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  • Buzzing Topics on the realitymod forums

    I had the idea to have a thread similar to the 'Dev Update' threads, but with the focus on Discussion/Suggestion threads, for those who are interested in seeing some of the bigger gameplay suggestions/debates. Anyone can post a topic if they find one they think is a good look on the forums. Threads that are having lots of discussion, or threads that suggest big changes in gameplay, are great threads to post. (Also, don't be afraid to mention posts within a thread or link directly to the post, especially if they have a good point to bring to the discussion/suggestion and etc)




    Remove 'losing' from Insurgency

    Remove Lock-on Missles (AA & Jets)
    My post on the issue in the thread, suggesting changes to theAA's Lock-On HUD
    Last edited by Celestial1; 08-12-2009, 12:54 AM.

  • #2
    Re: Buzzing Topics on the realitymod forums

    Pilots are worth Tickets, not the Vehicle itself

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    • #3
      Re: Buzzing Topics on the realitymod forums

      Side comment: I don't like the removing winning from insurgency. Small goals like 'getting the most caches' can be made on a personal level.

      My two big suggestion threads since I think they would have a major and beneficial impact on the game:

      Command and Control revamp

      Separating the Civilian from the Collaborator

      I also suggested delayed bleed in the middle of another thread and was it was well received by lead mapper Rhino. Basically the bleed starts a while after a flag is captured, allowing the team to respond without having to throw tickets at it quickly.

      So on Kolzsek The Russians could be given 30 minutes to capture the first flag before a bleed is imposed, instead of the random ticket difference we ended up with on Mestia if the flag was capped quickly. Gives some time for organization without having a direct impact on the end of the game.

      On a large map like Kashan flags such as North Village could have a delayed bleed of say 20 minutes so that the attacker who secures the most flags for a long period of time would start to bleed out the defenders hiding on their last flag, but not kill the game right away by sneaking back to the rear flag. Outpost could have a shorter delay and main could then have instant bleed if pushed back that far. This would allow more offense on the offensive flags but allow the losing team a little time to fall back and regroup.
      |TG-6th|Snooggums

      Just because everyone does something does not mean that it is right to do.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Buzzing Topics on the realitymod forums

        I don't like the "no insurgency win" idea either. Many people dislike insurgency maps as they feel they are already overly long, drawn-out camp-fests. Making it more likely that the map gets played out to the timer end would just make matters worse.
        |TG-6th|Belhade
        "I am actually looking forward to watching Jon and Kate plus 8." - Dirtboy




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        • #5
          Re: Buzzing Topics on the realitymod forums

          The no "win" insurgency idea actually seems like it would make shorter games. Instead of getting a cache every 30 minutes the bluefor team would be trying to get them as quickly as possible and not sitting out in the desert for 30 minutes.
          |TG-69th|chrisweb89


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          • #6
            Re: Buzzing Topics on the realitymod forums

            Originally posted by chrisweb89 View Post
            The no "win" insurgency idea actually seems like it would make shorter games. Instead of getting a cache every 30 minutes the bluefor team would be trying to get them as quickly as possible and not sitting out in the desert for 30 minutes.
            Without an end goal most random pubbies will simply go for kills.
            |TG-6th|Snooggums

            Just because everyone does something does not mean that it is right to do.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Buzzing Topics on the realitymod forums

              Originally posted by chrisweb89 View Post
              The no "win" insurgency idea actually seems like it would make shorter games. Instead of getting a cache every 30 minutes the bluefor team would be trying to get them as quickly as possible and not sitting out in the desert for 30 minutes.
              And die needlessly, burning down tickets? You do have a point.
              |TG-6th|Belhade
              "I am actually looking forward to watching Jon and Kate plus 8." - Dirtboy




              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Buzzing Topics on the realitymod forums

                That was my take also. Here was my response minus the first few lines:

                The proposed idea only applies to the BluFor. Screw the BluFor, both teams need objectives, which they currently do. The current gameplay also allows for more organized approaches by not requiring the BluFor team to rush to the next cache like the proposed gamemode would have.

                If we want variety, there could be a random 8-12 possible caches win the game, so neither side knows how many remain, and just keep a destroyed cache counter available. Have the BluFor start with fewer tickets and get more per cache found: so start with say 100 tickets and get 20 (or 25 or 30) per cache found.

                Actually I like that and it would allow for a more random number of caches while keeping the game either exciting and ongoing or end when one side starts overpowering like AAS rewards for either team
                |TG-6th|Snooggums

                Just because everyone does something does not mean that it is right to do.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Buzzing Topics on the realitymod forums

                  Originally posted by chrisweb89 View Post
                  The no "win" insurgency idea actually seems like it would make shorter games. Instead of getting a cache every 30 minutes the bluefor team would be trying to get them as quickly as possible and not sitting out in the desert for 30 minutes.
                  There's a whole lot of 'seems like it would', simply because it opens up options just a little bit more. The team might be more reckless and run out of tickets on 2 caches but have an intense fight without feeling too 'downed' about it, or more strategic and manage +10 caches destroyed. Or, they could get a horrible stroke of luck or miscommunication or whathaveyou and have a miserable time playing.

                  The point of the thread was not to be suggested to actually be implemented directly into PR. I felt it was definitely a shakey, radical suggestion... But I kept it in the discussion area because I wanted to see how people felt about not having a straightforward 'win' message to go by as satisfaction for a job well done. A lot of players seem like they just find comfort in the immediate gratification of 'you won!' (and I'm not trying to imply anything against players, just telling it like it is.)

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                  • #10
                    Re: Buzzing Topics on the realitymod forums

                    Originally posted by Celestial1 View Post
                    A lot of players seem like they just find comfort in the immediate gratification of 'you won!' (and I'm not trying to imply anything against players, just telling it like it is.)
                    Yes. Life is like this. You dont see premier league footballist's losing but smiling because they had fun while getting their arses handed to them because they knew they did something critically wrong. You've got to appreciate that the majority of PR players live in capitilist countries, and so they must capitilize on others, via winning. Its human instinct to want to be the best, and that little "winning" sign is like a big hug for that instinct.

                    While it's lovely that you want to try and create some sort of "everybody's a winner" uptopia, everything has winner's and loser's. The allies won WW2 and David Beckham lost his intelligence. You should use losing as a way to better yourself, and by taking that away, you will probably halt the advancement of tactic's in PR, as everyone will be comptempt with not winning. If Winston Churchill had been comptempt with the failed Gallipoli landing's, D-Day would of followed the same suit. Losing's just about important as losing, and such is a neccesary evil.


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                    • #11
                      Re: Buzzing Topics on the realitymod forums

                      To some of the issues in the post about the pilots with tickets:

                      It'd be relatively easy to limit pilot kits per team. So if you have two jets and three helicopters (standard Kashan loadout) you'd only be able to get that amount of pilot kits on that team. This would also reduce the amount of people fighting over the assets, since if the kits were limited it would be impossible.

                      Perhaps an ejection system for jets could be devised that spawned another vehicle when the pilot hit eject 20-30 meters above the jet and placed him in it (ejection seat) so that the pilot wouldn't be crushed by the Jet if he ejected at high speed?

                      Also, if a pilot is only worth one ticket and a helicopter sent to rescue him five (plus pilot and gunner[s]), it's not worth rescuing the pilot. The pilot needs to be worth something to the team.

                      The 'Blufor not winning' thing.. Eh, mixed reviews. If you actually had multiple types of objectives instead of just hunting weapons caches on Insurgency, that would be interesting, such as giving the insurgents 5-6 times the tickets the Blufor has, with vehicles and collaborators costing no tickets when they're destroyed/killed. That way there would be multiple routes into winning an Insurgency map, either via total annihilation or destruction of all caches.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Buzzing Topics on the realitymod forums

                        Originally posted by Startrekern View Post
                        To some of the issues in the post about the pilots with tickets:

                        It'd be relatively easy to limit pilot kits per team. So if you have two jets and three helicopters (standard Kashan loadout) you'd only be able to get that amount of pilot kits on that team. This would also reduce the amount of people fighting over the assets, since if the kits were limited it would be impossible.

                        Griefers could simply request the kits and hide in a corner. Hello TKing for pilot kits.

                        Perhaps an ejection system for jets could be devised that spawned another vehicle when the pilot hit eject 20-30 meters above the jet and placed him in it (ejection seat) so that the pilot wouldn't be crushed by the Jet if he ejected at high speed?

                        Already noted as hardcoded by the Devs
                        The pilot kits are already useless for non pilots, there's no real reason to restrict them.
                        |TG-6th|Snooggums

                        Just because everyone does something does not mean that it is right to do.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Buzzing Topics on the realitymod forums

                          I think the rescuing will drain too many resources away from the main objective, which is winning the battlefield. with only 32 player's on a team, I think rescuing a pilot will contribute to losing because of the loss of man power needed to hold the objectives.

                          And the lock on removing seems a bit of unneeded unrealism, the current system of flaring and missles is fine in my opinion. The cannon usually acts as extra anti air ,times when you don't have enough time for a lock, when your very close or for ground attack.


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                          • #14
                            Re: Buzzing Topics on the realitymod forums

                            As a Pilot on Archer a couple days I ago I survived 3 crash landings. On one I was shot and killed by the technical that shot me down.

                            One time the squad I dropped off grabbed the humvee they were going for and picked me up for a return to base.

                            The third time I went down and walked back to main on my own avoiding the enemy.

                            Although the rescue was nice (and appreciated) I also don't see the reason to waste resources on a pilot rescue or to make a reason for one. It's just nice when it happens.
                            |TG-6th|Snooggums

                            Just because everyone does something does not mean that it is right to do.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Buzzing Topics on the realitymod forums

                              To me it wouldn't be as clear of a victory but you can still compare scores to your last round of insurgency. If my team got 3 caches one day and then the next day we got 13 I would call that second one a win. The idea blurs the line of winning a bit but I think the players would still know which team dominated.

                              P.S. Snooggums Namebot, me, and sandiford were in that mean techy that killed you on foot, It would've been nie to take you prisoner but we were a little trigger happy.
                              |TG-69th|chrisweb89


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