless you are positive the ground is 100% flat and level".

    There is too great a risk of tipping over.



    Nearly every time I have crashed on a drop off mission, I did not do one of these things. I'd love to hear the thoughts of other pilots on this. I'd also love to hear from the grunts that get picked up; where and how do you like to be dropped off?

    PS Always communicate your destination to the pilot using grid coordinates. Keeps him from getting lost in Jabal's hills:).

  • #2
    Re: Plz share your thoughts on identifying a proper lz.

    Dude, I think we should make a thread detailing SOPs for transport helos. I absolutely agree with what you said, but some people don't understand that the strength of them (Blackhawk especially) is that they move you from one place to the other in a timely matter. I keep having people jump in my BH and think that because it has guns that it is a gunship. Wrong. The miniguns are -defensive- weapons.

    Rule 1: Last night two guys jump in my BH and say 'Just fly over the city.' (Muttrah City, that is, with no less than 5 AA gun emplacements). Obviously, I do not just fly over the city and let them gun for the entire round. The Blackhawk is not an Offensive helicopter. It is a transport helicopter.

    Rule 2: Same round. People keep jumping into my transport helos and -demanding- that I take them to Hotel. I had already been shot down once at the Hotel without even landing, so I knew it was a hot LZ. Nevertheless, they continue demanding that I land at Hotel. So, damnit, I take my full Blackhawk, set it down right in the middle of three RPG gunners right in front of the Hotel and laugh my ass off as not one of the guys in my helo actually manage to get out in time before it explodes. Basis for the rule: Let the pilot decide the best infill point because he has a better view of the theatre and can make an educated decision on where and where not to land.

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    • #3
      Re: Plz share your thoughts on identifying a proper lz.

      when a squad requests a pickup, look for the green smoke! do a flyby pass, looking where the smoke has been placed. once youve located the smoke, form an approach vector, get in, pick em up and get out quickly! if you take fire at all during the approach, abort and let the infantry deal with the threat (since they will see the tracers and know the position of who is shooting at you

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      • #4
        Re: Plz share your thoughts on identifying a proper lz.

        Excellent thread. I have nothing to add, other than I was able to use the green smoke on Al Basrah this week!! :)

        Second video down.

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        • #5
          Re: Plz share your thoughts on identifying a proper lz.

          Check out post numba one for a nice video with some nice tips:

          http://www.tacticalgamer.com/armed-a...d-assault.html
          (PO3) Marcinko_R. (BF2 PR .509) Squad Member
          (CPO) Marcinko_R. (BF2 PR .509) Squad Leader
          (LCDR) Marcinko_R. (BF2 PR .509) Commander

          Squad Member pledge to their SL:
          Squad Leader pledge to their team:
          Commander pledge to their SL:

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          • #6
            Re: Plz share your thoughts on identifying a proper lz.

            Good post al one suggestion I have is dont land all the way. Have you troops jump at 4-8 meters above the ground and immediatly go prone(cuts down on tks from the chopper hitting you). I'm at work right now on a saturday morning but will wright a more extensive sop later.

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            • #7
              Re: Plz share your thoughts on identifying a proper lz.

              I like to be dropped off on high ground whenever tacticaly feasible. It's just more defensible if the LZ is hot, and if it's not, you have better vision to formulate an attack.

              I prefer the approach and the actual LZ to be shielded from view.

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              • #8
                Re: Plz share your thoughts on identifying a proper lz.

                Ok, he's the way I do it, and it usually works.

                I approach at high speed, have the chopper's nose down, take a small dive and when I'm close to the ground, I take the chopper's nose up. This way I can land it fast and safe, however I need a small "runway" to be able to do this. On city maps such as Muttrah, this is perfect. Just use street as a landing spot, and you'll be able to drop off troops fast. If you don't have room, like landing on a small clear on a jungle map, just slowly take the chopper down, circling, to make sure you are landing at the right place, and won't hit any trees.

                As of teamkilling, it is not completely up to the pilot. If the whole squad decides to jump off while the helo is still moving, you'll get all the TKs, but won't even be your fault.
                |TG-69th|Kevlar



                "Oh I know I don't think I see what I see what I'm thinking."

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Plz share your thoughts on identifying a proper lz.

                  False Insurtions will aid the grunts.

                  From this website:http://www.combat.ws/S4/MILTERMS/MT-F.HTM

                  FALSE INSERTION :
                  a heliborne technique for small unit operations of multiple touch-downs to deceive enemy observers on the exact location of the dispatched team. See SHELL GAME, TRAIL WATCHER, FLIP-FLOP. [nb: despite conceptual similarity, this should not be confused with "prick teaser" or "coitus interruptus"!]

                  __

                  The general idea is to create a senerio where the trail watchers have several options as to where the enemy is located.

                  The more false insurtions, the higher the chance the enemy will go to the wrong one.

                  How this works in game:

                  1. Insert in close to the out of bounds marker. False insertions near enemy movement is dangerous.

                  2. Let the grunts know your going to do this. Teamspeak channel for the CO and SLs would be nice here.

                  3. Have the CO check out some grid positions to look for enemy trail wathcers or LZ watchers (scout/recon).
                  Should not be a problem cause only the most hard-core players will camp a potintial LZ for a 90 min round.
                  Last edited by Rick_the_new_guy; 03-10-2007, 08:20 PM.
                  (PO3) Marcinko_R. (BF2 PR .509) Squad Member
                  (CPO) Marcinko_R. (BF2 PR .509) Squad Leader
                  (LCDR) Marcinko_R. (BF2 PR .509) Commander

                  Squad Member pledge to their SL:
                  Squad Leader pledge to their team:
                  Commander pledge to their SL:

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Plz share your thoughts on identifying a proper lz.

                    Good point Rick.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Plz share your thoughts on identifying a proper lz.

                      Just a thought, not that it counts... When a squad lands, have it use surpressing fire away from the bird. This may give the chopper time to make its escape..and possible enable it to give you a ride later. Hard and Fast is the way I like to land, then get the heck out as soon as possible.
                      "Don't tell people how to do things, tell them what to do and let them surprise you with their results." Gen. George Patton

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Plz share your thoughts on identifying a proper lz.

                        Originally posted by Rick_the_new_guy View Post
                        Should not be a problem cause only the most hard-core players will camp a potintial LZ for a 90 min round.

                        I've been found out.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Plz share your thoughts on identifying a proper lz.

                          That green smoke is really easy to see from the air. Pop it in the LZ, then get your squad to take cover nearby. As the helo approaches, run out to meet it. This way your not sniper meat while you wait.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Plz share your thoughts on identifying a proper lz.

                            Originally posted by secret.squirrul View Post
                            I keep having people jump in my BH and think that because it has guns that it is a gunship. Wrong. The miniguns are -defensive- weapons.
                            Employing it as a gunship is a valid tactic IMO, especially on Muttrah, where there's plenty of MH-6's to handle transport.

                            Originally posted by secret.squirrul View Post
                            Rule 2: Same round. People keep jumping into my transport helos and -demanding- that I take them to Hotel. I had already been shot down once at the Hotel without even landing, so I knew it was a hot LZ.
                            People shouldn't be demanding anything. If they're letting you know they want to take hotel, that's fine. You're right that the pilot should then be left to make the decision exactly where to insert the troops in order for them to achieve their objective. There are times though, as both a pilot and a ground SL, that I've found it better to be very specific about which tree I want to land next to. It all depends on circumstances.

                            In response to the question posed in the thread title : Anywhere big enough that you can get your troops in a position where they can jump out safely. I don't believe you can rule out areas, such as direct LOS to the OpFor flag.
                            BFCL TF2 league admin

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Plz share your thoughts on identifying a proper lz.

                              Originally posted by Foxoq View Post
                              That green smoke is really easy to see from the air. Pop it in the LZ, then get your squad to take cover nearby. As the helo approaches, run out to meet it. This way your not sniper meat while you wait.
                              I find the smoke useless and hard to see. When I see it, I can also see the squad I'm picking up so.... it has no use for me. Probably it is due to my low settings.

                              Everyone will agree though that the very best way to indicate an lz is to give the CO a marker ("move to" marker), that the CO then gives on exactly the same spot. You can see this from anywhere on the map. This is how it should always be done if you are transporting a SL and have a CO imo.



                              I commend Rick on his excellent idea. I often have time to waste as a transport pilot, and fake insertions is a great way to keep helping the team.


                              For practice on this, I recommend "Ghost train" . This map is by far the hardest of all to find LZ's on. You have only the railroads, and narrow gaps in the forest on uneven terrain. If you can do it on Ghost train, you can do it anywhere.

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