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  • My Ranting / Complaining

    So with this new patch I was very happy with the preview screenshots and posts from the devs But I feel that the game play has.... crashed. The game in my opinion has come to a halt.
    Some things I have noticed on paper that seem to be great improvements in play are not very good.

    1. 'Bullet haze' - The thing that happens when A bullet impacts near you. If the range was increased this was a bad idea. I was sitting behind a sandbag bunker when I was shot at from behind and above me. The first hit infront of the bunker I was able to turn around and locate the source before the second round hit. When it did It was about a body lenght and a half from me and gave me the blur, I was then effectively useless and had no other cover within 20M 3 shots later the AK fire finally was able to kill me. I do not see how if a bullet hits 6-7 feet away i get blurry, Yes I can see if its 2-3 but 6-7?! C'mon now

    2. APC fire being slowed down. This is great in theory you can now give ground forces time to survive but when A support truck has enough time to drive straight at you for 4-5s taking 2-3 hits and live to get behind a hill something is wrong. APC vs Anything besides Infantry is now completely worthless Also with the british APC I think the zoom could use another level between No zoom and the Zoom it has now. I felt like it going from 0 to w/e it is now was too much.

    3. SL spawn getting removed. Yes this was very good no more SLs sitting in a Panic room spawning infinite people until someone was able to grapple up or Put a Hat into the Window. The fix to this in my opinion would to have put a 15s timer on a SL. say a SM could only spawn on the SL once every 25s or more. this provides time for the attacking squad to get in and stop that SL BUT STill provides time for a SL to regroup his Squad and get a rally down. Now if a Squad looses its Rally and the Bunkers/Firebase havent been placed you have a Very long run/time till you can get back to get a new rally up.

    4. Sight Deviation - I can understand 1s to .5s time to steay but 3s? I'm pretty sure when you are trained as a soldier you get trained on how to Aim and Lower your body profile. One of the best ways to do this is prone. But it doesnt take 3s to steady. Especially when you add in the effects of bullet haze.

    5.Snipers need grappling hooks. Possibly spec ops too. Nothing worse than having a Sniper rifle with no elevation.

    6. Vehicles being given too much Force if Multiple hills are in question. Especially shown on the Battle for Q****ing. I can post a Video of what im talking about if need be. It has no sound though.

    7. This might just be me but does everyone else's map take 2-3s To load up? Everything but the map loads up usually within half a second. And the spotting system i think needs to be looked at but thats nothing compared to the other stuff
    Steping Down from my Soap box. I might try Pr again if they do some patching but as of right now I am not this type of gamer.


    http://www.youtube.com/user/TheskilledoneOSOK - YouTube Videos.
    http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=454724633178684067 - Old vBF2 Sniper Video (all clips are from when Scope was full screen)

  • #2
    Re: My Ranting / Complaining

    About the SL spawn thing: I tend to agree with you. However, I have had some great games on 0.7. Squads are being forced to stick together, drop constant rally points and support each other. It requires a NEW set of SL skills. From what I have observed, no matter what the map, your experience in PR depends largely on how good your squad and SL are.

    Once good SL's learn to adapt to 0.7, it will be great. I am already beginning to see this and I have led some great squads myself. It really adds intensity. Overall, I do think some changes were excessive (removal of minimap, SL spawn), but, I will not say that they were "bad" as I have had some great rounds. I will be playing PR 0.7 a lot more before passing a verdict.
    Last edited by Catraphact; 01-03-2008, 10:01 AM.

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    • #3
      Re: My Ranting / Complaining

      It's tougher, thats for sure. Especially the aiming. The sniper rifle is useless but I believe the DEVs know about this and are going to fix it.
      It's just going to take a while for everyone to adapt, but having a good commander and a good squad is a must in this version.
      Being in a crappy squad is no fun at all.
      I agree with all your points, but it's still early, give it time

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      • #4
        Re: My Ranting / Complaining

        Re point 4; Are you talking about the time it takes the sight to return to point of aim after a shot is fired?

        If so, 3 seconds is crazy! I could have an elephant gun back on target in 3 seconds and I'm only a civvy trap shooter! The AR15 (civvy M16) I shot way back when was back to POA real fast due to the straight line design and low recoil impulse.


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        • #5
          Re: My Ranting / Complaining

          Point 1. I think this is to emulate fear and panic when someone starts shooting at you rather than the actual physics of the bullet impact. Since you cant really induce these emotions in a game, this is the best the developers can do. You can still run like hell for cover if thereís any available.

          Point 3. If a firebase/bunker hasnít been placed quit often itís the SL fault. Never liked the idea of endless respawns right next to an intense firefight over an objective. Have a feeling this may be tweaked a wee bit by the developers though.

          Point 4. And yes it does take about 3 seconds to change a firing stance, bring your weapon up into firing position, settle down and sight a target. You can still blind fire immediately.

          Point 7. The map delay supposedly emulates you taking it out, unfolding it etc. (another touch of realisms??) but IIRC the cold hard facts are itís the BF2 code because the mini-map was removed.

          Other points I donít feel experienced enough to comment on.

          My opinionsÖ
          [CoFR] BeerHunter

          You shouldn't feel bad because you're not succeeding. It's far better to feel confident that you have the ability to handle failure

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          • #6
            Re: My Ranting / Complaining

            Point 1: Beerhunter is on target here (get it? on target?). I believe the intended result of "bullet haze" is to allow for suppression of enemy forces with fire. We all know that in BF2, suppression is a joke, and the SAW was not anything to be feared. A prone support gunner could easily be taken out by popping up and getting one shot into his face. Now it's not that easy - fire suppression actually works (as you found out).

            Point 3: SL must adapt. I've already changed my tactics and to be honest, I don't miss SL spawning any more. The intent was to force more tactics, and I think they've hit the mark.

            Point 4: I'm not too happy with the time to "zero in" your shot either, and I've still be "insta-proned" in .7 - they're working on trying to remove the arcade element, but I think that there is only so much they can do. We'll all just have to learn to adapt.

            Point 7: One suggestion is to set the transparency on your map to the point where you can leave it open constantly and still see. This is not your scroll-lock map, but your "M" key map. I do this while driving - haven't really run around with it yet, but other people have and it seems to work, especially zoomed in one level on the map.


            I think you should give it another week, and if it's still not your cup of tea any more, then play something else that suits your tastes better. Obviously liking the mod, as with everything else, is a matter of individual taste. Just be sure you give it and yourself a fair shake.

            "You milsim guys are ruining the game."

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            • #7
              Re: My Ranting / Complaining

              I had to get a whole new tactic plan book for .7!

              That means no more "Delay spawn me","Don't spawn RP...spawn me", and the ever popular "Get out of my panic room when you spawn in!"

              At first, I really hated .7, even when I was testing it. But know, I have come to appreciate the game and the new version. I like the fact that your kills won't be recorded for a long time.

              I already made a new "Playbook" that seems to work well, but I am not telling!

              ps. I still miss SL spawn...just look at my sig!
              "Dirtboy is super awesome, and chicks dig him too!"- Everyone



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              • #8
                Re: My Ranting / Complaining

                I 'm glad SL spawning is gone... it was the most unrealistic aspect of the game :). Bunkers and firebases are much more important now, unfortunately they become bugged quite often which completely screws a round.

                I agree the haze is a bit overdone, but it doesn't really bother me. I have more problems with the messed up nade sounds.

                I have yet to drive/gun an APC so no comment on that.
                Xfire: Iaintyourm8 | Ingame: GhostDog | Steam: Zuigmijnballen

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                • #9
                  Re: My Ranting / Complaining

                  Originally posted by d1sp0sabl3H3r0 View Post
                  Point 7: One suggestion is to set the transparency on your map to the point where you can leave it open constantly and still see. This is not your scroll-lock map, but your "M" key map. I do this while driving - haven't really run around with it yet, but other people have and it seems to work, especially zoomed in one level on the map.

                  I think you should give it another week, and if it's still not your cup of tea any more, then play something else that suits your tastes better. Obviously liking the mod, as with everything else, is a matter of individual taste. Just be sure you give it and yourself a fair shake.
                  You did a good job as SL during Qinling yesterday bud which is good because it was my first round with 0.7. :D

                  For first impressions, I don't mind any of the changes so far with 0.7 with the exception of the loss of the minimap and the whole spotting mechanism which is a royal pain in the ass. If people had situational awareness issues with 0.6 then it is only going to get worse. TKs are undoubtedly going to rise.

                  The 100% transparency map works ok but it kind of begs the question of why get rid of the minimap if that option is still available? If they get rid of that and I have no easy way of seeing where my fellow SMs are then this mod is done for me.

                  In any case, I'm going to give it a couple of weeks here and make sure I play through all the maps (except Kashan) before I decide if it's time to move on.

                  Bernout

                  |TG-MD6|

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                  • #10
                    Re: My Ranting / Complaining

                    1. This gives the person who fires first the advantage. In .6 if you missed with your first shot the guy you where shooting at usually turned round and killed you with a single headshot.

                    2.AFAIK this only effects the Warrior and Scimitar and it mirrors the effective ROF of 90 rounds per minute of the RL version of the cannon. There's a thread about it on the PR forums: www . realitymod.com/forum/rate-30mm-fire-warrior-t33113.html

                    3.Commander assests are a bit bugged ATM. I was commanding on Bi Ming yesterday evening and after I set down the first bunker nothing else would deploy. Hopefully this will be fixed soon so it's easier for squads to spawn on a firebase or bunker nearer the action rather than the whole way back at the main base.

                    4.The deviation only takes that long to settle after you've been spriting and is meant to signify getting your breath back and steadying your aim as the BF2 engine doesn't support weapon sway and a host of other features that would make infantry combat so much better.

                    5.Yea, it would make sense plus I'd like it if everyone had a short grappling hook that they could use to climb over walls and other objects that are head height. It would also be great if some of the basic classes got the trip flares the sniper has too.

                    6.Not sure what you mean by this, can we see the video?

                    7. I understand why they removed the automatic q-spotting that tracked the enemy on the map but I wish squad members could still manually spot.

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                    • #11
                      Re: My Ranting / Complaining

                      Originally posted by d1sp0sabl3H3r0 View Post
                      Point 1: Beerhunter is on target here (get it? on target?). I believe the intended result of "bullet haze" is to allow for suppression of enemy forces with fire. We all know that in BF2, suppression is a joke, and the SAW was not anything to be feared. A prone support gunner could easily be taken out by popping up and getting one shot into his face. Now it's not that easy - fire suppression actually works (as you found out).
                      I'm only going to comment about this..

                      suppression is a mis-used term.

                      "Suppressive fire (also known as covering fire) is a term used in military science for firing weapons at or in the direction of enemy forces with the primary goal of reducing their ability to defend themselves or return fire, by forcing them to remain under cover."

                      The concept of suppression fire goes under the assumption your enemy doesn't want to die, and will take cover when you shoot at him. Adding that stupid haze since this is a video game and people mostly don't care about dying like they do "in reality" is quite silly in it's current incarnation.

                      People will end up just abusing this "feature" like I found out last evening...

                      I had a guy last night shooting a SAW at extreme long range at me via a binoc's sighting and I got the stupid haze from 658 meters. That's not suppressive fire, that's wild-assed shooting and taking advantage of game mechanic's that haven't been properly tested to give the desired effect using improper methods..

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                      • #12
                        Re: My Ranting / Complaining

                        The main problem with the no SL spawn that i've found is one which we all predicted.

                        run run run run run run

                        It mainly happens when you join a new squad, and on the two new ginormous maps (qinling and fools road). You join the game ready to play, join a squad, and maybe it's just cause people are so new, but there's nowhere to spawn. Last night, the two times I logged in to play, was all about running for 10 minutes to meet up with my squad. It could at the very least be set for newly joined squad members to spawn JUST ONCE on the first spawn of the game on the SL.

                        On the qinling and fools road maps i played, there were plenty of squads but at least half were locked without being full. There were almost no rally points on the map. There was a bunker but it was at a flag about 42 miles away from the nearest action. (None of this was on TG)

                        I couldnt get in TG, but in the 24/7 al basrah it was like bf2 vanilla noob fest 2008. People were doing mutiny votes as soon as someone became commander. They were swearing and being racist and homophobic over general chat. Teamkilling for vehicles. Shooting civs to be annoying.

                        I guess I forget the extent of the BS for the new releases, but I hope this will settle down. If I hadnt lost my ATM card last night I would be paying for a TG supporting membership right this second. I plan on giving .7 another couple weeks, but so far I give it a C-.

                        The new changes make the learning curve even higher. It gives the veterans (especially the tankers) an even huger advantage over the new guys. In DVB last night, the TF21 boys were single handledly steamrolling everyone with their annoyingly awesome (on the other team) tank skills.

                        What's up with the sniper rifle? I had the brit sniper zeroed on an enemy's head at 200 meters away and was shooting like a noob repeatedly trying to hit him. He was prone. It wasnt until he stood up that I was able to hit him.

                        I do like the no-spotting; among other things it really adds to the stealth ability, even if you get spotted. But no minimap? Comon now...and what the heck's the "reality" of having vehicle passengers have a minimap?

                        The squad is the most important thing in the game. My first round of .7 was in TG with some vets (warehouse, patterson, gumball, cougar, sorry cant remember the tg-irr who as SL) and it was playable. But even then it seemed like we were having trouble coordinating locations of enemies, etc, running around like chickens with our heads cut off. And then in other servers I was in squads where sqaudleaders didnt even have sound on! I spent the night squad hopping the few unlocked squads trying to find someone who understood what a rally point was. I finally started SLing even though I wanted more time as a grunt to learn the basics.

                        I think it really could do without the aiming deviation and lack of minimap. I sure hope this release doesnt decimate player base numbers...

                        sorry to waste everyone's time, I just had to vent a little.

                        GO [email protected][email protected]#@!
                        Last edited by TeflonDon; 01-03-2008, 01:47 PM. Reason: go pats
                        sigpic

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                        • #13
                          Re: My Ranting / Complaining

                          RE: the SL spawn function removed
                          I think this will be more tolerable after the commander asset bug is fixed. Then we'll have less distance to run in the event of a RP loss etc. However, I do like the OP idea about bringing back SL spawn but with an additional delay (of even up to 1-2 minutes or something) that way most of the time you would spawn at the RP, but if you had to do a major regroup in the event of a RP loss then you don't have to run all the way from main base. If we're talking 'reality', remember that rally points spawning (or respawning at all!) isn't realistic either.

                          RE: no mini-map
                          I'd really like to have the mini-map back (but without the squad dots or spotting markers on it).
                          Maybe not as realistic, but just to help reduce VOIP verbal diarrhoea - driving me crazy!

                          My tiny rant...
                          With 0.7, I think there has been a major barrier introduced to new players coming in with (1) Reduced spawn points, (2) No minimap, and (3) Increased weapon deviation - they assume the mod has worsened the hitreg box problem. IMO, PR is starting to tip over from fun to chore... gameflow sacrificed too much for the sake of chasing the 'realism' ideal. My rant over, I'll definitely keep playing PR to see how it pans out as the bugs get fixed and we players get used to the new version.

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                          • #14
                            Re: My Ranting / Complaining

                            Originally posted by TeflonDon View Post
                            ...there were plenty of squads but at least half were locked without being full.
                            This seems to be a big problem with the new version, I 've noticed this too on TG... 3 men squads and constant messages 'the maximum number of squads has been reached'. Guess this is what happens when you reduce the number of people needed for an RP to 3 (in total).

                            Originally posted by Nero View Post
                            If we're talking 'reality', remember that rally points spawning (or respawning at all!) isn't realistic either.
                            Yes, but this ressembles more the idea of reinforcements... unlike spawning right into the battle (ie. the panic room).
                            Xfire: Iaintyourm8 | Ingame: GhostDog | Steam: Zuigmijnballen

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                            • #15
                              Re: My Ranting / Complaining

                              SL spawns:
                              -Not being able to spawn on the squad leader has added a greater element of reality to this mod, & really does reinforce squad tactics and communication.
                              However, this seems to work better on the smaller maps such as Mestia, and completely SUCK on the huge maps that don't have sufficient air & ground transportation.

                              I think the DEV's should reconsider the large maps, and create more CQB style maps in the future.
                              |TG-X|WAREHOUSE

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