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  • Wish more people would call out...

    Been playing some on another server with some friends and something I've noticed (there and here) is the lack of squad and fire control.

    Don't know if its feasible in PRM or any video game for that matter but because of lack of comms I'm often left hanging out to dry as I'm trying to work with the unit.

    For example , I'd start taking fire from somewhere so duck behind cover.I hear shots from the squad so ask for directions so I too can return fire but no reply. Stick your head up (being as you can't peek or lean in PRM) and you either get nailed or spot something to shoot at in the general direction that is more than likely a friendly advancing without any specific orders to do so and I end up with a TK credit.

    Why aren't SL's taking control of the situation and squad members listening?

    Quit often there's plenty of time for someone to speak up and say something like "fire from (use compass direction rather than left/right because of players orientation) " so everyone takes cover and returns fire into that area (keep in mind the suppression effect in PRM). Squad STAYS PUT until SL orders advance or withdrawal instead of everyone barging out for that one last kill through the field of fire of friendlies.

    I know there are limitations because of it being a video game. SL can't keep tabs on every member and call them back etc. but simple things like converging fire concentrated into a specific area should be feasible.

    I wanted to play PRM for the touch of realism , use of tactics and squad interaction but so far , the vast majority of players I've run into play it like most other FPS's going solo joining a squad just so they don't get kicked off the server.

    But there have also have been those magical moments when a squad melds and works as a unit...and you want the map to go on forever so the squad is never dispersed.

    Every time you join the server and a squad you roll the dice..will they be communicative or will they be all over the map doing their own thing.

    Everyone should read the PRM SOP's here. They outline how a perfect game would be played. Not necessarily to win but to simply enjoy the experience of PRM.
    [CoFR] BeerHunter

    You shouldn't feel bad because you're not succeeding. It's far better to feel confident that you have the ability to handle failure

  • #2
    Re: Wish more people would call out...

    This could be easily remedied if more people would take some squad training.

    5 part squad training video by fuzzhead.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-xZXf-Rvsg
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QpUnRZDomaQ
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=05Ik9kjbIB8
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qc1hTAtZZPE
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGUgfbao2E4

    Its very hard to micromanage SM in realtime because people are still carrying around the VBF2 mentality thus they end up straying away from the squad. (Even seasoned vets end up doing this) In this training video, fuzzhead breaks his 6 man squad into 3 fireteams. They effectively perform a suppress and flank drill with ease in part 3 i think. Good video for all types of players.

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    • #3
      Re: Wish more people would call out...

      The easiest thing to do, is play with a good squad leader. Over time you will pick things up, notice what works and what doesnt in real time situations, and when you make your own fire team no one is going to get mad at you for learning. Watching the videos is a good way to learn the basics, but nothing beats the real thing.
      Respect is earned.

      |TG-6th|Alpha

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      • #4
        Re: Wish more people would call out...

        Maybe the server should always be passworded, it would solve so many problems, the password should be listed somewhere in the SOP's so people have to read through it to find the link (password should change every 3-5 days?). It would keep the lone wolfs out of the server and would make sure people read the SOP's. Give me your opinions, I don't care if it sounds stupid but I think it's a really good idea.

        Damnit Blizzard, fix ZvT already >.<
        In Soviet Russian, Arma admins are nice to you!

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        • #5
          Re: Wish more people would call out...

          Personally i think the goal is to get those lone wolfs into the server and convert them to team players. If we locked them out they will never learn.
          Respect is earned.

          |TG-6th|Alpha

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          • #6
            Re: Wish more people would call out...

            Having the server passworded is a supremely bad idea. While TG is a more professional server than most, it is still a public server. We do have password nights, and the fact that there have been many instances in which the password night activity is no different than any other night is an indication that even if the server was locked all the time, the attitude and gameplay of people wouldnt change much. In addition to that, TG is a place where everyone is welcome and we dont close our doors to people. Having the server passworded all the time is equivalent to yanking away the welcome mat and replacing it with a triple deadbolt. The server would become unpopular relatively quickly and the population would steadily decline until it was almost negligible.

            Your reasoning is solid in theory, however, in practice, it still doesnt work. A good example of this is on the Natural Selection servers that TG hosts. When you first play there, you have a ? icon next to your name. If you want it removed, you must come to the forums, read and sign the TG NS Primer. The number of people who show up with no ? icon (indicating that they've supposedly read the rules/guidelines/SOPs) who still act like smacktards is very high. People simply wont read and practice things like that. They find out what they have to do in order to get the icon gone (or in this case, access to the password), scroll through without reading, sign on the X and go on their way. Like i said, in a theoretical world where people actually read stuff and practiced it, it would work. But not here.

            Hope I didnt seem to overly harsh with that, rainy day has me in a funny mood.

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            • #7
              Re: Wish more people would call out...

              Nope thats not too harsh, but maybe have a always locked out 2nd server? Not even sure if that is possible though because servers aren't $1 per 64 player server.

              Damnit Blizzard, fix ZvT already >.<
              In Soviet Russian, Arma admins are nice to you!

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Wish more people would call out...

                I think Ferris hit it dead on. As the old saying goes, you can lead the horse to water but you can't make him drink. ;)

                Until such point as you get a gaming population which wants to play the game the same way and has the knowledge to do it "the PRM way", then your squad play on a public server is always going to be hit and miss. In other words, I don't think its going to happen. Most of the time you'll be lucky to get everyone with a working mike so you can talk to them to say nothing about being able to sit still for 1 minute to listen to instructions.

                That's probably why I have yet to encounter a single squad in PR (on a public server) who has made good use of fireteams or any kind of more complicated maneuvers such as formations, suppression fire, or bounding. It takes practice, discipline, and squad cohesiveness to make it happen and a pick up squad just isn't suited to that.

                Your best bet if you want consistent squad play is to play with a clan or inhouse TG squad IMO. If you can get 4 or 5 people in a squad who are used to playing together then you'll get a more consistent experience. Now having said that, TG's PR server is still WAY better than a lot of the other servers I have played on. You know the kind...where you need to hunt for a SL who has a mike. Even better is non-public servers and game play you would in one of the PR tournaments (for example).

                Bernout

                |TG-MD6|

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Wish more people would call out...

                  Great Video fuzzhead it helped me understand and make me a better player. THANKS

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Wish more people would call out...

                    My 2nd server idea just brought ANOTHER idea to me although this is off-topic I think TG should have an X-Tract server. In 0.5 I would always love to play on them although there was only 1 that was every active. But in 0.6 there isn't even 1 person playing on them. The only downside is the maps for them are just so small other than al basrah. I think the PR team needs to make some more X-Tract maps cause personally I think it's a great gamemode.

                    Damnit Blizzard, fix ZvT already >.<
                    In Soviet Russian, Arma admins are nice to you!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Wish more people would call out...

                      They dont have that mode working in 0.6 yet, theres a patch soon that might fix it though


                      If you find yourself in a fair fight, then you have obviously failed to plan properly.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Wish more people would call out...

                        Originally posted by xcannon69 View Post
                        This could be easily remedied if more people would take some squad training.

                        5 part squad training video by fuzzhead.

                        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-xZXf-Rvsg
                        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QpUnRZDomaQ
                        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=05Ik9kjbIB8
                        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qc1hTAtZZPE
                        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGUgfbao2E4

                        Its very hard to micromanage SM in realtime because people are still carrying around the VBF2 mentality thus they end up straying away from the squad. (Even seasoned vets end up doing this) In this training video, fuzzhead breaks his 6 man squad into 3 fireteams. They effectively perform a suppress and flank drill with ease in part 3 i think. Good video for all types of players.
                        I'm sorry but the comments on that first video made me fall out of my chair laughing. People who write youtube comments must be the lowest of the low.


                        Community, not corporation!

                        TG-Irr BetterDeadThanRe(D)

                        Xfire-BetterDeadThanRed1

                        Irregs PR CO

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Wish more people would call out...

                          Youtube is the lowest of the low.

                          You want real battlefield experience with PR? Show up on PW nights. Beginning to end, if you can. Because by the end usually, you'll be in the same squad 2 or 3 rounds in a row, and that's really more valuable than most people think.

                          Once you get tactics solid with one squad, you can bring them to another down the road.

                          It's just practice practice practice...
                          Skud


                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Wish more people would call out...

                            Originally posted by Bernout View Post
                            ... As the old saying goes, you can lead the horse to water but you can't make him drink. ;)
                            Bernout
                            but I can sure kick that horse's @ss out of my squad and give him a quick piece of my mind!

                            *
                            BeerHunter...I can't say that I've ever gotten to play with you in my squad, but we have a pretty good system of spotting troops and calling out CONTACT if we still hold element of suprise and ACTION if we have been spotted and need to engage. As squad leader I will almost always go prone instantly and place an attack marker on the target, allowing my squad to open fire or grenade depending on range. I know M.Warren does the same thing in his squads, which makes playing SM much easier. Playing support/point man for him or any other good SL, I can assure you that if it's blinking red on my HUD and <45m away... it's getting a grenade, or getting suppressed so someone else in the squad can maneuver for a kill shot.

                            I like to think that spotting first pays off. I've been killed dozens of times now spotting an enemy that shoots me, only to have him easily hunted down by my squad using the HUD, and then getting myself revived by our squad medic.
                            |TG-X|WAREHOUSE

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Wish more people would call out...

                              Originally posted by w.WAREHOUSE View Post
                              but I can sure kick that horse's @ss out of my squad and give him a quick piece of my mind!
                              Amen to that. I do it rarely as a SL but it happened last Sunday during pw night when a SM wouldn't listen to orders.

                              Of course as a SM joining some random squad that really isn't an option. ;)

                              I also completely agree about the value of spotting. I just wish it was more reliable at distance instead of getting those damn ? marks popping up all the time.

                              Bernout

                              |TG-MD6|

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