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  • Large FPS drop in .9 on .87 maps? Check in here

    First, my hardware/software for comparison, not top of the line but decent:
    * Operating System : Windows XP64 Service Pack 2 – fully updated, newest Direct X
    * CPU : AMD X2 4400+ - with AMD Dual Core Optimizer
    * Graphics Card : Nvidia GTS 250 [1GB VRAM] – newest drivers
    * Amount of RAM : 4 GB DDR2
    * Sound Card : Onboard Realtek AC97

    When I was testing, up to .906, I got pretty much the same FPS on the old maps as I did on .87, even on the maps with the new extra grass. When checking CPU and RAM usage I was using the same 80% on both cores and about 2GB of RAM/page file during play. I used the following PR settings for .87 and during beta testing of .9:
    BF2 Graphics Settings
    * Resolution :1440x900 (Widescreen)
    * Terrain : High
    * Effects : High
    * Geometry : High
    * Texture : Med
    * Lighting : High
    * Dynamic Shadows : High
    * Dynamic Light : High
    * Anti-Aliasing : 4x
    * Texture Filtering : High

    When I installed .9 on Saturday and loaded up Gaza I was expecting a range of 45-75 in the edges of the map and 25-35 in the city based on earlier testing. I realized that the interior of the city would hit the card like a ton of bricks.

    What I found instead was the minimum 15 FPS number using renderer.drawfps 1 in the console, and I could count a second between frames, I hit a max of 20 when looking outside the map from in the desert. I was puzzled. I quit out and turned some stuff down, reloaded in time for Iron Ridge, which I had raced with the other testers in after a session with 45-75 FPS in the trees. It was a slideshow at the NW starting base, I had a squad member drive and relived a vacation slideshow as I got less than 1FPS as we drove through the forest. I called it a night and saw others were having similar issues on the PR forums. I tried clearing my shaders, adjusting all of my PR settings etc to no effect.

    The next day I cranked every PR setting to low or off and loaded into Dragon Fly. Had a great round with my 15-20 FPS by not getting into a vehicle and following the map edge (it wasn’t just to be sneaky guys ;) ). Next map loaded, horrible FPS so I called it a night.

    After two more evenings of messing with PR settings I went into my video card settings as I had not adjusted them for some time. I made the following changes to my video card control center defaults and my frames have been restored to their previous rates:
    Turned on trilinear filtering.
    Turned Anti-Aliasing Transparency to Multisampling
    Turned on negative LOD bias to on
    Anistropic filtering to on
    Triple buffering to on

    I also set the Windows page file to a set equal min and max size per a suggestion for the rubber banding issues, which I was not able to determine if I was having due to low FPS. I may have adjusted another setting but I do not recall, I will fill out the rest of my settings when I get home this evening.

    After these steps I found I had excellent FPS so I turned my settings back up to their previous settings above. I even turned on 16x AA enhancement in my video card settings with no noticeable drops in frames.

    I believe one or more of those video card settings caused the massive frame drop for otherwise capable computers. I did not have a chance to turn them on and off individually to see if I could replicate the issue. If you have noticed a massive frame loss when going from .87 to .9 on the same maps (except Fallujah which is reported to have some actual map specific issues) please post your specs and video card settings, set them to match the set above and restart your computer and give those maps another try. The impact for me was going from 17 FPs on the Iron Ridge when first loaded (before choosing a weapon kit) to 65, Gaza from 15 FPS to 59. As I do not have rubber banding or CTD issues I’m primarily focused on the issues related to top end systems getting very low FPS as I can compare the information. The PR site is not collecting the video card settings and I know some TG players were having the low FPS issue, so I would like to present some feedback on this topic to the Dev team.

    Please use the template below and include all information you know:
    * Operating System :
    * CPU :
    * Graphics Card :
    * Amount of RAM :
    * Sound Card :
    BF2 Graphics Settings – Initial
    * Resolution :
    * Terrain :
    * Effects :
    * Geometry :
    * Texture :
    * Lighting :
    * Dynamic Shadows :
    * Dynamic Light :
    * Anti-Aliasing :
    * Texture Filtering :
    Video card settings - Initial
    Trilinear filtering:
    Anti-Aliasing Transparency:
    Negative LOD bias to on
    Anistropic filtering
    Triple buffering
    (list any additional setting options)

    Map –
    Initial FPS when map loaded -
    FPS while moving through map on foot -
    FPS while moving in vehicle -

    After changing the video card settings to match above:
    Initial FPS when map loaded -
    FPS while moving through map -
    FPS moving in vehicle -
    |TG-6th|Snooggums

    Just because everyone does something does not mean that it is right to do.

  • #2
    Re: Large FPS drop in .9 on .87 maps? Check in here

    Originally posted by snooggums View Post
    Turned on trilinear filtering.
    Turned Anti-Aliasing Transparency to Multisampling
    Turned on negative LOD bias to on
    Anistropic filtering to on
    Triple buffering to on
    btw, triple buffering only has an effect if Vsync is on, I believe. If Vsync is on, your framerate is capped at 60 (assuming you're using an LCD; it actually caps at your monitor's refresh rate, which in an LCD is 60 Hz) and if you are not able to run at 60 fps your fps will drop dramatically, more so than without vsync on. The reasoning for this is that vsync tries to prevent frames from rendering over each other and causing the screen to 'tear', where something on the top of the picture will be at a different location than in the bottom, and a visible line of un-connected graphic will exist. Most noticeable in regards to helicopter rotors. I forget exactly how it works, but I know it will go down in framerate on certain increments; 60 fps is good, but 55 fps is not, so it will lower the framerate further to attempt to reach a rate where the screen does not 'tear'. Triple buffering helps optimize this process.
    If you can, ensure that Vsync is off. (I'm just giving a paraphrase of how Vsync works, mind you...)

    Negative LOD bias might be worth some testing; the other settings all regard anti-aliasing (jagged edge smoothing) and anisotropic filtering (using higher definition texture maps for objects farther away from you).

    You might just want to try reverting those settings one at a time, it might help to figure out what effects are having the biggest effect on performance.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Large FPS drop in .9 on .87 maps? Check in here

      Originally posted by Celestial1 View Post
      stuff about vsync
      Mostly correct.
      V-sync is based on monitor refresh rate, generally matching the desktop for most applications. My monitor's native resolution goes up to 75 FPS, which is why all of my numbers top out at that amount. Having triple buffering and V-sync on does not reduce FPS in most applications, it simply limits it to that max refresh rate, and for me a non-tearing 75 or lower FPS is much more desirable than a 75+tearing image so I always have it on since I simply see the torn image no matter how high the FPS is. I turned v-sync off when I had the low FPS and it made no difference, but the triple buffering was apparently not on. Turning off v-sync really doesn't do anything for those that are below their monitor's refresh rate.

      As a curiosity, would a system restore reset the graphic card settings to the day restored?
      |TG-6th|Snooggums

      Just because everyone does something does not mean that it is right to do.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Large FPS drop in .9 on .87 maps? Check in here

        System Specifications:
        Operating System : Windows 7 64-bit
        CPU : Core 2 Quad @ 2.4GHz
        Graphics Card : NVIDIA GeForce GTX 8800 (512mb)
        Amount of RAM : 2GB DDR2
        Sound Card : Onboard

        BF2 Graphics Settings
        Resolution : 1920x1200
        Terrain : High
        Effects : High
        Geometry : High
        Texture : High
        Lighting : High
        Dynamic Shadows : High
        Dynamic Light : High
        Anti-Aliasing : x8
        Texture Filtering : LOW
        View Distance: 98%

        Video card settings (NVIDIA)
        Force on the application: On
        Trilinear filtering: On
        Negative LOD bias: Allow
        Anistropic filtering: 16X
        Triple buffering: On
        Vsync: Off
        (All the rest is max out with new NVIDIA Drivers)


        Don't forget to delete your video cash (My documents/BF2/...) and I did double the size of my windows cash file.

        All bold items are what I changed. Before I did thoses changes I had huge lag spikes and some rubber banding. Now it's very good, some minor lags but it's basicly like Pr 0.87 and I can't tell the difference in the graphic quality.

        Hope it works for you to!

        Cheers,
        Nix

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Large FPS drop in .9 on .87 maps? Check in here

          Originally posted by snooggums View Post
          As a curiosity, would a system restore reset the graphic card settings to the day restored?
          It should.



          Vsync doesn't reduce fps in applications, but it forcefully sets the fps to a non-tearing rate that can match the monitors refresh rate (I used 60 since that's the majority of LCD refresh rates, as you'll see I specified in the parentheses near the beginning of my explanation). Here's an example, in theory:

          Vsync off:
          Steady 75 fps.
          JDAM goes off, fps reduces to 50.

          Vsync on:
          Steady 75 fps
          JDAM goes off, fps reduces to 50. Vsync determines that this fps will cause tearing, and so forcefully sets the fps to the next highest fps that will eliminate tearing (if 40 was the next highest, your framerate will be capped at 40 until you can reach a higher matching frame rate).

          So, in effect, VSync will cause your frame rates to drop at a much faster rate. Triple buffering helps to try to prevent this. I don't know how it would figure what is the next highest, but assuming that those numbers were the correct ones it would function in that manner.

          (Note, I believe that if you simply do a game.lockfps ##, matching the monitor refresh rate, you'll avoid these effects and still eliminate tearing. For example, if you're running steadily above 60 fps but don't want to have this problem, you can set game.lockfps 60, and you will only experience tearing when you go below 60 fps.)

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Large FPS drop in .9 on .87 maps? Check in here

            Snoogums, I had a similar issue with ArmA: 10fps in forested areas. After turning super sampling off I went to 40fps. Transparency AA is a killer if set to super sampling. See here for a nice write-up.

            DB

            «That looks like a really nice house except for that horrible bathroom.» Donrhos

            | |





            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Large FPS drop in .9 on .87 maps? Check in here

              Would be nice to see some guys with ATI cards to post their settings aswell.




              TG-6th|Almightylion

              "It's feedom for everybody or freedom for nobody"" - Malcolm X

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Large FPS drop in .9 on .87 maps? Check in here

                Originally posted by AlmightyLion View Post
                Would be nice to see some guys with ATI cards to post their settings aswell.
                System Specifications:
                Operating System : Windows 7 64-bit
                CPU : E8500 @ 4.1 GHz
                Graphics Card : ATi Radeon 4780x2 (2gb) (Stock clocks) @ Catalys 10.1 (Might be comperable to one 4780 1gb, I have not checked out if both cores are used in BF2).
                Amount of RAM : 4gb DDR2
                Sound Card : Creative X-fi Music

                BF2 Graphics Settings
                Resolution : 1920x1200
                Terrain : High
                Effects : High
                Geometry : High
                Texture : High
                Lighting : High
                Dynamic Shadows : High
                Dynamic Light : High
                Anti-Aliasing : x2
                Texture Filtering : High
                View Distance: 98%

                Video card settings (ATi)
                Force on the application: No (AA doesn't work unless it's BF2's own)
                Trilinear filtering: ? (No option)
                Negative LOD bias: ? (No option)
                Anistropic filtering: 16X
                Triple buffering: Off
                Vsync: Off
                Adaptive AA: Off
                Catalys AI: Advanced (a must for dual core graphics)


                Performance:

                Lashkar
                being 1/4 mapside from the centre looking into centre:
                40fps

                Yamalia
                Zooming in @ grassfields 120fps drops to 30.
                Walking among the trees = 200fps.
                Flying over the grassfield = 200fps


                Korengal
                Looking out on the Valley from US main = 30 fps (like 70 in 0.874[Outpost then])
                Startscreen also overlocks the Valley, there I get ~90fps.

                Fools Road:
                70-100fps+ (Unchanged)

                Qwai
                60-100fps+ (Slightly lower)

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Large FPS drop in .9 on .87 maps? Check in here

                  * Operating System : Win Media Center 2005 (pretty much a crappier version of XP)
                  * CPU : AMD Athlon 64 X2 Dual Core Processor 5000+, ~2.6GHz
                  * Graphics Card : Radeon HD 4670 512MB
                  * Amount of RAM : 2GB DDR2
                  * Sound Card : SoundBlaster X-Fi XtremeMusic
                  BF2 Graphics Settings – Initial
                  * Resolution :1440x900
                  * Terrain : High
                  * Effects : High
                  * Geometry : High
                  * Texture : Med
                  * Lighting : High
                  * Dynamic Shadows : High
                  * Dynamic Light : High
                  * Anti-Aliasing : x2
                  * Texture Filtering : High
                  * View Distance: 100%
                  Video card settings - Initial
                  Trilinear filtering: dunno
                  Anti-Aliasing Transparency: - dunno
                  Negative LOD bias to on - dunno
                  Anistropic filtering - dunno
                  Triple buffering - dunno
                  (list any additional setting options)

                  Map –
                  Gaza - 15-30fps
                  Yamilia 30-60fps
                  Not sure about the rest

                  All maps are playable for me. FPS 'lag' does really not effect me too much. The only 'lag' I get is from TG serverside.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Large FPS drop in .9 on .87 maps? Check in here

                    I was wondering when the last time TG upgraded the PR server? I ask because I hear from other players that performance issues are more evident at TG. I don't know personally because I rarely play outside of TG. I just want know if it's time for a server upgrade?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Large FPS drop in .9 on .87 maps? Check in here

                      I don't really have any framerate problems in .9, the only problem I have is crashing after loading 2 maps when textures are on High. I have to turn it to medium and then it looks ugly.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Large FPS drop in .9 on .87 maps? Check in here

                        System Specifications
                        • Operating System : Vista 32 SP2
                        • CPU : P4 3.2Ghz (800 FSB) OC'd ~3.368Ghz (842 FSB) LGA 775 socket
                        • Graphics Card : GeForce 9400 GT PCIe x16 512MB
                        • Amount of RAM : 4 GB DDR2 PC2-5300
                        • Sound Card : Realtek ALC882


                        BF2 Graphics Settings
                        • Resolution :1920x1080

                        • Terrain : low
                        • Effects : low
                        • Geometry : low
                        • Texture : low
                        • Lighting : low
                        • Dynamic Shadows : off
                        • Dynamic Light : off
                        • Anti-Aliasing : off
                        • Texture Filtering : low
                        • View Distance: 98%


                        Staring at a wall FPS: ~45
                        Walking around FPS: ~3 - ~18

                        Quite unplayable. I'll probably be MIA playing empire total way until there's a patch.
                        |TG-Irr| Dreadnought
                        sigpic


                        If the radiance of a thousand suns were to burst at once into the sky, that would be like the splendor of the Mighty One --
                        I am become Death, the shatterer of Worlds.

                        -J. Robert Oppenheimer, lead scientist of Manhattan Project quoting Bhagavad Gita

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Large FPS drop in .9 on .87 maps? Check in here

                          Originally posted by Dreadnought View Post
                          System Specifications
                          Staring at a wall FPS: ~45
                          Walking around FPS: ~3 - ~18

                          Quite unplayable. I'll probably be MIA playing empire total way until there's a patch.
                          Did you try the settings above on multiple maps? Is your main processor maxed out? You really should be able to get at least 30 FPS in most open areas (without buildings) with your card and RAM.
                          |TG-6th|Snooggums

                          Just because everyone does something does not mean that it is right to do.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Large FPS drop in .9 on .87 maps? Check in here

                            Originally posted by snooggums View Post
                            Did you try the settings above on multiple maps? Is your main processor maxed out? You really should be able to get at least 30 FPS in most open areas (without buildings) with your card and RAM.
                            Just Gaza Beach. I know this is one of the more taxing maps, but if I have to pick and choose my maps, I'd rather play some other game.


                            Another striking find! Both GPUz and EVGA Precision claim when I'm in the middle of the city and bottomed out at 15.0 FPS, that I'm only using 15%-25% of my GPU!?! However when I'm in Israeli main staring into the hills I get 80 FPS with 95% GPU usage. Then without moving an inch, I turn toward the city while still in main, and my FPS goes down to 33 and my usage goes down to 25%.
                            Everything was using ~65%-75% CPU.

                            Could it be that terrain was using my full GPU (16 cores) and that buildings were only attempting to use 1 or 4?
                            Could the problem be that PR is trying to render terrain with 100% CPU and objects with
                            |TG-Irr| Dreadnought
                            sigpic


                            If the radiance of a thousand suns were to burst at once into the sky, that would be like the splendor of the Mighty One --
                            I am become Death, the shatterer of Worlds.

                            -J. Robert Oppenheimer, lead scientist of Manhattan Project quoting Bhagavad Gita

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Large FPS drop in .9 on .87 maps? Check in here

                              The 98% view distance, and perhaps the increased pagefile, seem to have helped me.

                              Except on Korengal, of course.
                              |TG-6th|Belhade
                              "I am actually looking forward to watching Jon and Kate plus 8." - Dirtboy




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